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Budda

Some Epic Things

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5 minutes ago, MrGARY said:

wait so your skills are being nerfed alongside with your core game mechanics being drastically altered without being allowed a full and proper out?

eh if it was up to me i wouldn't change the skillgain on epic in any way (or anywhere really) and i'd let people from freedom cross to epic with their skill capped at some value so they can compete in pvp without being OP compared to people who spent their time playing on epic

but it's not up to me and i'm no pvper so no clue if that would even help in any way

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4 hours ago, Savior said:

This is bad for epic.....

 

This is genocide for BL.......

 

Freedom will just parachute in to PvP then leave....... Wrecking havoc and trolling epic players......   Rome will be Rome......

 

Not many will give up skill to go to Freedom......

 

This is worse than a merge.......

 

You are making Epic a playground that Freedomers wont really care about except to jump over to be a nuisance.  

I strongly disagree on most of ur points

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I'd like to chime in as one of the few... and i do mean FEW people on epic who actually skilled OPTIMALLY.... this means 1 ql coc tools... and using maximillians skill calculator to adjust what i skilled and how i skilled and while my account might mirror some of the hardcore grinders on freedom... i AM a hardcore grinder on epic... and the skills i have took insane amounts of hours... and i've leveled skills on freedom and can honestly say over half this stuff is silly easy on freedom... my friend heard about this and is asking me what skills he should try to level really fast on epic and i looked at the list and said basically nothing... cos every single skill can be done more easily or profitably on freedom. Told him to do stealing. :) cos thats a lil harder on freedom. 

 

Seriously though. so many good comments on here i ran out of my 25 likes. I do feel that stats are pretty nil... and im gonna get ROYALLY screwed no matter what... i stayed on epic 2 years more than i wanted because i felt "trapped" and i was ASSURED by devs... by Gms... i think even keenan and buddah had chimed in MULTIPLE times... in group discussions... on forum posts... in news updates that there would be NO MERGE EVER... i personally asked enki multiple times to swap me over secretly even and he told me no... alas this year i gave up and spend ALL of this year on freedom.... and just finished about 3 months straight mining rock for body stats (about 1 stat per week) which seems fast enough to me... and over 40s on pan filling from robz to boost my mind logic to near 50 and hfc over 90.... and soul stats up there too... spent 2 weeks solid doing taming and all that is gonnaa get wiped away with this merge... not ONLY are my skills on epic gonna get nerfed hard but now im gonna get kicked in the balls and told that ALL this year on freedom was for nothing and that i wasted about 100 silvers to help skill up on freedom... all for nothing... and then body stats... are a joke... my stamina is gonna drop to 39 i think with this formula... and im already at 35 almost on freedom... 27-35 in the last 3 months... so now... 5 years of HARDCORE grinding... PLUS the 10 stamina boost we got for not having stamina on mining or cutting... and im told that in virtually 3-6 months i can achieve the SAME stamina on freedom that it took me 5  years to get? and while i did skill OPTIMALLY unlike most people i did PLENTY of digging for tintagel... for my massive elevation deed.... for Yorkshire... and Khaleesi's... hell.. for just about 20-30 deeds probably... i was digging dirt for dozens of deeds... and i dug THOUSANDS of clay.... for all the building i did... which was the vast majority.. i was the #1 mason on serenity when it came out and went around and built more guard towers than anyone on JK and MR in the first month. its all i did.... on top of this i mined out 1.2 million.... yes... MILLION rock while on serenity. had to watch it all decay cos there was nothing to do with it.... and for ALL that mining and digging i got 10 stamina??? cos they didnt want ppl on tar to get nothing? and then now im getting it nerfed again??? to take it to freedom... and the sweet spot they are talking about... ask led... i'm using his rare 95 ql pick with 90woa for the SPECIFIC PURPOSE of not raising my mining up... so i can bask in stamina gains.... in the time it took me to go 27-35 stamina on freedom... my mining went 52-60 ;( i couldnt stop it anymore than i already had... yes my stamina was going up almost as fast as my mining... but now im gonna have over 90 digging and mining and about 80 woodcutting ;( my sweet spots will have passed and i won't even get much additional stamina.... 99.972 platesmithing on epic... is from 1.5 years of doing nothing but plate... by the time i finished it i realized i could have EASILY gotten 20-30 other skills to 90. i'm actually okay that i get to keep this along with my carpentry.... but the fact i hear freedomers crying about it... sorry... but no... you get to level plate smithing by imping a few dragon pieces with leather... or with charcoal making (easier on freedom) and metallurgy (easier on freedom) to pump out high quality steel to use... which is a lot harder to make on epic.... ive done it on both i already know... It takes me roughly 200 hours to get a crafting skill to 90 on epic and roughly the same to do it on freedom. the difference is that the start is easier on epic... but the ending is easier on freedom... and by ending i mean you dont climb a parabola into the sky in terms of difficulty and challenge on those skill checks... even if epic gets half the skill checks.. they are much worse because of the difficulty. on freedom its like a linear line and its so clearly visible. 

