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LorenaMontana

The state of Epic

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16 hours ago, Oreo said:

 

Waves are going missing it appears.

 

Isn't hat what happens before a tsunami?

Doubt there's one comin'.

 

you could say it has.. dried up

 

axaxaxaxaxaxaxaxaxaxax

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17 hours ago, Morrowen said:

Yea because noobs perusing the forums is what causes them to quit and not the fact there might only be 5 people on desertion during peak times.

 

New players wouldn't even know there were 5 players online, or 200, or 1000, because their local is absolutely empty anyway.

Whatever else happens to Epic, that's one thing that really has to be reverted, paranoia be damned, new players not actually knowing other players are in their local actually drives them out.

 

Not the first time I've greeted a new player in local to have them reply 'I thought there was no one else here'....

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2 hours ago, Zenity said:

 

New players wouldn't even know there were 5 players online, or 200, or 1000, because their local is absolutely empty anyway.

Whatever else happens to Epic, that's one thing that really has to be reverted, paranoia be damned, new players not actually knowing other players are in their local actually drives them out.

 

Not the first time I've greeted a new player in local to have them reply 'I thought there was no one else here'....

Do you have an event tab?

And can you read and understand numbers?

Edited by Oreo

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19 minutes ago, Oreo said:

Do you have an event tab?

And can you read and understand numbers?

Not to speak for @Zenity or anything, but if I've read and understood correctly what you've quoted, he's using numbers right there in plain sight.  Just taking a shot in the dark, I'm gonna go out on a limb to say, "yes."  My guess is he can read and understand numbers.  At the very least numbers divisible by 5, and of course 1, in base 10.  Which brings to mind the old adage, "there are 10 kinds of people in the world: those who understand binary, and those who don't."

 

In any case, as everyone knows, the only number anyone really needs to understand is 42.

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1 hour ago, Oreo said:

Do you have an event tab?

And can you read and understand numbers?

 

Missing the point, if you're a new player, logging into any Epic server for the first time, can you tell how many players are online? Yes, by scrolling back the events tab you'll get an idea how many are on the entire cluster, but how many are in their local?

I don't see many new players buying premium before joining the server to have a look around, so due to the anti-spy measures they see absolutely no one in local, no matter how many might be there, no matter if they are friendly or enemies, they're utterly clueless unless they actually see someone, or someone speaks in local.

 

Due to the low population these days, it's unusual to see anyone typing in Kingdom or GL, (On JK at any rate,  MR and BL chats are not much livelier, judging by Wurmfeed). So it's likely any new player wil assume that they are completely alone on the server, I know to scroll back or use /who to get a read on cluster population, but will new players know that?

 

Nope, most likely they'll assume Epic is deserted, right up until the moment they actually see some chat, or see another player. This has, in my view, long been a factor in retaining new players, you know, the very people we need to retain?

 

@ReylaarkBut what's the question?

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How can you retain players when there is nobody playing there to retain? How can you gain players when the mechanics of the game are, to put it kindly, broken to hell and unbalanced.

 

Yes the devs are putting in work, this does not change the fact there is no reason to play epic since no one plays there any longer, and any tiny amount that remain have all of the OP RARE moonmetal armor that is now more common than steel plate. Unless you like to farm tomes from broken valrei events in hope of a merge all of its other features are gonna make squat diddly have any incentive to play.

 

Edited by Firecat
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I am a freedom player now guys (yes yes i know, i always stated I would be playing epic all my life)

 

I think epic took the final blow, the once famous Serenity server even has no people playing there anymore. 

 

I can't play this game when there is 10 people online, spread over 4 big servers.

 

RIP 350+ play days on Loren

 

If i only knew that epic would have died out this hard, i would never ever started there, but hey, noone can foresee the future huh :(

 

there is a ton of great accounts over there from people who love Wurm a lot, including myself and it all went poof.

