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Fairyshine

Warning about chars being sold with permissions on your stuff

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Just a reminder to everyone that if you give someone permissions to ride or manage a horse or enter a house, they will still have those permissions even if they are no longer a part of your deed nor an ally.  The char can get sold and you can remove them from your deed, but horse permissions are different, it works like a house writ.  You also have to go and change the permissions on the actual horse, every single one of them.  There is no blanket removal of a char name from all previous permissions you gave them (which perhaps would be a great suggestion although not sure it is possible to achieve).  You have to go in and remove the name from each individual item you granted permission for, including the horses. 

 

I found out the hard way.  Be careful it does not happen to you.

Edited by Fairyshine
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I would like to remind people - to assist in the removal of undesired permissions - Right click body/inventory -> Manage -> Search.Permissions

 

This function searches through all you have access to manage for the player name which you enter. Sorry for your loss Fairyshine.

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don't forget, you can revoke all permissions for a character with one action

 

Right click your body > profile > search permissions

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 Type the name in, and hit search

 

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you can then remove all permissions with the one button, or manage individual item permissions

 

Edit: Jberg beat me but I took pictures, so I win

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I did not know you could do one fell swoop! Thank you for sharing how to do it :)  Very handy.

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Nor chests, bsbs, fsbs, or other containers. If you cant set permissions remotely, the search function will not work.

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I hear the sounds of devs flailing away on keyboards, to quickly plug the permissions hole and provide an update :)

 

I'd like another option to "change all ownerships to [name]".  I have so many wagons, carts and boats that are stranded now, thanks to all the trades over the years.  My own fault for not paying attention and honestly, most happened before the current permissions that lets us remotely manage vehicles, but it is still somewhat easy to goof up.  Current system also requires you go to every server and manage permissions on each.

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Can we just a instant wipe button all permisisons for this purpose alone?

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4 minutes ago, Niki said:

Can we just a instant wipe button all permisisons for this purpose alone?

The only thing is the ownerships.  If they are the owner and you wipe them off, you now have vehicles, houses, mine doors, etc that have no owner.  So I think it needs to be something like this:

 

Delete all permissions from this character and change ownerships to: ___________ (applies to all servers)

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7 hours ago, Wurmhole said:

The only thing is the ownerships.  If they are the owner and you wipe them off, you now have vehicles, houses, mine doors, etc that have no owner.  So I think it needs to be something like this:

 

Delete all permissions from this character and change ownerships to: ___________ (applies to all servers)

But wouldn't that make it easier to steal if you could change ownership on things they own on your deed?

I understand the reason and would support it if it was like the old abandoned boats salvage rule, cause I really get tired of pushing carts, wagons, bsb, chest, etc off deed after someone quits the game and leaves behind locked items at AE.

Unless I'm misunderstanding what you are suggesting.

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I would like to also flag to people that if branded animals lose the brand once they change servers (with the upcoming animal movement crate things), people will be able to take your branded animal here (if they have lead rights) and take them over the server and just kill them and take the stuff.  As many people have highly enchanted rare/supreme horse gear, it is a valuable loot for some griefer to get their hands on. I am assuming that your current protected animals will no longer be protected once they leave the server they are branded on.  It is even more important now to ensure NOBODY can lead or ride your branded animals but you, yourself and nobody else.  I would like to request that when animal crates come into game, all current branded permissions be reset to only owner can lead/manage/ride, so we have a choice to actually go add other people (or not).  This will ensure we can be very careful in allowing anyone any rights on our animals.

Edited by Fairyshine
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56 minutes ago, Talohan said:

But wouldn't that make it easier to steal if you could change ownership on things they own on your deed?

I understand the reason and would support it if it was like the old abandoned boats salvage rule, cause I really get tired of pushing carts, wagons, bsb, chest, etc off deed after someone quits the game and leaves behind locked items at AE.

Unless I'm misunderstanding what you are suggesting.

No.  We are talking about changing all the ownerships on an alt that you own to another alt that you own.  Then you can sell off that alt that has no more owned items (or permissions) to someone and feel confident you left no stones unturned.

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Old fart rant incoming, feel free to skip ;) (as this is more of a general rant)

 

In my opinion, this whole permission-mania has gotten way out of hand. We are talking about horses here, not the keys to the USS Ronald Reagan aircraft carrier! A horse is just a dumb animal that anyone should be able to take if it is left out somewhere. The permissions should be at the deed level and nothing else. Having permissions on a horse like it was a car from the future actually kills my immersion in the game.

 

But why am I complaining about a feature that is already in the game? Because it clearly never ends, as we can see from this thread. There is not a single one of the socalled quality-of-life changes we have seen the past few years that I have anything positive to say about, they all dumb the game down in my ungrateful opinion.

But my preferences is not the issue here. No, the worst part is that these kinds of changes is what the devs feel they are forced to spend their time on. Now you will have them running to spend weeks to make the permission system on horses even more complicated.

