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Pardigan

Fatigue system needs to be looked at

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1 hour ago, lolmaster said:

Should offer a "fatigue upgrade" at the cash shop.

 

Tbh the problem would be largely solved by fatigue being "upgraded" to being 24 hours instead of 12 >.<

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6 hours ago, Retrograde said:

This isnt broken, for all intent and purpose it works as intended, the discussion here isn't that it is a broken mechanic, it's that it does not mesh well with your playstyle and could be improved.

 

So has there been any consideration to improve this?

 

 

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Some of my posts in this and other topics were censored/or trimmed/ by mods without any indication for that, I do not stand behind the remaining words.
I'll politely ask you to skip this post and not read it, as whatever words and thought have been spared are not what I had to say.

Spoiler

probably:rolleyes:

 

Edited by Finnn

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50 minutes ago, JakeRivers said:

 

So has there been any consideration to improve this?

 

 

roadmap for may and the next few months has been laid out already, so while these are fixed i dont think that this would get looked at too soon. but we can at least gather some more points in this thread and possibly have some more people voice out if they have problems. the priority is only as high as the number of people actually impacted i guess.

maybe we'd see this make it into the list of considered systems to be changed after the mission system overhaul. who knows yet.

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I think many are mistaking the roadmap and its purpose. The roadmap lays out the major frameworks we have on the horizon. little additions, tweaks and changes to mechanics all come along (considering last roadmap did not include any of the housing and such updates) 

 

There has been discussion, but it's an ongoing process and nothing has been decided

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2 hours ago, Retrograde said:

I think many are mistaking the roadmap and its purpose. The roadmap lays out the major frameworks we have on the horizon. little additions, tweaks and changes to mechanics all come along (considering last roadmap did not include any of the housing and such updates) 

 

There has been discussion, but it's an ongoing process and nothing has been decided

Regardless of the intention of the roadmap, I think that what other posters mean is they would like to see this addressed. Fatigue impacts me not at all, since I rarely if ever play more than 4-5 hours a day. But I can identify with many of the posters in here. Its something that should be looked at to see if it really achieves its intended purpose.

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18 hours ago, SmeJack said:

Feels rather presumptuous, im not sure ive seen any dev comment that it is broken to begin with, seems like that needs to happen before requesting to know when a 'fix' is coming.

Do I need to include you when I specifically state I don't want a smartass answer?
 

 

18 hours ago, Retrograde said:

This isnt broken, for all intent and purpose it works as intended, the discussion here isn't that it is a broken mechanic, it's that it does not mesh well with your playstyle and could be improved.


Anti macro mechanic interfering with legit players, what exactly about that is not broken?   Works as intended?  Lol.     If it worked as intended not a single person who doesn't macro would hit the fatigue wall.    It's a broken mechanic, plain and simple.   It's purpose was to prevent macroing, it's interfering with legit play, that makes it broken.   Fix it, and if fixing it is to hard/time consuming then disable it until it's fixed.
The fatigue problem could have been fixed with less effort then arguing for it's existence took.    Just think of that.  In the time it took you to post your BS a single line of code could have been changed to fix the problem.....

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I would imagine that it was an acceptable thing at the time of implementation that some legitimate players would hit the wall; that the mechanic's benefits would outweigh the few actual players that would encounter it. So yes, I would think it is working as intended, not broken.

 

This is all aside the point of if it should be remove/changed ect, this is purely towards your choice of words and logic concerning intended/broken and needing fixing.

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Some of my posts in this and other topics were censored/or trimmed/ by mods without any indication for that, I do not stand behind the remaining words.
I'll politely ask you to skip this post and not read it, as whatever words and thought have been spared are not what I had to say.

Spoiler

You guys grind your way so high on that skill ladder.. that you forgot how you got there.. patience and pacing your work progress every day..
"#### that.. we want it all, now"

Only people to ever complain about fatigue, are with certain playstyle which is hard to call 'playing'.

In a game with so many things to do, several people chose to sit on 1 tile for hours and hours and repeat the same actions, turning themselves into bots..

After dropping the last bit of limitation to that.. it doesn't even matter if they bott.

nolife to win:unsure:

 

Edited by Finnn

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23 minutes ago, Finnn said:

are with certain playstyle which is hard to call 'playing'

 

That's none of your freaking business. 

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25 minutes ago, Finnn said:

You guys grind your way so high on that skill ladder.. that you forgot how you got there.. patience and pacing your work progress every day..
"#### that.. we want it all, now"

Only people to ever complain about fatigue, are with certain playstyle which is hard to call 'playing'.

