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ChampagneDragon

Public Drama.

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As many of you know from chat I deeded Kimico's deed in an attempt to keep it for her return. There were many attempts to contact her, and not one thing has (had) been removed from it. This is the LAST message to Kimi on June 15:

 

Kimi,

 

i slapped a deed right in the middle of yours that disbanded. It's not being used, just a "save it". I figure if you don't come back I'll take it over. If you do, let me know and I'll instantly disband so you can have it all back. I just didn't want it to go to someone else.

 

The deed is being held in Salacia's name. She's my alt.

 

I discussed this in public chat. I did not hide what I was doing. As stated, not one thing has (had) been removed from said deed. The only significant change was to bash gates so I could put a lock on them. I can not deed the actual fences as buildings block it, but have deeded the max allowed. I also put signs EVERYWHERE ( 18 of them to be exact) stating: New Ownership ChampagneDragon.  Some say New Ownership PST ChampagneDragon.

 

Indy has always honored off deed fences, or at least most of Indy has, which is why I put the signs up.

 

Today I had a lot of RL stuff going. I came home to this message:

 

Why did you fence in Kimico's and Shenzo's deed honeydo? That's really messed up, I get that it disbanded from lack of upkeep are you that hard up to loot her deed? 

 

Seriously? 

 

This person had no "skin in the game" so to speak, but I explained what was going on, despite the attack.

 

So as soon as I could I logged into game and see fences bashed and horses taken. 

 

I am asking for those horses to be returned. They were five speed jets and bloodbays.  You can also bring me the bricks to fix the fence you busted despite it clearly being signed as belonging to me.

 

Thank you.

 

 

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Upon further review of the facts, this comment can be deleted. 

Edited by Matholameu

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What if the person is a friend of the old owner "Kimico" and is making sure they're completely aware there deed has been ransacked.

 

While it's fine to take stuff from disbanded deeds this game actually seems to encourage it. Maybe that person who sees her friends deed completely fenced in gets the feeling that person is just trying to loot the place when the buildings go down?  I've seen it a million times before, making a public display like this when it could of been handled in tells seems wrong to do. I'm not a fan of people actually fencing in deeds to loot them at any rate.

 

From a normal person's perspective it looks like your trying to loot the place before anyone else planted a small deed and moved some stuff on it looks like. The old enclosure rule doesn't apply anymore. People are allowed and will break in to off deed fences. Deed it or loose it, unless the rules change, nothing was broken here.

 

Nothing is stopping others from bashing the walls to take horses, if you "really are trying to help her" maybe you should move the Kimico cared for horses on deed and fence them in, also maybe you should contact her in RL or on Steam if you know her that well, I don't think you do. 

 

 You shouldn't assume anything, and passing blame on others when you clearly don't know there intentions isn't fair. This thread is pointless. I'm sure Kimico wouldn't be happy about her deed in it's current state is all I'm going to say.

 

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Actually by blocking access to buildings you do not own with fences you are breaking the rules.

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41 minutes ago, JakeRivers said:

Actually by blocking access to buildings you do not own with fences you are breaking the rules.

 

Actually, the fences were there. I changed the locks on two gates so I could get in and out. The rest still belong to Kimi.

 

I am getting REALLY sick of being harassed by Niki. I have not been called this many names in a long time, but of course, only where others can't see them.

 

The buildings have not been touched. Nothing has been moved or changed on her deed, with the exception of planting some crops where she used to have her fields, since my alt is staying there. 

 

Well, except a couple horses that disappeared today during the two hours I was logged off, along with sections of fencing, which were admitted to being broke down in tells tonight. 

 

Such a good friend, but had no idea those fences were put in place by Kimi? Yea. OK.

Edited by ChampagneDragon

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If she was going to keep the deed she'd have put upkeep into the deed or given the deed to someone else and let them housesit.

 

If you're gonna ransack the place be upfront about it. I might come through and repair every wall, if you don't mind.

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1 hour ago, ChampagneDragon said:

 

Actually, the fences were there. I changed the locks on two gates so I could get in and out. The rest still belong to Kimi.

 

I am getting REALLY sick of being harassed by Niki. I have not been called this many names in a long time, but of course, only where others can't see them.

 

The buildings have not been touched. Nothing has been moved or changed on her deed, with the exception of planting some crops where she used to have her fields, since my alt is staying there. 