 

Instead of, you know, improving the gameplay, interface, the lag, or adding new content to the game.

We have a game that have lost 60% of its player base in two years. This is what games look like two years before they shut down folks. And the devs are spending their time trying to appease the few veterans that are still playing, obsessing over obscure details. (And I am actually not aiming at the OP here because I don't know her and could be any type of player to me).

 

New players are not interested in these complicated systems, because they are busy being eaten by wolves while trying to learn the interface (not that there is anything wrong with being eaten by wolves).

Another example is the ability to transport animals to other servers. This is actually a substantial change and not unwelcome as such, even to me. Players have been wanting it for 7-8 years! 

But think about it a bit, this is a difficult change that devs have been working on for years and years, and it is only interesting for old players who want to have their favourite horses with funny names on their new deeds on new servers. New players do not even know which server they are on the first two months, and they don't think about moving the first six months. And NO player has ever left Wurm because they could not move their pet horse to another server.

 

My positive message is, let's stop pushing the devs to spend their time working on changes that only veteran players with large networks care about. Sorry that it came out harshly.

Rant over!

 

 

Edited by Cista
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11 minutes ago, Cista said:

Instead of, you know, improving the gameplay, interface, the lag, or - oh dear - adding new content to the game.

I think adding systems to make it easier for players to work together without worrying about who will take advantage of what is an integral part of this game. There's quite an air of distrust between new players, or randoms, or any number of people and the permissions system is incredibly flexible to address this, the major problem is most dont understand how to use it to it's maximum potential.

 

As for improving gameplay, a lot of features to make the game smoother and less frustrating have been added over the years (i think you called it dumbing it down), interface is work we've repeatedly said is underway, the lag improvements have been ongoing and have seen remarkable steps, Xanadu is still a pain at times but hey, it's huge.

 

As for new content, I;m surprised this is a complaint, given we've introduced huge systems in the past year, added a ton of new housing and bridge and paving types, and are on the verge of a totally new skill coming in. 

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4 minutes ago, Retrograde said:

we've introduced huge systems in the past year, added a ton of new housing and bridge and paving types, and are on the verge of a totally new skill coming in

 

I agree that lots of new content has been added over the last years, also new plants and things that tie in with the new cooking (I changed my wording a little bit while you were posting). This is definitely all great and applaudable and fun for both new and old players.

Also, I don't want to start a separate discussion as this is not my thread, just trying to get players to think more about what we really want from the devs.

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8 hours ago, Fairyshine said:

I would like to request that when animal crates come into game, all current branded permissions be reset to only owner can lead/manage/ride, so we have a choice to actually go add other people (or not).  This will ensure we can be very careful in allowing anyone any rights on our animals.

I understand your point - but no please. I would hate to set permissions again on 100+ horses on my 14 deeds.

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2 hours ago, Cista said:

 

I agree that lots of new content has been added over the last years, also new plants and things that tie in with the new cooking (I changed my wording a little bit while you were posting). This is definitely all great and applaudable and fun for both new and old players.

Also, I don't want to start a separate discussion as this is not my thread, just trying to get players to think more about what we really want from the devs.

 

You are my hero.

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3 hours ago, Cista said:

Old fart rant incoming, feel free to skip ;) (as this is more of a general rant)

...

My positive message is, let's stop pushing the devs to spend their time working on changes that only veteran players with large networks care about. Sorry that it came out harshly.

Rant over!

 

Nice little rant. :) As every good rant a little bit over the top but I agree with your main message. At this time in Wurm general game play (esp. for new-ish players) needs more attention than QoL improvements for veterans.

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I don't think anyone is saying this is a priority over other game improvements. Over the years I have seen several rants that seems to want to squash ideas and suggestions. Our job as a player community is to lay all the ideas on the table and let the devs sort them out. Only the devs have the full roadmap. I am a big fan of QoL improvements. I am also a big fan of new content. Best of all is that all of our ideas make a difference. We have done suggestions on the new player experience. We have done suggestions on a better interface. Sounds like they are listening. We just need to keep sharing any ideas and let devs figure out what to do with them. 

 

Edit: (spell checker)

Edited by Wurmhole
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Permissions systems for new players to protect themselves without a deed and for owners of deeds to allow new players to live/work on the deed without risking loss seems pretty helpful to me. 

 

There are a range of projects being worked on, the dev team all work on various tasks (and often come together to focus on any major problems or discussions) but just because one thing is being worked on (or was worked on over a year ago in this case) doesn't mean other things aren't being worked on. 

 

 

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I see the problem here being individual horse lending and I see where some people dread having to perm up dozens of horses.

 

Time for a small chariot, mayhaps?   

 

Best way to go around this sounds like (to me):

Carts and wagons (and chariots) have a permission for "can/can't" unhitch.

The chariot can't carry stuff like a cart, but can carry 2people-2horses and/or 1person-1horse with no speed penalty, as opposed to current carts which for hunts and such is why people would borrow horses instead.

