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Priest overhaul testing

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So can Fo please get the WoA spell at least as an enchant since it can be used on saddles and horse shoes so it would make sense for him.

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3 hours ago, Dranana1 said:

So can Fo please get the WoA spell at least as an enchant since it can be used on saddles and horse shoes so it would make sense for him.


I... actually agree with this, strongly. This would be great for Fo and would direct players more towards the main gods, Fo being one of them of course of. If he had dis.
Maybe give Magranon nimbleness. This would lead players to get their channelling skill up more with him, it makes sense for him to have the basic combat improvement enchants.
 

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On 10/24/2018 at 4:18 PM, Sindusk said:

Do you think that allowing Fo to have a unique passive that reduces the healing resistance penalty might be a good idea? Just throwing out an example, maybe inflict only half the healing resistance penalty when the spell is cast from a Fo priest?

 

 

I meant to get back to this, but I like the sound of that suggestion. Would be nice if Fo were a PvP beast with Path of Love.

 

On 10/24/2018 at 4:18 PM, Sindusk said:

I would mark success from this update being dependent on an equivalent ratio of players taking every god.

 

In my case, with five priests on Epic, the layout I'm thinking of moving to looks like this:

 

- Vyn

- Fo

- 2x Mag (or, I might just drop the fifth priest)

- Sme

 

At least for me, Nahjo and Paaweelr don't offer enough unique/interesting capabilities, and I'm not sure I want to take a BL priest, just for roleplay reasons. :)

 

Granted, if I only had one priest, the decision would be a lot harder.

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Again, think Smeagain should gain a 35% chance to keep items on death. And maybe a bit more enchanting power, And even being attuned to monsters would be cool for her, just something extra to make her more than a buff deity.
Nathan just feels way better than Tosiek for all of his spells and enchants and damage bonus and monster ignore and healing powers. And I dislike when deity's feel better than others. If you have good taming than you can tame almost anything with Nathan. (I'm comparing Tosiek's charm animal spell to Nathan's dominate) And Libila gets everything with Rebirth.

I feel like Nahjo should get heal, or an additional weapon enchant, this guy has been wiped out pretty hard from this update, just to think, he once had 10 favor from corn, now has none of that, not even item protection.

Paaweelr seems like an interesting alternative to Vynora, and like I said before, he feels pretty balanced, not quite as good of an enchanter as Vynora and looses skillgain bonus in everything, but offers some different powers in return rather than just feeling better than Vynora, which feels good, Paaweelr has always been Vynora's main competitor and I feel like none of them are really better, just different, which is the kind of stuff I love to see.
I definitely won't go Fo after this update... and I don't really know how to change that. It feels like other deity's provide much more interesting experiences than Fo. And all Fo's buff spells (minus forest giant strength) feel kinda niche. Just doesn't usually affect what really really matters, like Truehit for example, that's a good buff that will make you noticeably better, and excel. And forest giant strength doesn't even do that much if the player already has like 45-50 strength. Mostly helpful for newbies, he's just the healer, and he's good at it, but it sure is hard being that... so from a fun prospective, no to Fo, I don't want to sit at an altar all the time and juggle favour in combat or burn through gems while having like no bonuses to protect myself when on cooldowns and what not. Idk I just dislike him, and that could just be as simple as an opinion that I have, and he's even limited in enchanting too, for just helping friends or just earning some money.
I sure do mention Tosiek a lot, but I do believe that Tosiek is strangely balanced right now, Nathan is a bit... better feeling then Tosiek. The way I see it, Nathan is like Libila's Magranon, and the fact that Nathan got like all three tiers of healing spells (One of them a AoE one), and dominate, both armour enchants and blessing of the dark plus Essence Drain and Venom, (which will soon be a real weapon choice) and damage bonus, yeah, comparatively to Tosiek it feels kinda weird. I've always seen Tosiek as the more... Fo like one, although Libila still is the master of enchanting and even the damage spells plus has AoE healing with Scorn of Libila. Tosiek is a bit of the different sort of the mix, being the least offensive of the BL and a more of defensive priest/homebody priest, which is why I also don't really think it makes sense that big ol' hard hitting Nathan gets monster ignore while weaker Tosiek doesn't, although at least Tosiek does have his chances of keeping items at death increased a bit, it still feels off in all compartments. I don't really know what he's trying to be or why Nathan seems so much better in so many compartments then him. Tosiek deserves Scorn for his weakness, and so does Libila, on Nathan who has all that healing, it feels weird. I've tested Scorn, it's cool.

