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Darklords

Epic Cluster Suggestions Thread

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Posted (edited)

Since the Epic Server Cluster seems to be a focus according to the new road map I figured a thread to discuss some of them was not a terrible idea, if you have issues with a specific suggestion not just from the original post but later posts make sure to let people know which suggestion you have an issue with as I hope there will be more than just my suggestions on how to make the epic cluster shine again in this thread.

 

Some of my starting points are, and all of these would be Epic exclusive for a note none of this would trickle onto freedom/chaos.

 

1)On DESO 3, one of my favorite things was the GM protected bridges connecting all the islands together, I feel this could do wonders for the Elevation Server.  Imagine this, you see enemy's with regular horses you can safety assume they may have come on boats and are forced onto slower horses than defenders of that island, but an enemy comes across on named hell horses and its safe to assume they may have crossed on a gm protected bridge.  I know a lot of bridges exist that are deeded already since it was a forced meta to start but if 2~ bridges to each island existed with protections like hota(no building/terraforming) it would allow people multiple options to roam enemy lands without needing to have a deed to protect it or force a boat trip to it with maybe 1 option max to cross.  Maybe even existing deeded land bridges could be disbanded and turned into gm protected bridges for the good of the server so a requirement for roaming enemy lands is not you need a deed to protect it from an enemy deeding your entrance to an island like currently or at least if you have a deeded entrance

 

2)Reduction in meditation requirements(Some of this was taken from a recent post gary made that I 100% agree with I'm sure others have suggested it in the past but I'm adding it for the sake of discussion).  I would like to see the 3 hours cool down past X meditates removed it should allow a user to meditate every 30 mins(can even make it an hour+ if balance forced it) so its not such a hard requirement that has a ton of random elements in it and let people hit get decent meditations levels without waiting very random amounts of time, I used to med every day on epic and I have gone 4+ days without a single tick in the 30 min window before. It can be so discouraging when you hit the 3 hour window in the higher levels and it being epic seems strange that post people seem to agree that meditation is quicker on freedom because the curve seems to punish higher level mediation because of how the curve works based on effective levels dictating the frequency of the ticks.

 

Also on that note it takes 166 Days 12 hours minimum if your doing things perfect(without enlightenment but we all now past level 6 atm its almost impossible) to hit the max tier of meditation paths that the main perks people rely on lie on even if you decide to switch, my suggestion is that once you hit a certain meditation level one time it cuts the wait period by half(or more) if you switch paths later and try to hit that same level, so say you hit level 11 insanity before instead of 116 days to switch it may take you 56 days or less this allows the feeling of progression to stay while letting a player switch in a somewhat reasonable time frame later on. This would allow with enlightenment + normal med ticks for it to at max take 2 months and at min take around 38 days to hit the same level 11 on a new path without giving it to you free.

 

3)This may go into the meditation re-balance but all paths should have some kind of scaling perks of the main focus like insanity so there is a feeling of usefulness like you made the great change to insanity to do.  Not that the other paths dont need some love on the pvp side but with insanity currently giving huge perks at a small scale at lower levels if the other paths do not follow the same there is little chance they will be adopted over the dominant path currently.

 

4)Currently accounts that are multiple years old have such a body strength advantage that a new account joining cannot hope to get close to the pvp competitiveness required to stand any kind of a chance I have 3 suggestions to help with this

A)Give the body stats a slight curve to help newer players get into the mid tier body stats(~35-40) a 2x faster to catch up to the long existing accounts

B)Reducing on epic only the offensive and defensive bonus given per body strength level

C)Splitting body strength up so it does not give such massive both offensive and defensive bonus together

Or some combination of them.

 

5)Re-balancing of the king system, currently the system to force out an unwanted king is just plain broken also the system to decide a new king is also extremely broken. I am not 100% sure what would be optional for something like this so I brought up the issue for a hopeful better suggestion that I have because I am not real happy with anything I've been thinking of but my ideas are.  For new kings, instead of stats based 1 per day random roll of the dice it comes down to people who have been premium 3+ months in a row voting on a new king I am sure there is issues with this which is why I am not 100% sure on this. As far as removing a king, the current system is a great idea a majority of people(I suggest 3+ month subbed) want to vote them out a time and date is set and a fight happens in the duel ring but currently I have never seen this system work properly and from what I understand it takes months because they can decline multiple attempt, while there needs to be limits on this if a majority of the server votes to kick the king out the current system seems more than fair everyone vs the people who want them to be king I don't know the exact system to make it happen but I would love to see a safe(so other kingdoms cannot crash it) system for a inter kingdom brawl to decide if the majority of the server wants the current king.

