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Gwyn

Change How Deed Disbands Are Announced

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Currently, the moment a deed disbands, a green-text announcement appears in the 'event' tab and the info goes to Niarja for all to see. This leads to salvagers swooping down immediately on the deeds to loot them, camp them with alts, and/or lock them down in various ways to block access to other players. In essence, it's not at all unlike what happens with uniques.

 

Suggested Change

Instead of announcing disbands automatically the moment upkeep runs out, let them disband quietly. An announcement is still made, but not until a player actually steps onto the former territory of the disbanded deed (example event message: 'Player X reports that Deed Y is no more. It disbanded on ...').

 

Not only does this feel more natural, to me at least, it gives everyone a better chance of stumbling onto the ruins of an old settlement, which for me was some of the most fun I've ever had in Wurm. Even if only for the prestige of being the one to discover the disband (and see one's name in green text), this would give players more reason to venture off deed and explore.

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Better to make a disbanded deed a no-build zone for some time. Would also be a griefing prevention. 

 

Plus announce the location of every disbanded deed to give people the same chance.

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-1.

 

If you want to discover abandoned deeds at your own pace and maybe a few uniques you can always roam around Xanadu.  On smaller servers someone may be waiting to expand their deed with the new land that becomes available and not want to wait for a no-build zone to disappear. 

 

Quote

Better to make a disbanded deed a no-build zone for some time. Would also be a griefing prevention. 

 

Any suggestion of a no-build zone in a sandbox game, especially wurm, is asinine and lazy.

Edited by madnezz
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4 minutes ago, madnezz said:

-1.

 

If you want to discover abandoned deeds at your own pace and maybe a few uniques you can always roam around Xanadu.  On smaller servers someone may be waiting to expand their deed with the new land that becomes available and not want to wait for a no-build zone to disappear. 

 

Any suggestion of a no-build zone in a sandbox game, especially wurm, is asinine and lazy.

 

I think you might be lost. There is nothing in my suggestion about a no-build zone.

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4 hours ago, Gwyn said:

 lock them down in various ways to block access to other players.

If you see that happen, then report it couse that aint alloud

(if they block it for other player, they also block it for the owner)

Edited by Maiya

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3 minutes ago, Maiya said:

If you see that happen, then report it couse that aint alloud

(if they block it for other player, they also block it for the owner)

 

I beg to differ.  Such tactics are perfectly legal.

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1 minute ago, Wargasm said:

 

I beg to differ.  Such tactics are perfectly legal.

Is that rule changed then?

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There is no rule that states that it is illegal for me to build walls around your disbanded deed.

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2 minutes ago, Wargasm said:

There is no rule that states that it is illegal for me to build walls around your disbanded deed.

 

 
Quote

 

  9 minutes ago, Maiya said:

If you see that happen, then report it couse that aint alloud

(if they block it for other player, they also block it for the owner)

 

I was talking about blocking the deed 

And here is the rule I was talking about 

Quote

Play Nice Or We Will Rip Your Heart Out (griefing)
Definition: Activities that are not constructive and with deliberate intent to do harm to others.
A ) You may not block access to deeds, merchants, or structures not belonging to you.

 

You can see it all here

 

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4 minutes ago, Wargasm said:

There is no rule that states that it is illegal for me to build walls around your disbanded deed.

"A ) You may not block access to deeds, merchants, or structures not belonging to you."

 

if there's any buildings still standing yes it's against the rules.

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That derailed quickly.

 

Posts related to the OP welcome; others, not so much.

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19 minutes ago, Gwyn said:

That derailed quickly.

 

Posts related to the OP welcome; others, not so much.

Yah sry about that but think its importend our rules comes out to those not knowing them .)

as for the suggestion:

for me I would like to still have the announcing disband auto the moment upkeep runs out,

couse then if ally members are out of game for a while, other ally member can help salvage  the good stuff and hold on to untill they comes back.

So it wont be looted from others

 

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The rule applies to structures and deeds.  It is no longer a deed because it disbanded, and you made no mention of structures.  The "play nice" rule allows the staff to enforce unwritten rules, and justifies their ability to discipline as they see fit from malicious player actions that aren't specifically listed in the rules.

 

All that being said, there are people that play this game for no reason other than to steal other people's stuff.  Am I in support of removing the green event message "Deed X has been disbanded"?  ABSOLUTELY.  Anything that makes it harder for the deed looting scumbags has my full support.

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27 minutes ago, Wargasm said:

The rule applies to structures and deeds.  It is no longer a deed because it disbanded, and you made no mention of structures.  The "play nice" rule allows the staff to enforce unwritten rules, and justifies their ability to discipline as they see fit from malicious player actions that aren't specifically listed in the rules.

 

All that being said, there are people that play this game for no reason other than to steal other people's stuff.  Am I in support of removing the green event message "Deed X has been disbanded"?  ABSOLUTELY.  Anything that makes it harder for the deed looting scumbags has my full support.

 

 

How is it anyone else's fault if your deed disbands?  Are you supposed to wait till everything of value decays before you salvage items from a deed disbanded?  If you see something laying on the ground off deed do you just ignore it since you abhor deed looting scumbags? 

 

 Its a pretty clear indication when a deed disbands that the people in the village aren't really playing the game at that deed location considering they get 30 days worth of village messages alerting them to put in upkeep.  Deed it or Lose it!

Edited by madnezz
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23 minutes ago, madnezz said:

 

 

How is it anyone else's fault if your deed disbands?  Are you supposed to wait till everything of value decays before you salvage items from a deed disbanded?  If you see something laying on the ground off deed do you just ignore it since you abhor deed looting scumbags? 