On 10/24/2018 at 1:18 PM, Sindusk said:

I would mark success from this update being dependent on an equivalent ratio of players taking every god.

This is kinda what has came to my mind while writing this, I still see a lot of weird imbalances in this update that makes me feel like completely straying away from some deity's and finding no fun in them or play style, and with all the player deity's that have emerged, I can imagine how difficult achieving a balance with all of them is, but yeah, there's a lot of stuff that feels unfair to some deity's and too fair! lol

Edited by Wiolo

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48 minutes ago, Wiolo said:

I definitely won't go Fo after this update... and I don't really know how to change that. It feels like other deity's provide much more interesting experiences than Fo.

 

Fo gets LT, Venom, and the poison attack enchantment, plus LoF, Humid Drizzle, Wild Growth, and the no-aggro-from-animals passive (makes certain missions -much- easier). Excepting Venom/poison, all of those have been critical to me, and I'm hoping the Venom and poison attack jewelry enchantment will wind up being useful, too.

 

Again, of course, I'm not looking at -just- being a Fo priest. That would be a lot harder decision to make.

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Yes, and like I said, mostly my opinion, I do know he has weapon enchants, but he literally has no armour or tool enchants.
I did say his healing was good too, just not fun to manage.

Edited by Wiolo

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Solution to LT

 

If theres a hostile player in local add debuff time to the "normal" heal debuff.

If theres no hostile player in local add debuff time to a LT exclusive heal debuff.

 

So not much changes in pve and especially at rifts and in pvp player wont be able to avoid the general heal debuff timer when hitting a mount or whatever with a LT weapon.

 

 

 

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7 hours ago, zeeph said:

Solution to LT

 

If theres a hostile player in local add debuff time to the "normal" heal debuff.

If theres no hostile player in local add debuff time to a LT exclusive heal debuff.

 

So not much changes in pve and especially at rifts and in pvp player wont be able to avoid the general heal debuff timer when hitting a mount or whatever with a LT weapon.

 

Is that really abuse, or OP? I don't see a lot of PvP: has LT really been a problem?

 

I feel like if there were some major exploit involving LT and PvP, the professional PvPers would be all over it.

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Pretty sure the abuse cases of LT are all possible in pve only, not pvp.  If you find a guy killing pigs in the middle of pvp instead of players, I don't even know.  Mounts are limited and generally barded and the riders generally don't sit in one place when they're being hit.

 

LT has never really been a problem in general pvp before, people being focused will never heal fast enough, and anyone tanking enough damage to get a chance to heal will be healing tiny wounds.  Anytime in voice comms I can never remember anyone saying "he's got LT!!!!" it's always that someones casting lof or heal, so I don't think limiting a resistance change to just pvp solves anything

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On 10/21/2018 at 6:03 PM, Kip said:

Instead of letting priests do everything why not limit them to their specialty, Mag is the mining God so let his priests be able to do masonry work Build, imp, etc. Another wood, another metal or cloth whatever.  but that way you can solo play a priest but your limited to that God's specialty.  If you want to do everything then you need several priests or a Non priest.

That is a very interesting idea, Kip. It might not be as obvious for Vynora though, and Fo, and lib? Also why not have Mag be the smithing God, for example? Of course something could randomly be assigned, but it would be really hard for the devs to decide which God can do which line of crafting if this was the case. Not impossible though.

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17 minutes ago, Deathangel said:

That is a very interesting idea, Kip. It might not be as obvious for Vynora though, and Fo, and lib? Also why not have Mag be the smithing God, for example? Of course something could randomly be assigned, but it would be really hard for the devs to decide which God can do which line of crafting if this was the case. Not impossible though.

 

At a minimum:

 

Vyn: carp/shipbuilding (spreading knowledge) and/or pottery (fits the new saccing favor passive)

Fo: tailoring/cloth-tailoring (plant/animal-related, and fits passive)

Mag: smithing/weaponsmithing (charge! and fits passive)

Lib: tailoring/leatherworking (killing stuff, not sure what fits Lib passives)

Edited by Roccandil

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It sounds like everyone is ok with Magranon and Vynora (except maybe that she changed her approach abit) since I havent heard any complains. If im wrong then please correct me, but focus seems to be heavily on Fo, which I understand since its alot of changes and its a popular god in pve and pvp. Libila has been in the spotlight aswell, now this god only exist in pvp and has a tiny community of followers (remnants of Hots and those few who are still libila priests among hots), therefore its often forgotten.

