Theonis

Name and Shame: Consolidated

177 posts in this topic

4 hours ago, Hailene said:

Did he at least give most (if not all) the money he received from the sale of the account back to the original owner?

 

If he did, then he did the least he could do and shouldn't be here (though still a lousy move on his part). If he kept the money, then he deserves to be here.

If I quit Wurm and gave you my account, how long would you hold on to it?  If I came back 6 months after you sold the account I gave you would you buy coin, at your own expense  to pay me back for the account I gave you?   No you wouldn't.    I would have given you my account and you would have had no way of predicting when, or if, I would ever come back.

This thread has turned in to a stupid witch hunt.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

 

 

Thank you.

Edited by Evarya

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Greyfox said:

If I quit Wurm and gave you my account, how long would you hold on to it?

 

Personally, unless i was given an explicit permission to sell it - forever. I still have the login credentials to a friend's account that quit like 5 years ago (even after i sold all my personal accounts and quit WO)

5 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

I was following the thread about that shared account expecting one of the parties would eventually upload a chat log, an email, facebook screenshot.. but nothing.

Putting Maurizio at the same level with Niru turns you into judge, jury and executioner without any proof, based only on the testimony of the original owner.. so it's turning into a subjective thread and loses all it's meaning.. since anyone can just make up a story and you just buy into it without any need for proof. (Not trying to blame the victim, I have no affiliation with any of the people involved, I'm just commenting on the decision to add his name here).

 

I'm not saying that what he did was morally right, but as long as there can't be presented any proof that the account was only on lend, having all the credentials makes him the owner, so he's free to do whatever he sees fit with it.

 

In my short period in wurm I've seen a lot of account trading, especially in the pvp community, and old players probably sit on 3-5-10 accounts from various individuals that came and left, not all of which are necessarily friends, so there is no emotional connection with those accounts, it's just an asset, like a sword or a helmet... and if that asset was given to them to be used however he sees fit for himself or the kingdom.. then it's not for anyone to judge his decision to sell some of them.

 

Edited by faty
2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Niru and Maurizio are on diferent scales of magnitude, but they both have a place in name and shame threads.

5 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Maurizio did nothing wrong. He was given an account to do with as he willed. Just because you think what he did wasnt right, doesnt mean he should be on this thread. I agree he shouldnt have sold the account, but that doesnt mean I think he should be "named and shamed".

 

Very unfair.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why is Maurizio even topic now? Is his place here? Yes it is. This topic IS for people, who haven't exactly broken the rules, but whos actions "smell bad". This is  EXACTLY one of those cases. Tells also quite a lot about Ebonaura as whole, considering he was the king of it.

4 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i suspect we need a buffer thread.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 hours ago, Greyfox said:

If I quit Wurm and gave you my account, how long would you hold on to it?
 

 

To be perfectly honest? Unless you told me otherwise, indefinitely.

 

If someone made a stunning offer for the account, the least I would do is shoot you an email with the offer and (assuming I skilled up the account on my own) figure out how we should split up the money.

 

If you didn't respond, who in their right mind would sell the account?

 

18 hours ago, Greyfox said:

If I came back 6 months after you sold the account I gave you would you buy coin, at your own expense  to pay me back for the account I gave you?

 

Assuming I sold the account behind your back...then I would pay you back somehow.

 

Either in cash, coin, items, a new character of roughly equivalent skills, or some combination of the above.

 

18 hours ago, Greyfox said:

you would have had no way of predicting when, or if, I would ever come back.

 

If I don't know when or if you're coming back, I'm going to err on the side of caution and assume you'll come back...one day.

 

I have no idea how or why someone would think it would be okay to sell an account before receiving the explicit okay from the original owner. That, to me, is absolutely insane.

3 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Hailene said:

 

To be perfectly honest? Unless you told me otherwise, indefinitely.

 

If someone made a stunning offer for the account, the least I would do is shoot you an email with the offer and (assuming I skilled up the account on my own) figure out how we should split up the money.

 

If you didn't respond, who in their right mind would sell the account?

 

 

Assuming I sold the account behind your back...then I would pay you back somehow.

 

Either in cash, coin, items, a new character of roughly equivalent skills, or some combination of the above.

 

 

If I don't know when or if you're coming back, I'm going to err on the side of caution and assume you'll come back...one day.