 

how hard is freedom? let me explain another few examples.. 

 

I tamed a pig... yes a PIG to almost 58 taming on freedom in a week or so... a pig at 30 on epic makes you want to pull out your hair... you need harder and harder creatures and different food types and from 70-76 i fed THOUSANDS and thousands of meat to a hell horse... had to get my ass kicked doing it... the thought i can keep leveling possibly to 70 or 90 even off a stupid pig on freedom... are you serious??? 

 

i made 100 of each item on freedom... to grind on... then these were decaying so fast... that i had to imp them to 20 so they wouldnt insta poof.... getting my items... (only 100) to 20 i netted about 40-45 skill in each category... on epic i would have 100-200 items at about 40-50 ql to get the same skill. (ive done it tons of times) 

 

my repair is 58 already on freedom i get about 1 point per hour with sleep bonus on... its not even slowing down yet.... i just hit 75 today on epic after 5 years of playing on epic and repairing THOUSANDS of items i was grinding on... i literally had a wagon i made of nothing but leather belts and bags filled with meditation rugs just for repair... i even had over 1500 clay flasks at one point when i was lower... it was INCREDIBLY harder than freedom to level that skill even in a drunken stupor... cos not only do you deal with the difficulty but you deal with action timers being faster... so you need much more stuff to repair which means to decay....

 

I will admit that on epic you can make items incredibly fast and high ql with few caveats in that realm... but we arent talking about transferring items. we are only talking about skills. 

 

I heard someone talk about too much moon metal and dragon armor? again... are you kidding me? chaos has everyone in dragon armor... not epic. Dragons only gave a lot of items out in the first year when you killed them... they were dead FOREVER... it was a one time thing... oh... and you couldnt imp or repair without dragon hide on epic... which meant no... you werent gonna use it normally it was for decoration. Unlike freedom... then when they did start to respawn you were lucky to get .02 or .04 per dragon /drake.... they just increased the drop and ability to imp with metal/leather a year ago... AFTER the population was so dead that we couldnt even kill a dragon... don't believe me? watch niarja.... i think bl just killed 5 the other week from what my friends tell me... but serenity has all their uniques as the other servers are heavily populated as well meaning we don't even have those materials in vast quantities... Moonmetal, over the years we do have a lot... how often do you get something? about every 20 valrei creatures will drop 1kg of it.... these creatures are relatively hard to find as they only spawn with missions being completed and these new changes will have them spawning even less often... not to mention they are kinda deadly but now are spawning randomly on the map instead of all in one place (which made them deadlier) we do have reward metal for hota and there are some camps that give it too i think but its not in a vast quantity as you think. most pvp is still done in regular good ole fashion steel. and if you are with the big pvp groups they usually will supply you with the loot from dead enemies. It is relatively fair for the most part. this being said... each kingdom has their home server to rift on... rifting on ele would be extremely dangerous in high poulation envrionements... but on freedom you have atleast 7 servers you can participate in rifts basically all week every week and have had that ability for almost 2 years? anyone who wants moon metal should already have it. 

 

I do have mixed feelings about the one time thing from epic to freedom and a (as much as you want) xfer from freedom to epic... this means that if you want to level up or grind it should be done on freedom and the ONLY grinding you would want to do would be for pvp... this means i will be staying on freedom to continue leveling up skills whereas if i was able to level my skills on either server whenever i could then make items used for pvp and live on a pvp environment as well as travel to freedom whenever i want and not feel trapped... I'd actually prefer to just get rid of the variance in skilling completely. do a 1:1 transfer and then make skilling be exactly the same on either side so no one is "trapped"... this would not only encourage me to possibly stay on epic (adding to the population and helping new people out or gearing the ones who want to pvp) but would encourage others to come over knowing there are people that will grind for them. Most pvpers from what i have seen do not like making their own houses or dirt hills or armor and weapons. Most just want to fight and kill.