 

6)Champs being reduced from 6 months/3 lives/6month cool down to 1-3 months/3-5 lives/2-3 month cooldown, I know something like this will be very controversial but people being able force hold a slot for so many months even past them losing 2 lives is silly if you don't die in wurm 3 times in 3 months than your clearly not pvping much or holding onto it a little to tight. increasing the lives lets the reduced time feel like less of a burden you can go out and pvp more without feeling like those few deaths will make you useless or degrade your account so quickly.

 

Also on this note, currently if a champ stays logged out after they should dechamp they will not lose champ status till they log back in this needs fixed to where even logged out when there time ends it forces them out its just plain broken how it is.  I have personal experience with this when I quit epic for chaos I was a champ and I was a champ several weeks past my deadline and I had to login and dechamp my self as to not hold the slot up for other but for some one who may have quit for good or have bad intentioons they can abuse this currently.

 

7)Valrei currently is a lottery based system with no way to know who has what points please feel free to argue against it but I feel it should be more of a who does the most to help it system even if its village/alliance based like HOTA, the top 3 villages/alliances or something who helps win the valrei should each get a charge with some king of high score so people know who is doing what.  I have spent so much time hundred or so hours doing valrei missions over 3 years and I won 1 time out of hundreds of missions I've done, in a kingdom with so many people like jk doing missions I have done so many missions personally only to have it given to other players who I have seen do 1 or so missions random is just so degrading to people who spend a ton of time working.

 

 

Some people may disagree with some of my points and that great!  This thread should be about getting everyone's personal feelings about changes out!  Not 1 person will make Epic great again(gigity) but only the community as a large coming together and debating issues together because as I have learned not 1 persons perspective will matter no matter how much you believe it to be true.  If we don't come together as the epic/pvp community the developers will be working blind trying random things they think will work I don't care if you disagree with everything I said above I want and encourage you to write an equally as long or longer post telling me how stupid my ideas are because the more debate we give them the better off things will be.  We need everyone's option small and large to make wurm pvp the best it can be.  I suggest we use the Epic Cluster as a testing ground to see what we can do since it is already so barren and is ripe for radical changes without disturbing a ton of people(like chaos + freedom connection).

 

Please keep this thread civil and don't use personal attack on people, your free to disagree with points some one made but please try and keep this thread productive and not devolve into just -1 I hate you I ask that you give a detailed reply and not just say I disagree if you disagree please try your best to give a reason so the discussion can continue.

Edited by Darklords
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I would like the ability to transfer my freedom skills to epic as a one time transfer. That alone might get more people to play on epic from the freedom cluster.

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Posted (edited)

19 minutes ago, Mavv said:

I would like the ability to transfer my freedom skills to epic as a one time transfer. That alone might get more people to play on epic from the freedom cluster.

 

I like this idea a lot, but the only thing that bothers me is more people would try Epic instead of Chaos for PvP since they can just portal there and back.  No reason to take a chance sailing Chaos waters which is the scariest part for any noob.

 

Sucks there are 2 PvP servers and not just 1.

 

Be nice to be able to just portal back and forth to Chaos deed.

Edited by nicedreams
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In a perfect world epic would be the only pvp server. Its much easier to make adjustments to pvp if your not affecting the pve side of things.

 

Note I'm not a pvper so my opinion doesn't really hold much weight.

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-1 As late as it is, devs should cut their loses and shut down epic, then focus on chaos and freedom.

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11 minutes ago, Rathgar said:

-1 As late as it is, devs should cut their loses and shut down epic, then focus on chaos and freedom.

With option to transfer characters first, from Epic to Chaos?

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1 hour ago, Wilczan said:

With option to transfer characters first, from Epic to Chaos?

Thats not something I could decide, and probably nothing players could decide, since Devs would do what they think its right and thats it.