 

 Its a pretty clear indication when a deed disbands that the people in the village aren't really playing the game at that deed location considering they get 30 days worth of village messages alerting them to put in upkeep.  Deed it or Lose it!

This

 

If someone lets his deed disbanded, then mostly is couse this person and his villagers does not care anymore.

 

Of course we can imagine situation when someone gets into hospital and is unconsious or without access to computer and cannot ask anyone to pay upkeep and do not have any villagers that could add something to upkeep but well : )

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On 6/22/2019 at 4:28 AM, Gwyn said:

'Player X reports that Deed Y is no more. It disbanded on ...'

 

If this change were to be moved forward I'd love to see it done this way.

 

Wurm has always been about discovery by players and I feel that this would be a natural evolution of the current system.

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On 6/22/2019 at 12:24 PM, madnezz said:

 

 

How is it anyone else's fault if your deed disbands?  Are you supposed to wait till everything of value decays before you salvage items from a deed disbanded?  If you see something laying on the ground off deed do you just ignore it since you abhor deed looting scumbags? 

 

 Its a pretty clear indication when a deed disbands that the people in the village aren't really playing the game at that deed location considering they get 30 days worth of village messages alerting them to put in upkeep.  Deed it or Lose it!

 

I'm only dignifying this with a response to clarify my previous post.  Not everyone that loots deed ruins is a scumbag.

 

The scumbag is the one who makes a full time job out of deed looting, whose daily routine consists of the following:

1.  Carries a satchel in his inventory with large nails with him at all times for such occaisions.

2.  Has personally notated map dumps of his/her area of the server containing detailed information about deed locations that aren't on the public map on the respective server forum.

3.  Routinely patrols above mentioned deeds, looking for damage on almost a daily basis.

4.  Finds a deed with damaged walls, marks it on his calendar, knows to come back in 29 days.

5.  Deed disbands, but scumbag is waiting with 3+ wagons a day early.

6.  Builds a 1x1 house in the middle of your village and proceeds to load/push/pull/place every BSB with anything of value into said house that cannot be carried home in the aforementioned 3+ wagons.

7.  Sees something shiny in one of your still decaying houses so he drops a deed specifically to put your house in perimeter to make it decay faster.

 

 

 

Edited by Wargasm

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Again, deed it or lose it.  Salvagers reduce the clutter and extra items on servers, like it or not they are contributing to the health of the game.

Edited by madnezz
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There is no problem here that needs fixing.

On 6/22/2019 at 3:28 AM, Gwyn said:

Currently, the moment a deed disbands, a green-text announcement appears in the 'event' tab and the info goes to Niarja for all to see. This leads to salvagers swooping down immediately on the deeds to loot them, camp them with alts, and/or lock them down in various ways to block access to other players. In essence, it's not at all unlike what happens with uniques.

To block access to other players, yet those other players are also folks who are looking to loot the deed, and have just as much an equal chance as anyone else to loot.

Unlike uniques, the disbanding of a deed isn't meant to be a community event where everyone should get something. It is simply the outcome of failure to pay for upkeep.

 

Even someone that makes a full time job of deed looting isn't a scumbag either. If that is what they want to spend their time on then that is fine, they have as much a right to the items that are left behind as anyone else. The only anger comes from sources who didn't happen to get there first. The deed disbanding won't be using it's contents anymore, so why not let those that are still paying for the game make use of them.

 

This is truly a case of deed it or lose it.

-1

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Shrimp-D telling us who is and isn't a scumbag. Love the irony there.

-1 tho becuz I like looting ur deeds k bye

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another man's trash is another man's treasure... deed looting is fun.. means i dont have to waste my time doing the stuff i just salvaged from ruins.. if i make few coppers out of it.. who cares.. i am happy and i keep spending more money in the game.

 

win-win, plus the fact that it would go waste and also clutter perfectly good spot for someone else.

 

Althought i like the idea of the said person who stumbles upon the deed makes the disband notification.. but still...

 

-1

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I think generally notifications are bad for the game. So agree on removing them, for uniques and deeds...

I love looting old disbanded deeds that I stumble upon during my travellings. But when a notification happens and people rush immediately it's not fun at all to camp with 5 other people, expecialy if competition about figuring ways to block other looters start... I believe that who ever of campers is on in the right time by luck should get loot, if you're crazy enough to be online and monitoring 24/7 oh well. But building houses around decaying houses, fences and such is too much. We should have some sort of honour code on freedom for situations like this not go all the way pvp and use every trick we can in fight for loot, or atleast clear statement from GMs that everything within game mechanics is allowed atleast.

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Reading the replies, I get the sense my suggestion has been largely misunderstood. Let me take responsibility for that and set the record straight: the suggested change is pro-salvage. By all means, players should recycle useful stuff abandoned by those gone AWOL. In fact, the whole point of this suggestion is to make the salvage experience just a bit more likely to happen for everyone. The current auto-announcement of disbands incentivizes a dreary style of metagaming and excludes players who are unwilling to engage in it by tracking deed locations, planting alts, setting alarms, keeping calendars, etc. By making the announcement trigger only when the deed area is visited post-disband, more casual players will at least have a chance of stumbling onto an El Dorado. Hardcore salvagers would still have ways to secure an advantage (and arguably they should), but the advantage would not be as huge and exclusionary as it is now.

 

TL;DR Salvage good; rewarding salvage metagaming bad.

Edited by Gwyn
punctuation
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