thorgot

Higher Animal Husbandry makes it harder to breed good horses

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It's long been an open secret that higher skill makes it harder to breed 5 speed horses. Now, using the WU code to simulate tens of thousands of children we know exactly how backwards this system is. When breeding horses you want them to have the same traits, so all below percentages assume the parents have the same traits as each other and are not related.

 

Let's say Dobby the House Elf wants to breed horses. Say hello to Dobby:

 

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When the very handsome Dobby breeds his 5 speed horses, all he cares about the offspring is if they are 5 speed and have no negative traits, because that means the horse is ideal for riding. The odds of breeding 5 speed horses with no negative traits:

 

Skill Parent Traits Chance of 5 speed offspring with no negative traits
50 5 76%
60 6 63%
70 7 66%
80 8 67%

 

However, Dobby realizes after getting fired from his cushy horse breeding job that his cousin got him at the Malfoy estate that he's doing it wrong. For longterm breeding programs, it's very important to have horses with the exact same traits. Therefore, getting the same traits on offspring is preferable. The odds of breeding offspring with the exact same traits:

Skill Parent Traits Chance of offspring identical to parents
50 5 56%
60 6 41%
70 7 42%
80 8 42%

 

 

I'm not sure why this happens because breeding in Wurm is so complicated. But just looking at those numbers even Dobby the Elf can tell that it's not working as intended: higher skill should not result in a lower success rate.

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Speculation: This may be due to the fact that from 50-59.9999 AH only one extra trait gets put into the pool. 60 and beyond two extra traits get put into the pool.

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Hello Dobby! I have 50 ah and lets say I ve heard the rumour that you might be right, so i stick with ma 50 and so far I am  getting 5 speeds every time i breed something/one.

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Surprised this doesn't mention you can't breed 9 trait horses after 90 Animal Husbandry

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Can you explain this concept using some kind of Emma Watson-based image?

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I am not sure what triggered me more the fact you called it Dobby or that you considered it male when its clearly a female.

Edited by Egard
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And aren't all skills like that? You can get higher skill, but getting for example 90ql item is considerably harder, than getting 50ql item.

 

In reality it is not hard to get offsprings from horses, which have identical traits with parents.

What is hard, is to start from scratch and try to get 8 trait (5 speed + 3 good), but once that is done. It is easy to keep up supply of 8 trait horses.

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While yes, getting a 90qlitem is harder than 50, he's pointing out that at 90 skill it's harder to get a 50ql item you want than at 50 skill

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Isn't easier to just 'promote' a trait to a speed one over 60 AH?  So while your AH is between 50 and 60, you just focus on maintaining the 5 speed traits.  Once you roll over 60, you focus on 5 speed traits plus (for example) spark; you then just breed 5+spark horses.  It does mean you need to essentially re-create your breeding pool every 10 AH, but if you're not actively grinding, and you have a reasonable pool to start from, that doesn't take long.

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59 minutes ago, Retrograde said:

While yes, getting a 90qlitem is harder than 50, he's pointing out that at 90 skill it's harder to get a 50ql item you want than at 50 skill

 

Actually my point was, that it is harder to get 90ql item at 90 skill, compared to gettin 50ql item at 50 skill. :) So I don't see, why this is bad in AH.

 

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This are bad and i are not like information in OP.

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A possible solution would be to increase the chance of a trait being passed on as skill increases or reduce the chance of a negative trait from being selected when a trait fails to be passed on,

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5 hours ago, rixk said:

 

Actually my point was, that it is harder to get 90ql item at 90 skill, compared to gettin 50ql item at 50 skill. :) So I don't see, why this is bad in AH.

 

In most skills you choose the quality you are aiming for. In breeding you have no such choice. In your analogy it would be like the player was required to keep improving the item to ql 90 or it would shatter and be useless.

 

If you could choose to only breed 5 trait horses at higher AH you would be correct.

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Agree that speed traits should have higher chance when pulling from the pool at higher skill levels.

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You should not be penalized for having a higher skill, in fact I think we should be able to pick traits you want, or genisis be more flexible that lets you get rid of traits you do not want in your animal, rather than just the 'bad' traits.

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On 3/10/2017 at 11:37 AM, rixk said:

 

Actually my point was, that it is harder to get 90ql item at 90 skill, compared to gettin 50ql item at 50 skill. :) So I don't see, why this is bad in AH.

 

 

People are not (usually) trying to get 8 traits or whatever maximum. They're trying to get 5 speeds, the same 5 speeds as at 50 skill. But from the table in the OP, at 60-80 skill there is a lower chance to get 5 speeds than at 50 skill.

 

I was joking with a friend that AH is "the" skill you don't want to skill up. Or I wasn't joking. :)

 

Edited by Anarres
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Bump. AH is still somewhat broken and could use a tweak if not a complete overhaul.

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On 3/10/2017 at 3:28 AM, Retrograde said:

While yes, getting a 90qlitem is harder than 50, he's pointing out that at 90 skill it's harder to get a 50ql item you want than at 50 skill

 

At 90 skill I think it would be like getting a supreme role to breed a horse with all positive traits, anyone out there with 90 AH and actively breeding?

 

 

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48 minutes ago, JakeRivers said:

 

At 90 skill I think it would be like getting a supreme role to breed a horse with all positive traits, anyone out there with 90 AH and actively breeding?

 

 

 

Yup, I have 90 AH and actively breed, but it's depressing.

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Still very broken, any chance of an "official" comment on the situation and what will be done about it? Just killed off all my crap horses again, very tiring.

 

@Retrograde can you give the developers a nudge?

 

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More broken stuff that seriously needs attending, why is dyeing beds and sails a priority vs this one? Horses are literally the backbone of wurm travel.  Please fix :) 

Edited by elentari
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Been thinking of playing again, but this one hurts me. Still broken?

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