 

I have no idea how or why someone would think it would be okay to sell an account before receiving the explicit okay from the original owner. That, to me, is absolutely insane.



All nice arguments, except one flaw with them.   I would have given you my account.   That would have made it yours.  In my experience, when you give someone ownership of something, be that in a game or in real life, it is theirs. 
Think of it this way, if I gave you a TV, and you use it for 2 years and then sell it, would you then give me money from the sale?  Ofc not, apon giving you the TV it was implied the TV was yours.   Same thing with characters in a game.
 

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Greyfox said:



All nice arguments, except one flaw with them.   I would have given you my account.   That would have made it yours.  In my experience, when you give someone ownership of something, be that in a game or in real life, it is theirs. 
Think of it this way, if I gave you a TV, and you use it for 2 years and then sell it, would you then give me money from the sale?  Ofc not, apon giving you the TV it was implied the TV was yours.   Same thing with characters in a game.
 

 

Yes, but online things are not the same as real life things.

 

Players in games online have different types of relationships.  If you can't understand that, then it's you that has problems.  Every wurm player knows, when someone quits... it's only for a limited time.  Wurmians always come back.  If players who sell other peoples accounts without their permission to do so, then they're wrong and have betrayed the trust of online friends.  That means that player is not a loyal player and can NOT be trusted with your online items.  Simple as that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 hours ago, Greyfox said:

Think of it this way, if I gave you a TV, and you use it for 2 years and then sell it, would you then give me money from the sale?

 

Couple of differences.

 

If there was a lot of potential emotional attachment to the TV, I wouldn't before getting your explicit permission.

 

Second, if you asked for the TV back AFTER I had sold it, I would pay you back whatever the fair market rate for the TV would have been.

 

That's just common decency.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This isn't really the place to debate it fellas, what's done is done. I could write a page in reply but the simple fact is - that isn't what this thread is for

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Toolhead said:

This isn't really the place to debate it fellas, what's done is done. I could write a page in reply but the simple fact is - that isn't what this thread is for

OP is putting peoples names in a name and shame thread.   This is the perfect place to debate if a name belongs on there or not.
 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Like it or not, it's there, and many people including myself feel that it belongs there. This thread exists merely to consolidate name and shame threads into one easily accessible thread

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Greyfox said:

OP is putting peoples names in a name and shame thread.   This is the perfect place to debate if a name belongs on there or not.
 

 

No,, Greyfox, it isn't.  This thread is for posting name and shames, not arguing about a particular incident for 10 pages (as is well underway on this Maurizio issue).  If Maurizio, Evalya, Ebonaura or Freedomers from the peanut gallery want to make comments and post opinions, it should have its own dedicated thread. 

 

Otherwise, we'll just tack on another 10 pages to this same thread every time one player in the WO community does something shady.  Say hello to Skirmishes 2.0

 

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
50 minutes ago, Greyfox said:

OP is putting peoples names in a name and shame thread.   This is the perfect place to debate if a name belongs on there or not.
 

 

Regardless how you feel, that person took something that wasn't his. Most people that have logic will side with Evarya, it's like lending a friend you thought you could trust with a car. Something bad comes up and you have to make a trip very far away it's very sudden, when you get back your so called friend sold the car. He decided to punch you in the face and run away after. Long story short, everyone in this game is out to get you in some shape or form. Don't trust anyone, people just want your stuff, this is a sandbox game and crime is fairly high. I wish it wasn't but the staff don't seem to think it needs to be fixed, it's very upsetting to me personally.

 

This thread has every right to keep people informed about other's misconduct, so us a favor and stop derailing it, you are not making a good case either.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Niki said:

 

Regardless how you feel, that person took something that wasn't his. Most people that have logic will side with Evarya, it's like lending a friend you thought you could trust with a car. Something bad comes up and you have to make a trip very far away it's very sudden, when you get back your so called friend sold the car. He decided to punch you in the face and run away after. Long story short, everyone in this game is out to get you in some shape or form. Don't trust anyone, people just want your stuff, this is a sandbox game and crime is fairly high. I wish it wasn't but the staff don't seem to think it needs to be fixed, it's very upsetting to me personally.

 

This thread has every right to keep people informed about other's misconduct, so us a favor and stop derailing it, you are not making a good case either.


 

Well, like I said, I don't like the guy so I'm done defending him from the lynch mob.    I'm sure glad we have self appointed morality police, that always leads to good things.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Greyfox said:


 

I'm sure glad we have self appointed morality police, that always leads to good things.

