Posted May 9, 2019 (edited) Here is something recent Apparently capes were showcased in a random stream, something that we've had placeholders for ever since the new character window screen. So why aren't you or any other devs talking about it? Why aren't there news about them? Why do we have to find out about them in a random stream by a player, in a random thread? I purposely waited for the next devblog, thinking that you might mention it, there, perhaps announce it, but that did not happen. Again, this lack of sharing news and other information regarding upcoming features with the community, is what everyone is upset about in this thread. Edited May 9, 2019 by atazs 6 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 9, 2019 So many things wrong with current flow of the game currently, it's depressing to me and I've genuinely stopped caring. As a customer I feel like wasting money on premium sometimes. Honeyed words wont keep us forever. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 9, 2019 10 minutes ago, atazs said: Here is something recent Apparently capes were showcased in a random stream, something that we've had placeholders for ever since the new character window screen. So why aren't you or any other devs talking about it? Why aren't there news about them? Why do we have to find out about them in a random stream by a player, in a random thread? I purposely waited for the next devblog, thinking that you might mention it, there, perhaps announce it, but that did not happen. Again, this lack of sharing news and other information regarding upcoming features with the community, is what everyone is upset about in this thread. This this right here Clearly capes are close enough to release now to show it off on the wurm teams favorite wurm stream yet not close enough to "speak peak" post a few teaser pictures up to please the curious people about whats going on behind the scenes ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 9, 2019 Capes are live now, we purposely aren't showing them to give those who get them first bragging rights. The only reason it turned up is a silly auto equip feature! 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 9, 2019 48 minutes ago, Retrograde said: Capes are live now, we purposely aren't showing them to give those who get them first bragging rights. The only reason it turned up is a silly auto equip feature! Because not talking about new features and just giving people "bragging rights" its a sound strategy. Not to burst your bubble, but you can always talk about it and what they do, what variety will there be, or how they will affect the game (showcase them) while at the same time not showing a picture. But nope! Players find out by mousing over the new journal entry. *Slow clap* 7 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 9, 2019 What people would like to see: "we have worked out how to implement -THIS-. The way we see it will work best would be: - those are the the triggers. - this will be the skills required. - this will be the formula for calculating -IT'S- effect power. - those permissions will be affected. - aaaand discuss!" Here comes the bit where people comment on the idea before it even reaches the test environment, maybe have some better ideas which would be easier to implement? maybe majority doesn't care for the change at all? Maybe they start arguing which will cause more attention gain from people who didn't notice the proposed change and they weigh in as well? Maybe, just maybe, users say that this is completely unnecessary and things are best the way they are now? At least people have an illusion of having something to say about the game they loyally supported through it's roughest times, all ups and downs over the years, wurmageddon, personal issues with other players or staff. The audience here for most part aren't customers who want to move on to the next new, flashy game with explosions and a Game Over screen in 2 months. You have a loyal player base who is supporting you all those years. What happens currently: "we have worked out how to implement -THIS- - this is a picture." Here comes all the post facto grief about the idea which was discussed by a total of 3 or 4 people internally but will forever affect thousands of current and future users. Nobody really knows how -THIS- should work, all we know is guesses and wurmpedia which a lot of the time is wrong because it's maintained by us, players, without any meaningful details around the subject to back it up with for most part. Until this day i don't know if alloys should be losing quality when repaired but i asked 3 times about that in CA Help while staff members were active, they replied to other people's questions but not mine. If i could trust wurmpedia i would assume it is in fact a bug because the quality drop on repairing being lowered by skill is mentioned there (not even the fact of repairing lowering the quality, just that skill affects something) but we can't trust it any more than we can trust a random person in local to answer the exact same question. After all, that person could have wrote the 'pedia article for all i know. I will bring up the example of headbob again (yes, yes, i know, it took 12 