 

Well, except a couple horses that disappeared today during the two hours I was logged off, along with sections of fencing, which were admitted to being broke down in tells tonight. 

 

Such a good friend, but had no idea those fences were put in place by Kimi? Yea. OK.

Sometimes trying to be too nice, only gets you in trouble, I learned this early on. In most cases, those seeking to do harm are the ones yelling at you simply because you're blocking their attempts to cause harm. Sadly they make claims making you seem like the bad guy here. 

Since looting a disbanded deed is not against any rules you're better off just taking what you can,  and moving on, and like @Oblivionnreaver  said, if they wanted and cared enough about the deed, they wouldn't have let it fall. 

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No good deed goes unpunished

 

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I used to do a lot of deed salvaging and have met every type of person in the process. Some completely agree with the practice and will give you friendly competition, some think it is reprehensible and will try every way to stop you so they can protect their friends stuff. Then there are those who will say they are trying to protect their friends stuff but really just want it for themselves.

 

But your options are the same no matter what type of person you encounter: take anything you can (as long as it's not a bug) and you are allowed to do so. Perimeter over any buildings, fence or house any objects, lead or slaughter animals, do as you please. As long as you don't prevent access to the owner then you are fine. If you want, make a note of what you retrieved so you can pay the owner back when they return, or don't. I wouldn't bother explaining yourself to anyone more than you absolutely have to because everyone is going to have an opinion and none of them can read your heart.

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1 hour ago, Aeryck said:

everyone is going to have an opinion and none of them can read your heart.

That's some deep shizzz!

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Sounds like a good place to camp for loots.

 

Have battering ram, will travel.

 

=p

 

 

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A plan is in motion. That's all I'll say on it until it's done.

 

I do want to ask this then: is bashing fences off deed, when it's clearly "someone's deed" something we do on this server? I have always been told it's a risk, but as we're a bit more mature community people respect off deed fences. I put signs EVERYWHERE stating that it was my deed. Those signs were ignored by Niki, and premium horses taken from the deed, then an attack to me the only way she was able. 

 

Are we REALLY that server? Do we want to be? I know plenty of you throwing shade here who have off deed fences...

 

That's all I have to say on that. 

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It's something atleast one person in every server will do, if you put up a bunch of signs after you took someones disbanded deed area don't expect people who were friends with the original owner to respect your off deed fences and signs. Obviously they weren't on deed otherwise permissions would have prevented her from taking them, unless you've got her on your friends list which is your own problem.

 

People may be throwing shade, but they aren't deeding over old property and claiming their pre-existing off deed fences as their own so people aren't going to go out of their way to bash them unless they'res something valuable on the other side.

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Already offered 50 mortar and 50 bricks, well over the total repair damage for that fence section, I even told you where to get them the bsb is set to you! Set to both of your characters even!

 

 I also apologized many times for the fence that isn't on "anyone's" deed! You littteraly placed a tiny deed in the center so you can raise the buildings faster even!

 

 Most people don't even go out of there way or care. This whole thing is blown out of portion because you're upset I didn't respect your enclosure, 1). I don't think you have good intentions,  2). I shouldn't of even bothered asking why you did what you did. It was a mistake, but out of frustration of seeing locked gates and fences that weren't there last time I was here I did message you wondering why.  3). You lost your case when you got super rude when you first messaged me back making me very suspicious that you actually wanted to help. 4). You added someone else to the conversation to try to convince me that your trying to help her. 

 

 I hope Kimico comes back and you do in fact have good intentions then you can call me whatever offensive things you want but you even have already resorted to name calling in freedom chat, but I'm a pretty hard person to convince right now. You also resort to saying I'm offensive to you? Here is the pastebin people! Facts all laid out. https://pastebin.com/yN6ZpXxM I've remove names of others not involved.

 

 Are you mad because I don't believe you? Sorry? Okay. But yeah I do have a problem with you taking her stuff as I would if anyone took a good friend of mine's belongings. Somtimes RL happens, bills can't be paid, it sucks when those people come back to find they are starting back with nothing. So whatever the plan is you're doing I hope it helps her, I don't know you at all seriously, the only thing I know about you is you chat a lot in freedom.

 

I think you got mad for no reason, I'm not even sure why you are mad if were both trying to help her.  Have you known her as long as I have? 


Let me tell you things would of gone differently if you were more polite in my initial message.