 

I also agree there is a huge gap between a new player and a vet in terms of what they can do... riding a hell horse (though i do not like them, ugly things)... is pretty essential in pvp and should be available faster for new people. you would run out of your first 2 months prem without ever being able to ride one. I find that while having some achievable goals for later on in the game when you grind up as rewards... to be fulfilling... but not on pvp... its the opposite on pvp... if it takes you a year to be on par with someone stronger... and knowing that they will have had a whole year more to get even stronger... it is sad. People are already told they cant pvp or come to join on stuff because they dont have 70 fs or dont have 50 weapon skill or shield skill or a body stat number... (which i dont agree with... i think new people should be allowed in every fight and can always help serve a purpose needed, even if its only bait to confuse and take out horses) Most of the pvp changes ive been watching seem pretty fair to me and i like them but there are other issues...

 

Loot... for newer people (especially those that dont like to grind their gear back up).... many dont have the skills to actually re equip themselves... or make a new boat to participate in pvp excursions... some even struggle with just simple food and water and trolls.... when they have items they can go around and look for a fight... hang in groups and have a blast.. ive listened to many groups have a ton of fun going to EMPTY deeds with no one there... they get anxious and weary and feel they might get ambushed... its exciting for new people... but the moment they die and lose their gear... and the more time they feel is vested in that gear... the bigger impact it has on them... the next time they dont want to join a group if they think they might lose their items or boat... they think about how it might take a week or two just to get back to where they are now... the more casual the gamer the worse this is. 

 

ive brought up the loot issue many times to many different people and trust me... its not a personal issue... again i have 99.972 platesmithing on epic... i have most of my skills high cos all i do is grind... i make hundreds of plate sets and thousands of arrows and saddles and belts and shields for people.... i have no problem re outfitting myself... this is about NEW people... i've seen too many people quit over the issue of not being allowed to join a group cos they are viewed "dead weight" or they quit cos they can't replace their gear in a timely fashion... or they quit because dragons are running amuck and they can't even find safety in the starter towns... or they are labeled a "spy" and have to put up with inner kingdom drama and being killed on sight because people simply don't know who they are... it is exhausting and frustrating to see dozens of new people to the game... or new people from freedom getting discouraged and i wish there was a way to provide an easier way to comfort these people... even an NPC that would give you 50ql plate if you lost yours (unimpable/sellable/etc) so even naked they can atleast equip plate for pvp and have some basic tools replaced. hammer/chisel yea yea they can scrummage the rock tiles and get branches and make crude... use kindling+woodscrap to make a fire instead of a forge that needs flint n steel... i get it... i do... and i love it... on FREEDOM... but on epic where the goal and focus should be pvp... you shouldnt make it so hard on new people. Our first few weeks on serenity when we got hit by raiders they only looted the first body or two (thats all that would fit in the rowboat/sailboat or be carried bfore making them too heavy... but they made sure to loot everyones flint n steels. it would make people quit ;/ literally. they cant light the forge to reignite and allow them to replace their armor and tools. they couldnt make a fire to cook on... they didnt know that they could make a fire with kindling/woodscrap to begin with as they only used flint and no one told them and wiki was hard to navigate. The tutorial has been chopped down and now you can completely skip it on new characters which sometimes people do thinking its a new game and they don't need to do a tutorial... but then they get discouraged by the learning curve and quit... every argument i have generally is about things we can do to make people come to the game and stay... i'm tired of seeing epic and freedom fight over crap. it just causes more people to quit from the drama or feeling "gyped" if you played with hundreds of thousands of people you wouldn't care what happened to bobs skills or if he got a full transfer or not... he'd just another cog in the wheel. We care so much here because we are so few and we have such competition... anyone who knows me on epic knows i have always provided lodging and food and items for free... taking donations if people want to give them but i've always fully equipped anyone who needed it with the time i had to spare. On freedom those that do know me probably think i waste too much money throwing it all around and having too many deeds.... too many premium alts... spend spend spend... i'm not hurting the economy there at all.... i've not even sold hardly anything... I think i sold the supreme items i bought for 20s from that nira or niru or whatever it was... the gm auction... but besides that i dont make items to sell. 