minutes to code...). A change which affects every single player at the time of it's release wasn't announced, wasn't in the test client, wasn't in the Valrei International, it was just dumped on couple of hundred of players on a whim. I have seen a total of one player who said that he likes it and that could have been said just to suck up to the staff members who were present at the time. This is exactly why more and more people are realizing their Stockholm Syndrome isn't that strong after all and that they can actually break free and be better off not playing any game at all rather than having this kind of stuff pulled on them yet again. This is exactly why i didn't pay my premiums in a couple of months on any of the toons. I'm still paying the upkeep for one of the deeds but the rest will just disband once the upkeep monies end. If my main deed wasn't "unsellable" as i was told, that would be gone as well. Yes, i'm a sufferer of the Stockholm Syndrome as well. I sympathize with my captors (Wurm) even though it's very unhealthy for me. FIX IT! 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 9, 2019 Rather not comment on rest.. but.. I'd love a wogic-free wurm, as fun wogic could be at times.. stress and drama-free gameplay sounds a lot more fun. If it matters count my vote for just that. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 9, 2019 News via being forced to watch long streams or hope someone that isn't even staff posts it while also being forced to "explore" to find out how to use updates or that there even was an update are great methods of keeping the playerbase happy and excited 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 9, 2019 2 hours ago, Angelklaine said: Players find out by mousing over the new journal entry. I found out by watching the file names when the patcher was running thank you Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 9, 2019 Honestly I'd rather just screenshot it being in my inventory, it looks too bad to wear. Also, 100 rifts? 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 9, 2019 (edited) MAD-D! You're ON POINT TODAY! --edit Give people doable challenge to chase - they'll do it.. proven with 6350 repairs, ql99imp(meh with the mallet cheese), wine and the other random go-do-on-epic goals... for priests etc... But 100 rifts... GOOD ***** luck chasing something you barely got to do once every 2-4 IRL months. 'RAIDS" are cool... but 2-3hour raid.. and ******* 1-2hours traveling to the other server's event - sucks. No part of that is fun or reasonable to do... Edited May 9, 2019 by Finnn 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 9, 2019 2 hours ago, Locath said: I will bring up the example of headbob again (yes, yes, i know, it took 12 minutes to code...). A change which affects every single player at the time of it's release wasn't announced, wasn't in the test client, wasn't in the Valrei International, it was just dumped on couple of hundred of players on a whim. I have seen a total of one player who said that he likes it and that could have been said just to suck up to the staff members who were present at the time. It was announced in a VI, then later on it was announced in a patch note of that update. There's not much more beyond that we can do in terms of announcing things. 1 hour ago, MrGARY said: News via being forced to watch long streams or hope someone that isn't even staff posts it while also being forced to "explore" to find out how to use updates or that there even was an update are great methods of keeping the playerbase happy and excited There have been certain things in the past first shown on streams, but I agree that's not ideal - recent streams haven't had any unannounced content and just showed what's already on the test server, what was announced before in the semi-weekly news. I don't think the planned dev streams will be showing or announcing anything you couldn't find out otherwise from the VIs or devblogs. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 9, 2019 5 minutes ago, Samool said: It was announced in a VI, then later on it was announced in a patch note of that update. There's not much more beyond that we can do in terms of announcing things. Which VI was that? I'm genuinely asking because i read them religiously and i must have missed that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 9, 2019 Everything in wurm happens over the course of months, the rift doesn't look too scary to me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 9, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Wiolo said: Everything in wurm happens over the course of months, the rift doesn't look too scary to me. Let's say, you work a job, and lets say, you have other commitments, other games to play. Stuff you want to do besides sailing and riding to each servers rift. If you average a rift per month, which isn't unreasonable, it will take you eight years and four months to finish this goal. Even if you double that to two rifts per month, that's still over four years for a frankly ugly cape. I love the journal, I think it's incredible and that the application of it for the most part is great. You can do the goals as you please, and it demonstrates a