In a game with so many things to do, several people chose to sit on 1 tile for hours and hours and repeat the same actions, turning themselves into bots..

After dropping the last bit of limitation to that.. it doesn't even matter if they bott.

nolife to win:unsure:

 

you really arent putting an argument here

 

 

i guess when your iq goes below a certain point, nobody can have a logical debate with you.

Edited by Propheteer
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Some of my posts in this and other topics were censored/or trimmed/ by mods without any indication for that, I do not stand behind the remaining words.
I'll politely ask you to skip this post and not read it, as whatever words and thought have been spared are not what I had to say.

Spoiler
On 5/16/2017 at 11:09 AM, Propheteer said:

you really arent putting an argument here

 

 

i guess when your iq goes below a certain point, nobody can have a logical debate with you.

I know.. what's the point in putting more arguments when all are being ignored.<_<
Nobody wants reasoning here.. a few just want the change to happen.

 

@Propheteer

"logical debate" please.. you'll have hard time pointing one

I read a monologue.. and when there is an opposing opinion with arguments - it's ignored, hardly a debate. how's that for your iq? (go wiki "argument" and "debate")

 

Facts are.. there's a minority that feels the need for this change, and their reasons for it are questionable when they cant explain how, and how often they are getting to that problem.

I am not expecting to keep anything the way it is.. if more people needed this change, it should happen, but for the moment.. I am amused of the half answers and hiding when it comes to how and why somebody needs this to happen so badly when skill have never been this easy to get or to get some work done.

 

Edited by Finnn
somehow I missed... 'this'

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Let's be honest. How many players got fatigue issues? 5%?

 

Devs won't change anything in that case.

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edit... 3 or so?:

 

so far everyone in this thread was talking about 8 hours of fatigue regenerated, and i too was in the believe that it is 8 hours a day. however this is wrong.

 

it is ONLY 8 hours regenerated a day if you stay online 24/7 or log in exactly at a fatigue refresh. if you are off on the login time the game throws away part of your time, specifically everything that is over the last refresh tick, and can nullify up to 2 hours 59 minutes of a fatigue refresh effectively having you end up with 7 or even less hours of fatigue a day.

the more often you take breaks and log out during the day the less fatigue you will end up with.

Edited by Arium
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And there finally someone has found the exact source of why its too damn easy to hit this cap!

Edited by Nadroj

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Some of my posts in this and other topics were censored/or trimmed/ by mods without any indication for that, I do not stand behind the remaining words.
I'll politely ask you to skip this post and not read it, as whatever words and thought have been spared are not what I had to say.

Spoiler
On 5/16/2017 at 3:13 PM, Arium said:

edit... 3 or so?:

 

so far everyone in this thread was talking about 8 hours of fatigue regenerated, and i too was in the believe that it is 8 hours a day. however this is wrong.

 

it is ONLY 8 hours regenerated a day if you stay online 24/7 or log in exactly at a fatigue refresh. if you are off on the login time the game throws away part of your time, specifically everything that is over the last refresh tick, and can nullify up to 2 hours 59 minutes of a fatigue refresh effectively having you end up with 7 or even less hours of fatigue a day.

the more often you take breaks and log out during the day the less fatigue you will end up with.

If you have capped the 12hours of fatigue.. you could 'lose' the 3hour check at worst case, by logging just at the moment when 'you feel rested' have just happened, I am not reading the code to see if that it a player based or server specific schedule to recover 1h every 3.

Other than that.. it's simple 24hours in a day/night cycle, /3hours = 8hours or 7~.. fatigue hours recovered every 24.

Most people play or should I say.. "work" less time, and are probably expected to move or twitch a few times a day, not just spam actions to constantly drain their fatigue. Not all actions take fatigue.

 

'if you stay online' - afaik fatigue doesn't check if you're online or not.. it still regenerates your fatigue the exactly same way(being online or offline doesn't matter).

 

A way to beat the game.. never let the 12hour fatigue reach the cap, you'll be wasting your extra timer, and miss out on the next 'you feel rested':o

 

It's a game.. can't be that bad to miss 1 hour here and there, plus it's not a server scam, it's you who rule your own time.
If you were busy irl, you still have the chance to beat that fatigue timer the next time you have a bit more to spare and fatigue capped.. just ruin the timer back down to the 0, it only takes 16hours of nonstop playing +/- one-two hours for wc breaks/stamina recovery, maybe eating something irl or ingame. You could even stream that on youtube live.. 20hour of wurm fatigue wreckage marathon.:huh::ph34r:

 

Edited by Finnn

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Did you....actually even read what he said. Is this a troll? It's a good troll.