 

Sure beats the roving lawyer squads who used to defend every act of griefing and general douchebaggery Wurm used to have.

 

Game looks better with a community that's intolerant of needless shenanigans, as opposed to a community who'll squeal with delight and cheap defenses of thieves every time someone's game experience is unnecessarily ruined.

3 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Wargasm said:

Freedomers from the peanut gallery want to make comments and post opinions, it should have its own dedicated thread. 

 

Pardon me if I'm wrong, but last I checked they'd locked the thread where this was going down. So where pray tell do you suppose the issue is supposed to be hashed out exactly?

I was a previous victim of a similar 'name/shame' thing way back when (Where they put it on their alliance forum...but the person didn't bother to read to the end where it'd been resolved...), and you yourself were my neighbor and quite clearly stated you had no way to resolve the issue when it was the deed owner of which you were a villager who set KoS on me. Where exactly do you suppose people are supposed to clear their names when stuff like this is going down?

If they can't defend their name/reputation in a thread that was specifically dedicated to the matter, nor in a 'list' thread where they got added, how are they supposed to clear their name?

This is the problem with a name/shame policy that conflicts with other forum rules.

 

I personally agree that most of these turn into witch hunts/badmouthing a player who may/may not have done something wrong. It's easy to be put in a bad position/light when one party presents supposedly damning evidence without both sides of a story.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

This thread is not for discussions, guys, if you keep discussing a single incident here, the mods will lock this thread because it will inevitably will turn into a back and forth clash of opinions. If you guys want to discuss the Maurizio incident, please open a new thread and discuss there. We rather not have this thread locked, like the original Maurizio one. 

 

The fact that the original thread was locked should be good enough indication of the fact that the staff does not want that matter discussed anymore.

Edited by Angelklaine
1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Angelklaine said:

This thread is not for discussions, guys, if you keep discussing a single incident here, the mods will lock this thread because it will inevitably will turn into a back and forth clash of opinions. If you guys want to discuss the Maurizio incident, please open a new thread and discuss there. We rather not have this thread locked, like the original Maurizio one. 

 

The fact that the original thread was locked should be good enough indication of the fact that the staff does not want that matter discussed anymore.

Maurizios topic should be opened actually.. I don't really get why this was even closed.. Yes, there was load of irrelevant stuff there, but thats what moderating means.. keep the topic on track, instead simply pressing the button to close topic.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Angelklaine said:

The fact that the original thread was locked should be good enough indication of the fact that the staff does not want that matter discussed anymore.

 

So, because one person on staff (Which some of on this game is recruited from the player-base, and therefore has the very real possibility of being a friend of someone who is accused) decided they didn't like what was going on in a thread...a person shouldn't be allowed to confront their accuser, or present their side of a story, and should just accept the community hatred/possible effects to their business/even more griefing/harassment, and remove themselves from the game even if they maybe did no wrong?

I've seen people brag on Wurm Freedom chat about how they had moderation powers and proceeded to use them specifically to cause more harm/create more tears so they could enjoy them.

I'm not even discussing that specific incident. I'm referring to the whole point behind this thread...the ability to compile a list of 'Bad' people (In someone's eyes.) so as to thwart possible future happenings.

 

This thread is sounding more like online bullying to me than a useful form of 'punishment'. It gives a bad impression, and rarely actually helps a community.

But yes, continue on with your compilation of names. It's people that use threads like this to 'out' someone that are often the people who should be avoided. Let us all know who you are. It's quite useful in that respect...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm guessing the other thread was closed because there was nothing new being added, just back-and-forth, "yes he did", "no he didn't"... so not at all like the discussion here, then.

 

I note neither party were posting any evidence, despite some people claiming to have logs etc.  Which means the situation comes down to 'what I thought was said'.  For what it's worth, I wouldn't have sold an account that someone else gave me, unless they had explicitly said I could sell it.  I also wouldn't expect any money back for premium I paid for (unless they took the account back with premium on it) or time I'd put into it - I chose to pay that money and put the time in for my own use, knowing that the char came from someone else.

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Then let's reopen a Maurizio is scummy thread then instead of hijacking this one. The author of this thread has asked many times to keep discussions off it. Let's honor his wishes and move the discussions somewhere else then?

5 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now