lot of features that are worth seeing that maybe you'd miss. But here's the thing, you can work on every other journal goal at your pace. Want to sink all the time you have into it? Go ahead. But when you take that ability to control away, it only serves to create frustration. And this is what is happening. I see such a tiny, tiny amout of people saying "okay the rift amount is fine" and thinking it's not worth doing. As a side note, I don't think giving the team sass about a post not being made about the cape being added is really fair. It wasn't ever hidden, and it was a super nice suprise to see it added. It wasn't kept a secret at all if you're at least a bit interactive with GL or on the forum. I posted the screenshot of the cape from the texture folder in the Wurm discord, in GL twice alone and posted it here and there on the forum too. Edited May 9, 2019 by Madnath 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 9, 2019 3 hours ago, Locath said: Which VI was that? I'm genuinely asking because i read them religiously and i must have missed that. On 2/14/2019 at 2:44 AM, Retrograde said: Animation polishing Samool has also been hard at work on polishing general animations from a first and third person perspective, including having the camera move with certain animations! https://drive.google.com/file/d/19lduiQjq35duW40UAofd_4zjixt5a0kV/view?usp=sharing Of course it will be a toggle though, motion sickness while playing is never fun. As for the capes, it's one cape upon completing the final tier. This does open the door for more to come down the line and we may do so. I assure you when it gets to the point where we want to release more capes we will. 1 minute ago, Madnath said: Let's say, you work a job, and lets say, you have other commitments, other games to play. Stuff you want to do besides sailing and riding to each servers rift. If you average a rift per month, which isn't unreasonable, it will take you eight years and four months to finish this goal. Even if you double that to two rifts per month, that's still over four years for a frankly ugly cape. I love the journal, I think it's incredible and that the application of it for the most part is great. You can do the goals as you please, and it demonstrates a lot of features that are worth seeing that maybe you'd miss. But here's the thing, you can work on every other journal goal at your pace. Want to sink all the time you have into it? Go ahead. But when you take that ability to control away, it only serves to create frustration. And this is what is happening. I see such a tiny, tiny amout of people saying "okay the rift amount is fine" and thinking it's not worth doing. This isn't designed to be cheesed, this is one goal that will actually take time and we're okay with that, rifts themselves have been out for three years and past ones do count. The journal is a long term loose guide to what you can do in wurm, aimed at introducing various features and parts of wurm for new players, veteran players have a headstart by being able to push through it all quickly, but this is one that cannot be done too quick. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 9, 2019 There's a difference between things that take a long time and artificially extended lengths of time. Getting 100 in a skill takes a very very long time, and I've got multiples to say that personally. So what's the difference between 100 in a skill and completing artificially long goals? The fact that I can do the very very long goal of 100 in a skill when I want to, when I'm able to, and when I can enjoy it on my own terms. But what's funny is, rifts literally can be cheesed. If you do pve only and have all the time in the world and don't care about time wasted spent traveling, you can do 7 a week as long as the timing allows. That's not including any potential extras on chaos/epic. In pure safety of pve though, 7 a week is a lot faster than someone without the time that gets 1-2 a month on one server. The fact that taking 4-8 years to complete one goal of one tier of a journal is acceptable is a good joke though 6 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 9, 2019 7 minutes ago, Retrograde said: ... This isn't designed to be cheesed, this is one goal that will actually take time and we're okay with that, rifts themselves have been out for three years and past ones do count. The journal is a long term loose guide to what you can do in wurm, aimed at introducing various features and parts of wurm for new players, veteran players have a headstart by being able to push through it all quickly, but this is one that cannot be done too quick. I agree.. being able to do 1 in few months is not quick at all. And that is the common case for the people with jobs, it's just impossible to go to 90/+% of the rifts as they will take place mostly at another server or time that just isn't at all in any sane range of time allowing you to keep your healthy sleep hours in check and playing a game for fun being casual or competitive tier. That is what we're trying to point, the way rifts spawn is just not working in anybody's favor and this is what we do not like, the 100x amount.. nobody's scared from that number, it's the 1-2 at best(MAYBE) per month which bothers people. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 9, 2019 (edited) 17 minutes ago, Retrograde said: This isn't designed to be cheesed, this is one goal that will actually take time and we're okay with that, rifts themselves have been out for three years and past ones do count. Sorry, going to pay my friends a couple of silver. They're going to log me on, take me to rifts on each server, get a single kill and then drop me in a fenced area out the rift zone so it still counts once it's over. Let me reiterate the single most important part of this. When you take things out of the control of the people, you will create frustration. Why is there a journal tier where one single goal is the one you want to be the long term one? That's a really, really strange way of doing it. 500000 actions will take a lot of people a long time still, even I'm not close to 100% on it yet. What makes that good is you literally cannot cheese actual, active attention to the game. 250 missions will also take a super long time, but they change a lot more often than rifts spawn, and everyone can do them. Edited May 9, 2019 by Madnath 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 9, 2019 seems like the contextual perspective of this rift endurance is not lost on the player but not hitting the meter to the devs of how out of line it is, at a time when some devs have fought to reduce redundant complexity in game to have it more playable/desirable for people to play and pursue over time to retain players and premiums. This goes back to gaming theory. Someone with a foundational training in this area, would be able to spot how obtuse this is. The juxtaposition is killin me sides, me insides, soz just sighs. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 10, 2019 With rifts in mind I will say that this is something we have discussed, the 100 is intended to be long, just like 500k actions and everything else. That said, we can keep track of percentages and completion rates, there may be options to make it easier in the future, but that doesn't necessarily mean reducing the amount of rifts required. This isn't about hitting the end goal, it's about giving ideas for a journey, if you are approaching this with a mindset of doing it all as fast as possible you are going to struggle with the limited stuff. I see the same people upset about the rite spell as well, and I will point out we did adjust it, just like we can do with this and will do if necessary. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 10, 2019 4 minutes ago, Retrograde said: With rifts in mind I will say that this is something we have discussed, the 100 is intended to be long, just like 500k actions and everything else. That said, we can keep track of percentages and completion rates, there may be options to make it easier in the future, but that doesn't necessarily mean reducing the amount of rifts required. This isn't about hitting the end goal, it's about giving ideas for a journey, if you are approaching this with a mindset of doing it all as fast as possible you are going to struggle with the limited stuff. I see the same people upset about the rite spell as well, and I will point out we did adjust it, just like we can do with this and will do if necessary. I don't think the goal needs to be adjusted to be honest, just need to make rifts more accessible to people. I am lucky if I get to do 1 or 2 rifts a month, and thats with Arakiel hounding me to adjust my schedule to do them. The issue with rifts is timing: I have to go to a rift at a specified time on a specified server. If I'm asleep I can't go. If I am at work, I can't go. So on average I have a 4--5 hour window each day when I can attend, which requires me to hound Niarja and pray it happens then. And then it may happen at hour 4 of my playtimes (like yesterday) and I can't go. Or it happens at the same moment my wife needs me to do something, or at the hour my kids go to bed. I understand you are trying to encourage participation, but is not that people don't want to go, its just people can't. Change thay, and people will go more often. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 10, 2019 22 minutes ago, Retrograde said: I see the same people upset about the rite spell as well, and I will point out we did adjust it, just like we can do with this and will do if necessary. I guess that's because the same people can see sense, both issues are about having to be online at the exact right moment and the first issue still isn't fixed which doesn't hold much hope for the second one being adjusted suitably. 7 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 10, 2019 Which is a possibility and I will raise this for discussion, there's a few ideas floating around, once we nail one we'll share it and discuss how it could work 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted May 10, 2019 11 hours ago, Retrograde said: Capes are live now, we purposely aren't showing them to give those who get them first bragging rights. The only reason it turned up is a silly auto equip feature! I was gonna put text here but i think a comic sums it up better 12 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