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Some of my posts in this and other topics were censored/or trimmed/ by mods without any indication for that, I do not stand behind the remaining words.
I'll politely ask you to skip this post and not read it, as whatever words and thought have been spared are not what I had to say.

Spoiler
On 5/16/2017 at 6:53 PM, Nadroj said:

Did you....actually even read what he said. Is this a troll? It's a good troll.

I actually did.

 

Nothing changes... he just found how to math, mechanic is still exactly the same - as long you have under 12hours, at some point.. you get 1 hour recovered, and that happens every 3 hours.
 

He didn't say anything more than that, and we all know that.

 

 

Am I the one trolling when I have to explain simple old mechanics to vets?

 

Edited by Finnn

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Aren't GMs able to get a list of folks who are under 6 hours of fatigue, or was that hearsay?

 

If so, the fix is to change fatigue so that it no longer blocks you from doing actions when you run out, but GMs can still pull up a list of players with low fatigue.  Cheaters still get noticed and banned, crazy grinder nerds don't get roadblocked.

 

You could also tweak Wisdom of Vynora to amplify both the SB given and fatigue drained, to make the extra SB more of a perk geared towards people who aren't punishing their fatigue on the regular--but I'm spitballing with that one.

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Take the personal details out of it.

 

Who does the fatigue timer hurt? -> People who choose to play enough to hit their limit and can no longer choose to do actions that require fatigue.

Who does the fatigue timer help? -> As implemented, it was designed to help devs/community in regards to macro use. Is this actually effective? All it blocks is people using a macro for a very extended period of time. Surely there are other ways to do this? Macro users can just macro for less time per day or macro multiple accounts and it wont be an issue.

 

Really, if it has no benefits and only harms, let's call them 'committed', players... is there any valid reason as to why it should remain part of the game beyond "its already there"?

Edited by Gekko
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Some of my posts in this and other topics were censored/or trimmed/ by mods without any indication for that, I do not stand behind the remaining words.
I'll politely ask you to skip this post and not read it, as whatever words and thought have been spared are not what I had to say.

Spoiler

Fatigue provides some limitation to the extent of work or changes you could cause to the world for specific period of time(intended or not, that is happening).
Amount of skill gains or generated work from same character; several people already explained how they are reaching that on more than 1 of their characters..:huh:

 

What do you say to that? Beyond overly 'committed'?:huh:

If somebody's getting so much skill and already have a good advantage over average and normal type of gameplay, should the game allow the extra hardcore grinders rule the market further, leaving normal and average player highly outskilled and aside from any kind of trades that isn't plain bulk goods?:rolleyes:


Misconception here is .. that such behavior is being called 'playing'<_<, but the wurm offers a lot more than 1 tile with containers and 1-2 actions to be spammed repeatedly for MORE than 1/3rd of the day.. :o(not counting the breaks a normal person have to take or stamina recovery times in between actions:huh:)

To actually burn trough fatigue you need to play more than 1/3rd of the day, every day, no exceptions.  That's how it's done.:mellow:

 

Edited by Finnn

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What?

 

1 hour ago, Gekko said:

Really, if it has no benefits

 

1 hour ago, Gekko said:

 Is this actually effective? All it blocks is people using a macro for a very extended period of time.

 

You literally listed the reason why it exists a few sentences earlier in your post.

 

That is the benefit.

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10 minutes ago, Finnn said:

Fatigue provides some limitation to the extent of work or changes you could cause to the world for specific period of time(intended or not, that is happening).
Amount of skill gains or generated work from same character

 

 

What's wrong with that?

If someone has more time to play, why limit them?

Because you don't have as much time? Well, I've only got 1 hour a day to play, so therefore everyone should be limited to 1 hour a day skillgain...it doesn't make any sense.

So what if someone can change the game world a lot in the time they have to play?

 

Sure, you can take MMORPGs like Wurm to be a 'competition'...but unless you have 16 hours+ a day, you will never win and it is pointless to do so in a genre where time played beats 'skill' every time. (Assuming you're talking about some form of 'skill highscores' type thing. The only competition exists in who can do it longer. Some people may find that fun, I'm not saying it is good or bad or that people shouldn't do it...but don't expect to 'win' unless you can put in the time.

 

9 minutes ago, Hailene said:

What?

You literally listed the reason why it exists a few sentences earlier in your post.

That is the benefit.

 

My point was that it isn't the only, or most efficient way to stop macro users. Therefore, it doesn't really have any benefits if you just change how macro users are detected/caught. (I believe they already have a multitude of ways to detect it)

Edited by Gekko
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