 

Im happy @Wioloshared alot of good points on her spells in the test such as essence not working properly :)

 

That being said I would like to lift up that I dont think her passives really fit someone who is supposed to be a goddess of death and decay "war" (think dark magranon version). Libila's passive except the CR bonus feels more like a support god, I kinda had the image that Blacklighters were using berserk warefare (axes as kingdom speciality), some kind of dmg increase or aggressive bonus would fit them better as a libila passive then favor generation or reduced skill on death (this if anything feels like it should by a vynora ability).

Edited by Nocturnes
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2 hours ago, Nocturnes said:

some kind of dmg increase or aggressive bonus

On 10/16/2018 at 6:36 AM, Retrograde said:

Base gods now have extra combat passives at 70 faith. These do not apply to demigods, even if the demigod shares a template.

  • Fo: +1 offensive and defensive CR while fighting on grass, dirt, fields, or trees.
  • Magranon & Libila: +2 offensive CR. No conditions.
  • Vynora: +2 defensive CR while fighting on pavement or at sea (boat/swimming)

 

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That's nothing Gary, compared to a damage bonus.

Edited by Wiolo

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15 hours ago, Roccandil said:

 

Is that really abuse, or OP? I don't see a lot of PvP: has LT really been a problem?

 

I feel like if there were some major exploit involving LT and PvP, the professional PvPers would be all over it.

 

Tbh idk and idc. I only tried to get rid of the general healing debuff timer for LT when doing rifts. :D

But i just read that dev tries to prevent that LT gets expoited while fighting uniques...

Well when the problem is that poor mobs can give too much healing while fighting stronger monster, which wouldnt give that much heal. So why not change the  "heal depends on dmg" to a flat healing value?
 

In the last few days i thought the debuff timer for LT might have a annoying effect when doing rifts. I thought more communcation will be needed over local chat and that you cant just aoe heal without asking and reducing other peoples LT health regen. But the thing is when you got healed 

theres prolly no wound left that could need LT. Also i think to remember that the dev said that you can heal twice your health bar till the debuff timer is on max. Over a period of 2-3h while doing rift i might have reached that. So a lot of time to reduce the debuff timer between.

What maybe doesnt work later anymore is playing something like a maintank there, but idk if someone even did that before.

.

 

 

 

 

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The healing penalty isn't even that bad in rift scenario's really, when you heal like 60% health you get a 5 minute timer, and 60% healing doesn't happen often per LoF casts, and less spamming and more timed casting could really utilize the power that LoF that now heals the highest wounds. So in all honesty, I have no problem with the healing penalties now.
Also here's a cool little look at the powers of frost protection jewellery. [02:06:35] Damage increased to 92.8% from jewelry enchants.
That's a 7.2% damage reduction with a 90QL ring with 96 frost protection casted on it.

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20 hours ago, Roccandil said:

 

At a minimum:

 

Vyn: carp/shipbuilding (spreading knowledge) and/or pottery (fits the new saccing favor passive)

Fo: tailoring/cloth-tailoring (plant/animal-related, and fits passive)

Mag: smithing/weaponsmithing (charge! and fits passive)

Lib: tailoring/leatherworking (killing stuff, not sure what fits Lib passives)

 

 

That seems more like a maximum, frankly.  I would not give such exceptional "all rounder" major skills as carpentry and blacksmithing. Those are the two most generically useful skills in the game. If you are going to give out Carpentry and Blacksmithing, seriously just remove all priest restrictions all together. If you meant normal Smithing, that is useless since they can already do "smithing"   as it involves no item creation. I think they can already just make nails? Likewise, i think all priests can technically do "Tailoring" (clothstrings, leather from hides) since it involves no item creation.  All priests already can do Carpentry just by sawing boards, I assume you mean improve/continue all carpentry items. None of the parent skills there except carpentry mean anything (they can already skill in the parent skills of the rest) , and carpentry is way too much. Weaponsmithing also might be a little too uber, as it is one of the most profitable skills in the game. 

 

 

I would suggest:

 

  • Fo:  Cloth Tailoring 
  • Vynora: Shipbuilding 
  • Magranon: Plate Armor Smithing
  • Lib: Leathermaking, Bowery + Fletching (maybe also add alchemy poison arrow oils). Those are generally rogue type skills. 