 

I have always played on both epic and freedom. I've been on exodus for over 5 years. celebration over 2 years... xanadu since it opened... still have a fully built deed practically there... i have 2 deeds currently on exodus... 4 deeds on pristine.... making a new deed this month on inde. and this merge the way it stands is already gonna screw me out of an entire year of freedom play.... but its still better than nothing considering without it i would have just lost 5 years of playing on epic because a bunch of strangers that don't interact with me are mad that some stranger they don't know is gonna get skills... but these skills arent created out of thin air... ive probably played MORE than most of you... i've spent on average well take a look for yourself...

 

[22:53:25] You entered through the portal to Wurm on day of Sleep, week 4 of the starfall of Fires, 1018. That's 2174 days, 17 hours and 18 minutes ago.

 

[22:53:25] You have played 1020 days, 10 hours and 30 minutes.

 

thats almost 47% of my time... thats on average about 11 1/2 hours per day... yes literally HALF my day in wurm...  for the last 6 years.... and you think that is somehow unfair that i should come over there with my skills??? most of the people playing on freedom right now havent even been playing 6 years... and most of them don't have over 1000 days IN GAME.... 

 

i also have 100 faith priests of vynora/nahjo/fo.... my nahjo was 100 mag before convert... thats on epic.... oh ... AND freedom... yes i spent months doing basically nothign but sermons to get them to 100.... and working channeling up as i can too.... i've had only 3-4 deeds on epic... over 20-30 on freedom... that i personally owned and worked tirelessly to terraform and build for citizens... and i find it pretty insulting when i hear these freedomers talking and not knowing anything about epic. i have more experience on both clusters than most people and if those freedomers want to come to epic i might have to start pvping again :)

 

for the most part we want people to play and interact... with this change you can sit at home on freedom doing what you do best... but when you want to pvp you take a simple epic portal and pop over to your cities war town and help out or go on a hunt... great for defense... where you dont even have to travel... you just get a whisper... hey come help... yay... excitement! or nah... not tonight... whatever... no sailing all the way to chaos and then saying how do i join a kingdom? who do i talk to? i dont know anyone? you can already be part of a side here and just fight... with little attachment to your items and yet tons of skills to make stuff happen.... i think that part is GREAT.... but to say it shouldnt go the other way is insulting. also. it would indeed encourage the exact same trap for new people that stay on epic or skill on epic later on which is not what we want. you don't really want freedom to come here and then stay here you want them to flow like water back and forth helping with pvp and population but also doing their own thing on their own deeds....

 

on a side note... my epic portal on exodus decayed away tonight and i had to run to esert and the huge canal south of esert that had kawopij's name all over the bridges... i thought was pretty amazing been atleast a year since i went through there... my first town of farmville can't even be recognized now. its beautiful good work! 

 

More advertising this game would also help +1 ;)

 

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i see one problem now!...   you can buy high skilled epic toon now for 100€    and once you transfer it to freedom you get 300€ worth freedom  toon. So someone will make money again

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4 minutes ago, Sila said:

i see one problem now!...   you can buy high skilled epic toon now for 100€    and once you transfer it to freedom you get 300€ worth freedom  toon. So someone will make money again

 

just because some people are lowballing doesn't mean accounts will sell for that much

and if they can sell for more on freedom then the epic player would just sell it on freedom for 300 themselves rather than 1/3rd the price on epic......

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-1 for transfers Epic>freedom 
There are many other factors affecting grinding, not just skill gain. Like availability of imping materials. Eg. ppl with high mining = more ppl with access to high ql lumps for cheap or even free (whereas on freedom you have to buy them or be lucky to have a friend with time and skill). Also fighting and its subskills makes skilling new weapons alot easier. There are some other skills affecting each other, but I will not mention them all. I just want to show you that grinding is a snowball effect. And ofc we have developed economy on our lovely PvE freedom so people spend much time on trading and building. 

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47 minutes ago, Clasin said:

-1 for transfers Epic>freedom 
There are many other factors affecting grinding, not just skill gain. Like availability of imping materials. Eg. ppl with high mining = more ppl with access to high ql lumps for cheap or even free (whereas on freedom you have to buy them or be lucky to have a friend with time and skill). Also fighting and its subskills makes skilling new weapons alot easier. There are some other skills affecting each other, but I will not mention them all. I just want to show you that grinding is a snowball effect. And ofc we have developed economy on our lovely PvE freedom so people spend much time on trading and building. 