 

If its up to me, sure, lower the skills to a freedom equivalent, to compensate for fast skill gain, and transfer your characters.  Heck, shut down Xanadu while we are at it, I think Wurm needs some lands downsize.

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Darklords, interesting post, a lot of what you say kinda has ramifications in the philosophy of game design. MMO's have vastly different philosophies than single players and WURM has seen a lot of development over the years. Its greatest asset : potential. Its greatest flaw : not taking advantage of all of it. But how? Aye there's the rub. So let me say a few things about your ideas. 

 

1. Gm protected bridges, not sure such a good idea on a pvp server. The whole idea is that pvpers use the terrain to their advantage, and yes there is also the potential for griefing bridges. What if someone wants to set a trap up at a bridge (which historically happened quite a few times) and wants to build some quick fences to trap in enemies or slow their advance? It's a blade that can cut both ways. 

 

2. Body strength-  currently i don't think Body str has such a big advantage on a Epic server since we get like what: twice as little damage dealt against creatures and players versus what freedom gets? And it's like a 2.5 % difference in dmg of a 50 bstr fighter vs a 70 body str fighter (my math may not be 100% correct).  So we're in the philosophy of somehow debating of whether new players should get a huge skill boost to catch up to older players. But what about the older players that spent years playing and earning high stats. I would agree to a skill boost to new players as long as the old players who have high stats get some other reward to make up for it . (maybe free skill points to distribute in nature skills, i dunno). 

 

3. Meditation - I saw gary and zeke's posts on the subject, all good ideas, devs need to look at them and make it happen one day.

 

4. Champs - I'm not sure what to say.

 

5. King - not sure either. 

 

6. Valrei - think the best thing would be to realistically build a new system from scratch rather than fix a broken one. Comes a time when you just can't put anymore nails in rotten wood, better to build a new chair.  Maybe other rewards than just Permanent boost items or silly wands. How about something like a bag of Skillgain bottles - + 100% skillgain for 1 hour for people. Could easily make it in tiers Player with highest scenario pts - Gets big prize. 2nd prize maybe a rare bone. 3rd prize, bag of skillgain, etc. You get the idea.

 

7.As for transferring characters between freedom and epic, I do not honestly know what to say about this, but I feel like i would have wasted a lot of my times grinding my skills on Epic if they were nerfed to freedom. What would be the math behind it? How would you factor all the variables? Did I grind for 1 week with Sleep bonus on or off? Did I use CoC tools? Did I grind on higher or lower difficulty items? I heard someone telling me that after 70 skill on epic and freedom skillgain is roughly the same due to the Epic curve (treating 70 skill as effective 90, thus giving you little skillgain after 90). Does my 90 weapon smithing become 45 on freedom? Does it become 60? I'm not a math wiz , I am sure it's possible to make an equation to transform epic skills into freedom ones, but it has to be done damn right unless you want to screw over a lot of people.

 

So, in a nutshell, Valrei - reworked, Meditation - definitely reworked. King - people with more experience and lore should decide. Transfering chars between epic - freedom - it's a math doozy, good luck with that. If one day they decide to delete epic or close it sure, i might play on freedom. 

 

 

 

 

 

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+1 to everything that revives epic 

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I agree.  Either have Epic or Chaos.  Not both.

 

I think more people would want to try Epic since you can portal there.  Seems bigger and more fun mobs to kill too.

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Chaos People wont leave Chaos. Epic people wont leave Epic. Best compromise would be to make a brand new PvP server where both servers can join, new slate so to speak. Maybe with Ausimus as a dev he can give new pointers how to make a cool map for pvp. 

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Please don't make every single Epic thread on this forum a discussion about whether it should be shut down lol. I think we've all heard plenty of people say they want Epic to be closed. The opinion has been heard. The decision has been made.

 

Let's at least keep this one Epic Suggestions thread free of this constant "It should be closed" stuff. It's honestly getting annoying.

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I'm not saying it should be close or deleted, or chaos either. I'm just preparing myself mentally for it :D 

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Positive Epic suggestion then is to allow us that one time skills transfer to Epic from Freedom so you don't have to start all over again when trying out Epic.  Then the curve can take over from there and not transfer back to freedom.

 

I already went to Epic for 1 day during the first few months I started Wurm.  I hope if they do something like this it doesn't mean I'm screwed on Epic now and can't match skills over. :P

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