 

At least there is at least Freedom nowadays which has people to talk too. (Im still shocked by how kind people are there lol)

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18 minutes ago, LorenaMontana said:

I am a freedom player now guys (yes yes i know, i always stated I would be playing epic all my life)

 

I think epic took the final blow, the once famous Serenity server even has no people playing there anymore. 

 

I can't play this game when there is 10 people online, spread over 4 big servers.

 

RIP 350+ play days on Loren

 

If i only knew that epic would have died out this hard, i would never ever started there, but hey, noone can foresee the future huh :(

 

there is a ton of great accounts over there from people who love Wurm a lot, including myself and it all went poof.

 

At least there is at least Freedom nowadays which has people to talk too. (Im still shocked by how kind people are there lol)

 

It's not dead yet...

 

As for no one logged on in Serenity, I was there a short time ago, admittedly, alone, but while there's one player continuing to log in, (And I know I wasn't the only one logged in on Serenity today), the server is not dead.

 

I continue to be one of those who log in as regularly as my Freedom life allows, (Just moved to a new deed on Indy, so had less time for Serenity unfortunately).

 

I don't have a great character on Serenity, just an adequate one that compares almost equally with my Freedom one, and is about the same age and playtime.

 

It's only dead when it's closed forever, until then, I'll continue to play there, despite the problems low population cause.

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Pvp on epic, not chaos, sounds like it could be interesting only because of the epic curve and how its like island vs island (At least thats what i've heard). If I could sleep on freedom and play on epic with one character then I would join in and mess around on epic A LOT more often. But since going on epic slows down my progress on pve, no point in trying it.

 

Edit: When i say "A LOT more often" I mean more than the cooldown to switch between epic and freedom. I seriously only stepped on to use the silver hand mirror because I had regret how ugly I looked.

Edited by Yiraia
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thats how it should be imo, let players who dont want to pvp that week go enjoy freedom and chill and those that seek adventure carry on over to epic.

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At this point I see no reason to limit the playerbase. Is not like the epic curve lets you level any faster. In fact, with mentoring, you level faster on freedom. 

 

I am sure it would allow for for content and more enjoyment on both sides.

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1 hour ago, Angelklaine said:

Is not like the epic curve lets you level any faster. In fact, with mentoring, you level faster on freedom. 

I thought pvp was the less grindy version of wurm with pvp events. If pvp is just as grindy, or even more grindy, then I'm gonna pass .-. PvE is already grindy enough

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15 minutes ago, Yiraia said:

I thought pvp was the less grindy version of wurm with pvp events. If pvp is just as grindy, or even more grindy, then I'm gonna pass .-. PvE is already grindy enough

Epic is no more grindy than Freedom is, the effective skill curve is a complication, that's all, but without the 2x skillgain it would definitely be more grindy than Freedom, since the 2x skillgain is required to offset the skilling problems caused by the effective skill curve.

 

But it's not something I've ever worried about, but then I play wurm to relax and have fun, so I don't grind anyway, (yeah, I know, not terribly hardcore PvP of me, but I'm not terribly hardcore PvP anyway).

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11 hours ago, Angelklaine said:

At this point I see no reason to limit the playerbase. Is not like the epic curve lets you level any faster. In fact, with mentoring, you level faster on freedom. 

 

I am sure it would allow for for content and more enjoyment on both sides.

You gain skills twice as fast in Epic, so enough of that nonsense about Epic being more difficult to grind than Freedom. It was designed to be faster and easier (and then somehow ruined by adding restrictions).

 

If you are saying that Epic is harder to raise skills, then why does epic even exists? shut it down today and focus on chaos, the "fast grinding server".

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3 hours ago, Rathgar said:

You gain skills twice as fast in Epic, so enough of that nonsense about Epic being more difficult to grind than Freedom. It was designed to be faster and easier (and then somehow ruined by adding restrictions).

 

If you are saying that Epic is harder to raise skills, then why does epic even exists? shut it down today and focus on chaos, the "fast grinding server".

