Allow transmutation liquid dirt to rock

[Niki 2,278]

Basically title, but let me explain. Have you ever lived on a rock-free deed? Maybe it was coastal or land raised from the ocean, wouldn't you like the ability to have a cave nearby? Possibly, maybe transmutation rod some iron? Exactly. You would, and so would I.

 

This should be super hard to craft. 70 NS+ require a bunch of mats and stuff. 

 

Thanks. 

 

don't forget this is a 'magical sandbox game' so limiting sorcery and alchemy makes no sense.

 

[Ostentatio 1,970]

Converting dirt to rock like that raises the rock layer dramatically, which
1) is extremely powerful in a way that may or may not be wanted

2) creates extremely drastic slopes in the rock layer. I'm not really sure how well the game handles that?

[Niki 2,278]

36 minutes ago, Ostentatio said:

Converting dirt to rock like that raises the rock layer dramatically, which
1) is extremely powerful in a way that may or may not be wanted

2) creates extremely drastic slopes in the rock layer. I'm not really sure how well the game handles that?

Depending on the sea level it should use more materials, if I convert a dirt tile a few tiles above water it should be cheaper than 100-200 dirt above water.

 

Concrete will still have a use.

Edited August 8, 2019 by Niki

[Flubb 773]

2 hours ago, Ostentatio said:

creates extremely drastic slopes in the rock layer. I'm not really sure how well the game handles that?

 

What if it didn't act like a common transmutation liquid, but more like dirt being dropped? Amount and quality = N "dirts" raised on the existing rock layer/"dropped" on each corner. Eventually, just liked with dropped dirt, it will "flow off", so the resulting layer will be more natural. This would also implement OPs proposal of increased cost per depth. (It'd do that without flowing off, too, but the tall rock layer spikes would indeed be bothersome)

 

Your first concern is kinda vague so I'm not sure how to address that to be honest, but as long as it's absurdly expensive, and perhaps nerfed for PvP, would it be all that bad?

[armyskin 930]

I still believe that loosening the restrictions set on concrete currently is the way to go, but I agree with Flubb.

[whereami 564]

I have to second Army on loosening concrete restrictions, and maybe even making it easier to mass produce as currently it is a significant pain if you need a couple thousand or more.

 

Would have to -1 for allowing trans liquid to do this, since concrete already serve that purpose and is relatively abuse-case-free as things stand now.

Having trans liquids that work in this fashion could have highly undesirable consequences, especially when they inevitably make their way into the PvP scene.

 

After I've built my 300 slope dirt walls, now let me just turn them into solid rock by dropping some trans liquid, and after that I'll mine through the inside and reinforce both sides of the tunnel to make an un-mine-able and un-lower-able, basically impenetrable wall around my deed. Yeah, no.

Sounds pretty freaking broken if you ask me.

Edited August 8, 2019 by whereami

[Ostentatio 1,970]

48 minutes ago, Flubb said:

What if it didn't act like a common transmutation liquid, but more like dirt being dropped? Amount and quality = N "dirts" raised on the existing rock layer/"dropped" on each corner. Eventually, just liked with dropped dirt, it will "flow off", so the resulting layer will be more natural. This would also implement OPs proposal of increased cost per depth. (It'd do that without flowing off, too, but the tall rock layer spikes would indeed be bothersome)

 

I like this, although I do think it should require significant expense. I've never liked the idea of modifying the rock layer being easy.

[Locath 533]

Going by what happens in WU when you change dirt to rock on a thick layer of dirt, this causes a lot of weird behaviour but if it added say 40 slope to adjacent tiles until it reaches the original rock layer then it might work. I'm not sure if that could allow for un-penetrable deeds on PvP though, not sure if transmutation liquids even work there so this might not be an issue.

"unreasonable" or "absurd" cost is not a solution, we all know people who did something nobody else would consider because of the cost or risk.

Some mechanic in place to stop people from making a 40 slope mound and then surface-mining it to 300 slope would be needed, maybe a maximum height the liquid can be used at? So that it's only used for the proposed purpose, e.g. making a mine on an island which otherwise has no rock layer above water level? Basically can make rock layer if there isn't one at 50 dirt above water level but if there is one return a message "just keep diggin' you lazy ass" or something?

[armyskin 930]

6 minutes ago, Locath said:

maybe a maximum height the liquid can be used at? So that it's only used for the proposed purpose, e.g. making a mine on an island which otherwise has no rock layer above water level? Basically can make rock layer if there isn't one at 50 dirt above water level but if there is one return a message "just keep diggin' you lazy ass" or something?

^this. Particularity the part where the game calls you a lazy ass. Seriously though, the height limit makes a lot of sense if the reason this mechanic is added is for the adding of mines to lowlands.

[Niki 2,278]

27 minutes ago, Locath said:

Going by what happens in WU when you change dirt to rock on a thick layer of dirt, this causes a lot of weird behaviour but if it added say 40 slope to adjacent tiles until it reaches the original rock layer then it might work. I'm not sure if that could allow for un-penetrable deeds on PvP though, not sure if transmutation liquids even work there so this might not be an issue.

"unreasonable" or "absurd" cost is not a solution, we all know people who did something nobody else would consider because of the cost or risk.

Some mechanic in place to stop people from making a 40 slope mound and then surface-mining it to 300 slope would be needed, maybe a maximum height the liquid can be used at? So that it's only used for the proposed purpose, e.g. making a mine on an island which otherwise has no rock layer above water level? Basically can make rock layer if there isn't one at 50 dirt above water level but if there is one return a message "just keep diggin' you lazy ass" or something?

this would never enter pvp servers because of those concerns

[Retrograde 12,013]

This isn't going to be added because of the huge damaging impact on the rock layer, but I have raised the adjustment of the concrete limit mentioned in here. 

[Wargasm 1,927]

-1

[Niki 2,278]

55 minutes ago, Retrograde said:

This isn't going to be added because of the huge damaging impact on the rock layer, but I have raised the adjustment of the concrete limit mentioned in here. 

better than nothing i guess, thanks.

[Flubb 773]

8 hours ago, Retrograde said:

This isn't going to be added because of the huge damaging impact on the rock layer, but I have raised the adjustment of the concrete limit mentioned in here. 

 

And with my proposed adjustment? It'd be subject to the same slope restriction like concrete, but could be used without having to dig up everything, which is unfeasible on a dirt island. Basically a more expensive version of concrete that only bypasses the dirt and "can't use underwater" restriction.

10 hours ago, Ostentatio said:

 

I like this, although I do think it should require significant expense. I've never liked the idea of modifying the rock layer being easy.

Could use electrum for the metal counterpart, to make it especially painful to get lots of mass, and further difficult to get it in high QL. And use up lye aswell as the same amount of fruit juice...I'm all for making this stupidly expensive, because even with the "flow off" it'd be stupidly powerful. Ideally artificial restrictions like "only within x dirts of water level" would not be required because just digging up the rock layer and applying concrete would be more feasible for most cases.

But even lifting the underwater restriction won't enable someone to make an island with an accessible rock layer because you potentially cannot even expose the rock layer to begin with?

 

Perhaps it's really easier altogether to buff concrete and allow deeper dredging somehow if you want to be so mad as to build a functioning island from zero.

Edited August 9, 2019 by Flubb

[Niki 2,278]

each concrete should raise the tile by 1 on all corners.

[M0rok 0]

Noot good idea. Will ne disbalance on pvp.