 

Pottery I would give to all of the priests. Pottery still has ties to Fo via Nature Gardening/Herb farming. In my mind, pottery+clay = earth = digging =  Fo. I don;t thinking giving all priests pottery is that huge a deal. 

 

That gives each original god a useful but more narrow profession without basically removing the bulk of crafting restrictions. If you are going to give all-rounder skills such as Carpentry then give those to all the priests else you have one or two  "90 percent self sufficient" priests and the rest are wimps.  I also have no problem with simply removing all crafting restrictions, just with any heavily lopsided distribution of skills. Carpentry is too powerful to give to just one specific priest group.

 

 

Edited by Brash_Endeavors
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48 minutes ago, Brash_Endeavors said:

That seems more like a maximum, frankly.  I would not give such exceptional "all rounder" major skills as carpentry and blacksmithing. Those are the two most generically useful skills in the game. If you are going to give out Carpentry and Blacksmithing, seriously just remove all priest restrictions all together. If you meant normal Smithing, that is useless since they can already do "smithing"   as it involves no item creation.

 

I was assuming it's impossible to give a priest the ability to imp a subskill, without also giving them the parent skill (imping a ship gives you carp gain at an imping rate). The skills I cared about were shipbuilding/pottery, weaponsmithing, cloth tailoring, and leatherworking.

 

Oh, and blacksmithing isn't in weaponsmithing's parent tree, so no blacksmithing.

Edited by Roccandil

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All priests already can do tailoring and smithing, so you shouldn't need to "give" those to any priest class. They have them now. They can all make bricks, planks, nails, cloth strings. 

 

If you somehow technically "must" give all imp/crafting abilities in the parent skill, I dunno why but if, then "no" to shipbuilding and give Vynora Pottery instead. (I would expect Vynora to complain). And PAS instead of weaponsmithing to Magranon. And take away Bowery/fletching from my Libila list if it means they get unlocked everything in the carpentry main tree.  Too bad, I would like to see Libila get "rogue" skills and Vyn get ships.

 

So I guess we agree on most of the rest.

 

 

Edited by Brash_Endeavors
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If I imp shipbuliding, I'm going to simultaneously grind carp skill way better than creation will (you'll get carp ticks while getting shipbuilding ticks). I don't think it's possible to allow imping ships without giving a nice boost to carp.

 

Pottery doesn't really make sense for Vyn, except for the affinity thing (which doesn't make sense to me, either, seems to fit Fo better, but hey).

 

Oh, and as Mag, if I had to pick an armor skill, I'd rather have shieldsmithing than PAS...

Edited by Roccandil

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No to giving Vynora shipbuilding PLUS the ability to craft all  items in the carpentry parent skill, that makes the rest of items for the other priests look like a mockery. Any priest can "grind" carpentry by making planks  as it is now, my WO Fo priest I think had 50-60 Carpentry, just from cutting planks. But, she could not make imp/improve carpentry items just because she could grind carpentry. It's a shame, but I am afraid I would argue against shipbuilding if you are trying to sneak in the entire Carpentry base crafting tree with it.  Pottery then,  I guess.  Kind of a shame. Anyway, Fo should be more "wood items" than Vynora. Vynora gets Woodcutting because 'killing trees' is kind of anti-Fo, Fo  get affinity from planting trees, But, Fo can cut planks ok so it is not like some allergy against wood items. Vynora is more, roads and seas and knowledge. And Trade but that doesn't mean therefore "all trade".  Fo is nature which means trees.

 

All priests already have the ability to boost Carpentry, Masonry, Smithing and Tailoring. It's not something you suddenly need to "give" to Vynora else they cannot make ships at all. All Priests can even raise shipbuilding now, just from making hullplanks and tenons. The fact that making ships would somehow give Vynora a higher base carpentry is kind of a non issue.

 

Shieldsmithing or PAS whichever for Mag, fine. Personally, I would consider PAS more useful, as shields are no use to players who use two handed weapons.  If I were Mag I would sure want PAS instead.

 

Maybe give Vynora chain armorsmithing or something, if you don't like Pottery which I guess -is- after all their new affinity skill. Maybe add a few new nifty pottery items to the pottery skill tree, although they have some nice things there now if they could only Mend them (oh wait, Vynoraa CAN mend them ..)

 

 

 

Edited by Brash_Endeavors
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If Vyn can get ship imping without allowing her to imp carp items, then I'd be good with that. Simply for favor gain, though, pottery might make more sense (pottery bricks + pottery affinity).

 

Plate armor is now kinda useless, with the new armor meta.

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