 

"fighting makes its subskills and weapons alot easier"

 

care to elaborate on the difference between freedom and epic ?

Edited by platinumteef
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10 hours ago, SmeJack said:

Its funny because we have compared things in the past and I have seen people agree that farming took the same time and I have seen WKM even agree that to get 100 HFC on freedom and epic was the same amount of meals cooked, but the discussions are conveniently forgotten as soon as they are over and the choir starts singing the same song every time it comes up again, everyone be damned because some people are more important than others and some people would rather watch others destroyed and quit than accept a fellow wurmian to continue playing the game we all love in the face of dark times.

Well, idk where that is coming from. But i don't remember saying that. And HFC and Farming are both twice as fast on epic.

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We've taken the last day or so to collect feedback and tweak the formula calculation. The new calculation scales properly up to 99.99999615 (100) and also has a slightly higher skill result from the initial reduction. The first number (0.004456) is changed to 0.004135, and has been updated in the OP and the calculator linked from the OP.

 

Due to the way the curve negatively impacted optimal characteristics gains and hindered meditation these will be copying over to freedom at a 1:1 ratio. We'll also be looking at meditation cooldowns as a whole for both freedom and epic, and see if there's something we can do across both.

 

I'd like to thank you all for taking the time to share your feedback, and I know many of you are either personally impacted by these changes first hand, or feel that these changes may impact you in other ways, and your feedback has been important in making sure we address this as best as possible. It's not an ideal situation, with the curve and other factors throwing a little RNG into the works, but we hope that both Freedomers and Epic players can agree that this is the best solution for both sides.

 

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I made the butt-naked epic->freedom journey some time back, so the prospect of a transfer is nice.  Would have been nicer some years back, but oh well.  Personally, having somewhat ground my freedom side skills up a bit (it's hard to summon the enthusiasm for doing the same grind again), I'd have no problem with just transferring epic accouts over without conversion.  But then, I have more skills on my epic version than I do on, and I don't bother selling stuff these days, just give it away as I feel like it, so I would say that.  A bunch of new accounts suddenly appearing with high skills don't threaten or damage me in the least, and the thought that there might actually be some good pvp again 'back home' is totally work supporting.

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My mistake WMK it was Pingpong saying they were similar

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Great to see common sense prevailed. Bring on the update!

Edited by Rudie

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FINALLY! Now I can sleep good again after days of nonsense. HYPE!

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4 hours ago, Sila said:

i see one problem now!...   you can buy high skilled epic toon now for 100€    and once you transfer it to freedom you get 300€ worth freedom  toon. So someone will make money again

 

And? You aren't forced to buy the accounts for that price.

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It's very difficult to read this thread without having a Kriswald rant (which I completely agree with in terms of skilling optimally vs rewards). I've been playing for 6 years now and my body stamina barely comes close to what an average freedomer has after 6 years. 

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6 hours ago, Sila said:

i see one problem now!...   you can buy high skilled epic toon now for 100€    and once you transfer it to freedom you get 300€ worth freedom  toon. So someone will make money again

 

So what you're saying is that anyone, literally anyone, Epic Freedom, PvP or PvE player can buy a skilled toon and sell it for more money later on.....

Isn't this exactly what will happen on Epic? People buying highly skilled Freedom/Chaos and selling them later on for profit?

 

One of the reasons highly skilled toons on Epic are selling for very low prices is that they have been 'trapped' on a separate cluster with a low population and not much interest is shown in purchasing these accounts.

If this update is successful then the price for accounts at this level will reflect demand on both Epic and Freedom clusters.

 

That's how markets work, prices fluctuate in response to demand and supply. At the moment on Epic, supply is high, demand is low, so prices are low, if demand is raised and supply lowered, prices will rise.

 

Let me make this perfectly clear, I don't like account selling, never have, and I'll never sell any of my accounts, nor will I buy any, but if a six year old account from Epic is worth 300 Euros on Freedom why would I choose to sell it on Epic at a third of the price, especially when the market is so depressed on Epic.

 

If you are fine with buying and selling accounts, then the market decides what they are worth, that's just economics.