 

If the chariot can't be unhitched, it becomes way, way harder to "hide until the horses starve so I can get the gear" cheap trick.  As things are now, horses can be sailed away much further.  Someone tries to steal the borrowed chariot, they'll be limited to areas they can ride to and from the point of theft, making it equally "simple" for the owner to then track down and retrieve.  Players thus would only need to keep a couple of "lending" chariots handy instead of perm'ing horses one by one.

 

I know, this ain't the suggestions' forum but there's my 2 copper.

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I am pretty sure more people leave the game when a so called "veteran" player raids their off deed area. Just saying. I personally would go the extra step here, and I've mentioned it to Retrograde sort of, that branding should be tied to the player for at least 4 animals so anyone can use it without a deed. Obviously, only 4 because people would abuse it, enough for a wagon. This could also fix issues with animal crates. Going off deed with branded horses to a event, if your horse dies it's open to getting stolen.

 

I see nothing wrong with added security. 

Edited by Niki

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7 hours ago, Retrograde said:

Permissions systems for new players to protect themselves without a deed and for owners of deeds to allow new players to live/work on the deed without risking loss seems pretty helpful to me. 

 

There are a range of projects being worked on, the dev team all work on various tasks (and often come together to focus on any major problems or discussions) but just because one thing is being worked on (or was worked on over a year ago in this case) doesn't mean other things aren't being worked on. 

 

 

Although there is no issues with adding qol improvements, its important to maintain a balance. 

 

Lets suppose I am mining off deed and suddenly forget to drink water and loose stamina because I am overburdened because of my tools, I drop them on the ground and slowly make my way to the shore to drink. On the way there, Luckystickyfingers walks by and sees the pile. He opens it and finds a bunch of tools laying around, including my rare pickaxe. He snatches them and goes on his merry way. Do we now need a permission system for dropped item bundles?

 

No. I do not think we do. What we need is people to be more careful with their things. A branded horse cannot be killed. That is a reward from the price the player pays for his deed. 

 

Luckystickyfingers lives off deed because he is a newb/poor/cheap/hermit. After collecting my loot, he hops on his horse with rare gear he found on another pile. He ambles to his off deed spot and gets off his horse. He is about to go to his bed to sleep when he remembers the gear. Now, Lucky can opt to risk his horse and gear, or he can remove the gear and put it inside his off deed home, which is secure. So he decides is a better idea to remove the gear and go to sleep assured it will be there when he comes back. He makes a note to create a stable house area for his horse when he comes back next, so he does not risks his gear anymore.

 

I am of the opinion people shouldn't be coddled into security. You wouldn't leave your rare hatchet laying on the ground next to your offdeed area. Why shouldn't we exercise the same care with our 5 speed geared horses?

Edited by Angelklaine
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I'm not really comfortable even with the vehicles and boats coming with a default lock nowadays. There was the clear and huge message to lock the stuff when created, that was more than enough. What we have now is a big bunch of non movable low ql abandoned vehicles..... I strongly agree the same careful attitude should be expected ingame that we sport in the harsh RL life.

Edited by Jaz
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Hi everyone, thanks for all the responses, ideas and even whinges.  The reason I put this here and not in the suggestions thread, is to warm people so they don't fall into the same nonsense I did, which I take responsibility for, it is my own oversight.  I think the person saying there are no real updates in Wurm is playing a different game to me, I noticed heaps of good QoL updates come through (of which remote access on permissions is one!)  I also enjoy exploring all the new content.  I do not enjoy when I get stuff I value being taken because a char was sold to someone with opportunistic tendencies, which is why I made this warning to others.  

 

This thread is merely a warning to all players that if a char is sold and you gave the name permission on branded horses, they will still have those permissions even if you remove them from your deed or alliance.  They will also still have the permissions on every item you gave them permission to unless you use the cool setting which JBerg and Retrograde shared here to remove them from at least the things you can control remotely.   If people don't value the gear on their horses (and in my case, my actual horses as well) as much as I do, it is obviously their own choice to let every Tom, ###### and Luckystickyfingers have access to their horses (or carts or ships or houses or bodies...oh wait, that is not possible unless you share passwords, right?  Moving along then.) Note that I did not ask for the devs to spend more time on this, just wanted to warn others of the situation.  If new animal moving crates come in, be aware also that you will not have branded horses if you move them to a new server. When you say it, then it seems obvious, but it is good to be mindful of when you go to a rift on another server taking your pimped steed with the possibility of losing your pimped steed because it lost its brand by going to another server.

 

Please read the thread for what it is intended to be: A warning that there are still real dodgy people out there. Like one of my friends dryly commented when he heard about all this: "Fairy, learn to make your deed settings so tight that not even an alt's fart can get through."  Well said!

 

Also,  thank you to the devs for giving me the option to protect some of my stuff from people whose intention it is to steal it.  I guess this thread can be closed now :) 

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