 

1ceded844b83f426ae5fc8ee2e305ae9.png

 

When you said that, I did in fact break a section of wall to see for myself, I don't find this rule breaking either, even asked a staff member if I was wrong to do that. After that then proceeded to go home.

 

 

Stop trying to make me the villain in your nonsense, cause it's ridiculous now and you're construing the facts. I will fact check and defend myself. This endgame over horses? Pathetic. Learn to breed your own.

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lol I love that there are people following this thread. Please devs, more content patches so we have something to occupy our attention.

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38 minutes ago, Niki said:

 

1ceded844b83f426ae5fc8ee2e305ae9.png

 

Let's just say that you weren't too polite with your first private message to Champagne either, so with such blaming I wouldn't have probably answered you either. 

 

However, I care not of the drama which is obviously between you two and I believe no one else cares too. So how about you solve this problem in private messages now on. :) 

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Was not destroying the fence to get the horses not against rules itself ?

I was under the impression you had to wait for access to any deed fenced in by naturel decay not character help?

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13 minutes ago, Damascus said:

Was not destroying the fence to get the horses not against rules itself ?

I was under the impression you had to wait for access to any deed fenced in by naturel decay not character help?

Bashing fences is only against the rules if they're on deed. 

 

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55 minutes ago, Damascus said:

Was not destroying the fence to get the horses not against rules itself ?

I was under the impression you had to wait for access to any deed fenced in by naturel decay not character help?

 

You can bash fences off deed. Indy has always had a gentleman's code that says you leave someone's off deed fences alone. It's clear by some of the responses that some people wouldn't care if their off deed fences were bashed.

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So your saying soon as a deed drops for any reason I can go bash the fence down and take what ever is there?

 

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28 minutes ago, Damascus said:

So your saying soon as a deed drops for any reason I can go bash the fence down and take what ever is there?

 

Yes, just can't bash buildings. 

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1 hour ago, ChampagneDragon said:

 

 Indy has always had a gentleman's code that says you leave someone's off deed fences alone.

Never had something like that.

 

If that's the case, should I make a thread every time my neighbor does it to me? No. It's legal. 

 

If by chance the enclosure rule is brought back, things will change.

Edited by Niki

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1 hour ago, Damascus said:

So your saying soon as a deed drops for any reason I can go bash the fence down and take what ever is there?

 

That's always been the case. It's legal.

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3 hours ago, Niki said:

Never had something like that.

 

If that's the case, should I make a thread every time my neighbor does it to me? No. It's legal. 

 

 

Just because it's legal does not mean it's right. 

 

I know plenty who have off deed areas. In fact, if we went around bashing everyone's off deed fences the new players wouldn't stand a chance. Many quickly build a fence to keep their one or two animals while they get funds to deed. Some never deed. 

 

IMO it's no different  than if you found your neighbor's purse they dropped. You wouldn't go "ohh gee, it's not locked up. It's on the ground. Fair game. " I would hope you'd return it. Of course, some wouldn't, but people of integrity would.

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Wow.

 

As a neighbor of Kimico's, and having spoken to her apparently just before she last logged in, i know she didn't have plans of this disbanding, so something must have come up.  That deed was her pride and joy. And she loved it here. She didn't quit by choice. ChampagneDragon seems to have been drug through the ringer on this for trying to help a mutual friend.   That place is enormous. And she was introducing a friend to the game, so something came up.  In that instance, we should do our best to support our friends and help them keep what was once theirs until they return. I know a few players who would agree with me on this. I've had people do it for me when i had to leave for unforseen circumstances and while I didnt ask them to do it, they did. It's what friends do and it's the neighborly thing to do when someone stops playing unannounced.  I know she had new things going on in life and any number of things could have occurred.

 

So, my two cents, I see nothing wrong with what CD did. I would have done the same or even moved them over to my deed to safe keeping, but none of it was done without public knowledge and chat logs would show that.  I commend CD for trying to do something for a friend.  It's the right thing to do on Wurm, as long as we dont break any rules doing it.

 

Too much arguing about the way things were done and not enough 'hey let's help a neighbor who worked her butt off to get where she was with all of those horses'.

 

Look at it this way too. If your neighbor in real life went on an extended vacation unannounced, would you bash their fences or hop the fence to acquire what was in their backyard? I think not.

 

Edited by KageTenshi

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