A response to Enki - How soft and pointless has PvP become.

[FranktheTank 1,901]

6 hours ago, Carmichael said:

Every year it's something new that people come up with and it ends up being useless and/or abused within the next year. This is just another rinse/repeat.

A lot of the problems people have have been persistent issues that have been growing over time. Most seemed tied to the games economy being based so deeply in real value.

[JockII 338]

2 minutes ago, FranktheTank said:

A lot of the problems people have have been persistent issues that have been growing over time. Most seemed tied to the games economy being based so deeply in real value.

See I have no issues with it being tied to a to economy but it's the lack of any meaningful content to sink your teeth into. Lack of item sinks and good circulation of silver.

 

Many of these things need a change. I have only ever seen deed s accumulate more and more crap and the largest zerg for PvP wins asbthey have the most crap.

 

Often the worst part is rare armour is almost become a requirement to PvP. Chain leather and normal plate are out matched.

 

Chain once was a viable option. Plate had the Dr but the fear of a calf shot removed alot of the hindering effects.

 

Bring back calf shots and he major slow. Reshape champions around making them more valuable rather than a 60dr trinket.

 

Add in new objective points or control zones that give a reward for holding them. Spread out to prevent full monopolies.

 

So much needs adjusting to rebuild PvP and the wurm economy.

 

[Banzai 664]

On 6/25/2017 at 3:04 AM, Bloodscythe said:

The pvp aspect to wurm is the height of wurm expression as it allows the full spectrum of all the game mechanics and offerings of abilities and features.  Most of the time it is a far more rewarding experience then forums would have you think and so much more cooperation, trust, and team work than, ironically , the freedom servers non pvp.  I like pvp and pve for their differences equally.  

 

one note:  I can't help but think the loot value and ability to secure on freedom server for chaos vs epic cluster non secure way to bring to home server but still be hunted down is at the root of why you see more deeply cutting personal attacks, deeper hatred, and as a result, actions that go beyond the game mechanics intentions in getting that loot.  ie Cancer.

 

As a parlay of that supposition, I interpret Enki's latest missive to be about sorting normal pvp action to actions with intents and game play beyond the scope of mechanics and intentions.  In the past,  the "hard line" was did they do actions outside of game realm or did they subvert/thwart/hack game mechanics to achieve results.  That is something definitively understandable to game players and staff alike.  If I read into correctly,  It seems now added is the notion of intent like on pve server of play nice or rip your heart out notion that if actions are determined to have intent beyond game play rules/and intention that could also be subject to ban penalty.  That is a slippery slope which i think many players fear and will cause great confusion and uncertainty.  I believe we've now crossed into that arena in an attempt to stymie corrupt players if you will and behavior not fitting of the game..whatever that has come to mean.

 

I'm not sure I have this right, yet that is my read.  If I have it right, this is going to be very very hard on staff mostly to debate and conclude, and very very frustrating to players causing even further erosion of faith in the game and staff.  This looks like a bad direction to be heading into.

 

I have no solutions to offer yet will add that over the time I've played there have been ongoing instances across many kingdoms doing nefarious actions to steal avatars against others will and potentially illegally, as well as loot in this manner in a way most can see was beyond the call of intention, spirit, rules of the game.  we've seen people infiltrate deeds/alliances for sole purpose to do harm/sabotage/theft on pve side.  On pvp side there was less of that style until the last couple of years bewildering players.  collectively the vast majority of these extreme cases,player base and staff alike could agree offense was done beyond the call of the game and threatens the future of the game and players yet few can agree on the solutions.  

 

Seems also an attempt now is being made to prevent the climate existing like in the game EVE.  I've not played EVE, yet knew a a person in wurm pvp who did.  They took that mindset to wurm and also the actions.  To them,  an aspect of the game was to at any cost attack,infiltrate,take by means of ddosing ip's, outside game forums and voips manipulation, planting characters in enemy kingdoms with sole purpose to use them to gain access to valuable loot and sabotage deeds.   This also happened on freedom side as well.  That mentality is fully acceptable and expected in EVE as de rigueur.  I think it is that very thing wurm now struggles with how to isolate.  ultimately it is up to players, as to which type of game experience it is you want.  I know I've taken my hits and dislikes, and targeted by other actions to malign for standing up against mean spirited, intentionally abusive actions and players, as such made my stance of how i choose to play whether on pvp or pve server.

 

Basically.

[Lumbro 3]

Here is a random idea on how theft could be alleviated, without recourse to disconnecting the PvP and PvE servers.

 

Have a non-trivial means to mark an item with an owner label. This can be either the name of a player or a deed.

 

When transferring said item, either via merchant, player to player transfer, or mail, the sender can set an option to transfer ownership label to the receiver. Only the owner or member of the deed (with appropriate rights) can do this. The receiver is told what items he is getting that still have someone elses owner label, before he accepts, so can go ahead or not, if he is happy. Branding an animal for instance would count as giving that animal an owner label.

 

On PvP servers this confers no benefits.

 

On PvE servers a new spell when cast on another player (important, it must be castable on someone else) gives them a list of items on this freedom server, that are not in their possession or not on the deed that owns them, then lets them pick one from the list and have it teleport into their inventory, or if too large for inventory, simply tells them where it is or maybe teleports it next to them.

 

The owner has the right to pick up or mount or whatever the item, no matter where it is. Only a lock can stop them getting to it, in which case they can ask a GM to intervene.

 

Wouldn't something like this put the response to theft back in the player's hands, and potentially reduce GM workload?

[Lumbro 3]

On a PvP server, the new spell might help you find what freedom server the item has fled to. in some to be determined way

[Klaa 4,872]

Reads like the usual fine line or grey area of Wurm PvP right up until the mention of the offender running off to a pve server with the stuff.

 

Overall sounds like GM intervention was justified personally.

 

Another good example of situations requiring a human touch.

[JockII 338]

Finally having access to my account again. I may or may not have forgotten what email I linked it to.

 

Anyway, having read this thread and taken alot of it in. I will be renting a dedicated server for the purpose of trialing and implementing some of the discussed ideas in a WU world.

 

Hoping to attain to 3 server attached in a PvE-Home server-PvP. The principle is to create a Less direct and timely moving of goods from pvp to pve with a transitional Enemy homeserver(s).