 

grinding meditating on epic is way more difficult than on freedom due to the DIFFICULTY curve giving you a higher difficulty.

Edited by Firecat

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1 hour ago, Firecat said:

 

grinding meditating on epic is way more difficult than on freedom due to the curve giving you a higher difficulty.

 The same can be said of any skill on the curve, you gain skill at the level of your effective skill, meaning lower skill gain than your numeric skill would suggest, I believe that's why Epic has the 2x skillgain in place, because effective skill alone would slow down skillgain overall.

 

But I haven't done the math, so it may just be a feeling without a firm foundation.

 

Either way, I have two main characters, one who's played almost exclusively on Freedom cluster, one on Epic cluster, both have about the same playtime, and both are close to the same skill levels, I'm pretty sure this is due to my more relaxed style of play that does not focus on developing particular skills by grinding, Epic does make it easier to do stuff, because you can craft and gather resources above your Freedom, numeric skill level, but that's not the same as being high skilled in those areas, that's purely the effect of the effective skill curve.

 

But the main point is correct, the effective skill curve does mean players on Epic are faced with higher difficulty when compared with vanilla freedom skillgain, another case in point would be something we're all probably familiar with, mining, we all know that up to 50 skill stone and iron is great for skilling, except, on Epic once you reach 30 skill you need to switch to higher difficulty ores, because your effective skill is actually 50 by then, so your skill gains slow as if you had actually reached 50 skill. Which means that from 80 skill in Epic you'll be mining gold for skill, because everything else is below your effective skill level.

 

It's not as simple as '2x skill gain makes it easier to gain skill' without taking account of the underlying effective skill curve, nor is it just confined to a couple of particular skills either.

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There's a bit of misconception with how the curve affects skillgain, but the really simple answer is:

It makes your effective skill higher so low difficulty actions exceed the 1-40 roll more often.

 

For skills in which the difficulty can be pushed upwards it is more effective, but for low difficulty things (such as creation skills and meditation) you overshoot that 1-40 roll sooner and thus less ticks. 

 

some skill thresholds require actual skill, not effective skill. This means things like meditation, to ascend to the next level you need the actual skill of say 70, but that means you have an effective skill of 90.

 

Anyone who has worked on meditation past 70 will be aware how infrequent ticks are due to high skill vs low difficulty, meaning it takes longer to gain the skills needed. This comes into effect at 50 for epic, which is the reason it's considered extremely slow compared to freedom.

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5 minutes ago, Retrograde said:

There's a bit of misconception with how the curve affects skillgain, but the really simple answer is:

It makes your effective skill higher so low difficulty actions exceed the 1-40 roll more often.

 

For skills in which the difficulty can be pushed upwards it is more effective, but for low difficulty things (such as creation skills and meditation) you overshoot that 1-40 roll sooner and thus less ticks. 

 

some skill thresholds require actual skill, not effective skill. This means things like meditation, to ascend to the next level you need the actual skill of say 70, but that means you have an effective skill of 90.

 

Anyone who has worked on meditation past 70 will be aware how infrequent ticks are due to high skill vs low difficulty, meaning it takes longer to gain the skills needed. This comes into effect at 50 for epic, which is the reason it's considered extremely slow compared to freedom.

Not really, on my path from 1-97 in meditation(on freedom tho) the frequency of ticks has stayed the same(when you manage your rug ql correctly)... only the ticksize has lowered.

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yes but on EPIC you will get less skill ticks past 70 since the difficulty created by the curve causes you to fail more (since 70 is about 90 effective skill roughly)

 

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23 minutes ago, Firecat said:

yes but on EPIC you will get less skill ticks past 70 since the difficulty created by the curve causes you to fail more (since 70 is about 90 effective skill roughly)

 

Yes, depending on the skill. 

 

With imping skills/farming/mining/other things with an action at higher difficulty it's easy to push the difficulty up high enough to continue to receive the same frequency of ticks as on freedom.

 

For things with a lower difficulty like meditation it hurts more than it helps. 

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