Edited by Zenity
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Things were getting passionate on epics side, I'm happy we weren't screwed on this part!!! 

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2 hours ago, Budda said:

We've taken the last day or so to collect feedback and tweak the formula calculation. The new calculation scales properly up to 99.99999615 (100) and also has a slightly higher skill result from the initial reduction. The first number (0.004456) is changed to 0.004135, and has been updated in the OP and the calculator linked from the OP.

 

Due to the way the curve negatively impacted optimal characteristics gains and hindered meditation these will be copying over to freedom at a 1:1 ratio. We'll also be looking at meditation cooldowns as a whole for both freedom and epic, and see if there's something we can do across both.

 

I'd like to thank you all for taking the time to share your feedback, and I know many of you are either personally impacted by these changes first hand, or feel that these changes may impact you in other ways, and your feedback has been important in making sure we address this as best as possible. It's not an ideal situation, with the curve and other factors throwing a little RNG into the works, but we hope that both Freedomers and Epic players can agree that this is the best solution for both sides.

 

 

Thank you buddha!, Shouldnt Fighting skill and Faith be 1:1 aswell if meditation is? I belive those skills werent affected by the epic curve?

Edited by Nocturnes
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My only question now is HOW this is going to happen exactly... personally i would prefer that during a server down all the skills are automatically configured.... all of epic is immediately changed over and freedom during the patch. otherwise I'd have to ask.... will there be a dialogue box when stepping through the epic portal that says "do you wish to merge skills"? i don't think you should have a choice really as to when if we are changing the entire skilling system. it should just be server down... patch update... skills are merged... and then that permanent freedom merge each time is eh... I'm supportive of that i just wish there was a way that we wouldn't trap the future epic players into this skill gain gap again.... i wouldn't even mind if there was a command to swap skills individually ;) love to keep my mining at 60 on freedom personally.... and digging at 78 and woodcutting at 57.... so i still have a little room to catch up to freedom players that have high stamina... but i aint complaining im happy with budda's latest announcement. 

 

and nocturnes... faith isn't transferring. 

 

basically.. do i need to be on epic when this patch goes into effect.... i'd hate to be on freedom when it happens and miss the merge lol. for now im staying on epic til i hear otherwise ;P 

 

 

Edited by KrisWald
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23 hours ago, Firestarter said:

Because it isn't insulting to have those with a similar mindset to yourself, crying about "But mah markets" and "Mah monies!", painting us all with the same brush?

 

You're being referred to as a capitalist because that's all your arguments boil down to. The market, and the ability to make money from it.

If you wish to debate, please refrain from making assumptions and slights on my person like you really know me. These comments and others of late like "But mah markets" and "Mah monies!" really have no bearing here. I never did anything to you but ever since you started posting on the forums about this subject you've been at me left and right. Nothing I have stated really helps me make money; in fact freedom really wont make much from epic transfer to freedom in the long run if you want a economic forecast but I'm sure you don't. I'm not playing this game to profit, it's a mild hobby that i'm good at obviously and that a lot of players do in this game. I have a job, I work, the usual. I get that I have this super huge reputation for selling, but since when is mercantile against the rules? I don't enjoy having players call me out constantly for it! I'm not a scapegoat for these grievances. If you have such a large issue with it, outlaw it! See how that'll go, in fact I wouldn't be surprised either.

 

 The game is mostly trading and crafting these days, I've been saying for years epic logic need not apply to freedom. We get that "you" don't care about selling - others will though, you're in denial if you think otherwise. I don't get to bring all my stuff to epic so why should you? I really don't wish to continue defending myself after this. I'm sure you'll retort me again, I can't win either way as you have more hands with you in this debate with me. 

 

I'm also losing respect for epic players even, which is something I'm reluctant to say. The fact that some of you are not happy with the skill transfer is a bit alarming, as it's way to generous to even begin with. You want more, I will always be against that logic. Please be happy with just transfers. It's more than fair.

 

10 hours ago, KrisWald said:

Moonmetal, over the years we do have a lot...

You sure do, why were you against my logic then, when moonmetal is everywhere? It's a problem I have against full transfers allowing moonmetal armour and tomes as it would create imbalances to PVP. Something like this to me is simple game logic which players should be picking up on, but seem to not realize oddly. 

 

Thanks.

Edited by Niki

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