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Patch Notes 13/OCT/16

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8 hours ago, Retrograde said:

You can gain shield skill on new animals, just not sit at the same one. (a.k.a. unattended play)

 

I think rather than just "fix" things like this, you should look into why people are doing it in the first place. People don't do this for weapon skill because it is fast enough to hunt legitimately. People abused certain methods of shield training without taking damage because shield skill increases very slowly, and sitting in a pen is actually faster than fighting and hunting. This should be looked into (ie. skill gain raised while hunting mobs, not just mechanics to prevent abuse). Positive incentive generally works better than penalty.

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The bugfix and related WSA aren't specifically tied to shield training, but combat gains in general. Some people had managed to find specific setups that allowed them to gain combat skills unattended forever, and the fix was to apply an existing combat skillgain cooldown to most combat actions.

 

Most of you have already figured this out, but once you hit your limit with one creature, you can switch to another creature and continue getting skills from them - so 'pen-training' isn't dead, just slightly more involved now.

 

On a related note, we know shield skillgain is pretty slow - and now that I'm more confident that any unattended skillgain scenarios or macro scenarios are mostly dealt with, the rates for shield gains can be more easily increased in the near future without worries of macros etc.

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4 minutes ago, Budda said:

On a related note, we know shield skillgain is pretty slow - and now that I'm more confident that any unattended skillgain scenarios or macro scenarios are mostly dealt with, the rates for shield gains can be more easily increased in the near future without worries of macros etc.

So its safe to say that the minor skillgain fix will be done within a weeks period at most?

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I jsut started playing on wild again, basically a new account, has 25 shield skill currently

 

Am i not sposed to catch up to other pvpers? Are they always going to have better skills than me no matter what?

 

Cause thats what you are doing, you remove the BsB carving knife fletching trick, doubling(exaggeration w/e)  the time it takes newer people to get to 31 BC

Now you ###### up shield skill gains? why?

 

seriously why create such a huge WoO? Do you want to kill pvp?

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if wurm is a sandbox game, why limit the way players train? isn't the point of a sandbox is to allow the player to choose how they want to play the game or allow the player mold their experience.

By enforcing certain aspects of character development you are removing the sandbox experience. Now, the hermit that was content to live in the cave with his faithful hog that helped him train his shield and weapon skill must now leave the cave. Perhaps the hermit did not want to leave the cave and perhaps now the hog feels that he is no longer needed? Poor pig...poor hermit.

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so 'pen-training' isn't dead, just slightly more involved now.


lol, is that how we word it

Edited by Mclovin

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11 hours ago, Retrograde said:

You can gain shield skill on new animals, just not sit at the same one. (a.k.a. unattended play)

Watching your stamina and ducking out when you take too much damage is hardly unattended.

 

Do you plan to move forward with an equally viable means to gain skill, if there were better ways people would obviously already be doing it .

 

Take with one hand ...

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12 hours ago, Budzilla said:

 

If you aren't using a macro you have nothing to worry about.

 

12 hours ago, Czar said:

I think they nerfed shield training. I got about 12 mins of skill gain, then nothing. Hardly macroing.


Yeah, standing in a pen with a bison letting it kick your butt is not macroing. You are just standing there being bored out of your mind. I guess you can go fetch a different bison to break the monotony though now.

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4 minutes ago, Kadore said:

Watching your stamina and ducking out when you take too much damage is hardly unattended.

 

Do you plan to move forward with an equally viable means to gain skill, if there were better ways people would obviously already be doing it .

 

Take with one hand ...

Repairing shield aswell.


Like, this is a bad update on behalf of the wurm team. Will they listen? probably not.

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12 hours ago, Retrograde said:

You can gain shield skill on new animals, just not sit at the same one. (a.k.a. unattended play)

 

You aren't unattended. When you run out of stamina, you have to change up or you get no skill gain. It's a built in thing already. This just adds another layer of unnecessary to it.

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Devs need to read and actually understand instead of implying what they think how something works/know how something works. It really doesn't work how you say it does and you're mucking up a legit training method.

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1 hour ago, Mclovin said:

Devs need to read and actually understand instead of implying what they think how something works/know how something works. It really doesn't work how you say it does and you're mucking up a legit training method.

 

It doesnt help when the current main devs dont pvp and have no idea about what is or isnt needed and also seem hard of hearing.......

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Last dev that PvP'ed was driven out of his kingdom, as both sides accused him of bias in favour of the other side.

 

Considering PvPers can't agree on what colour the sky is, I'm not surprised any devs PvP, it's not worth the hassle.

 

Moving to a different creature isn't all that hard compared to moving back to the same one, do people really struggle with that?

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2 minutes ago, SeeD said:

Last dev that PvP'ed was driven out of his kingdom, as both sides accused him of bias in favour of the other side.

 

Considering PvPers can't agree on what colour the sky is, I'm not surprised any devs PvP, it's not worth the hassle.

 

Moving to a different creature isn't all that hard compared to moving back to the same one, do people really struggle with that?

 

In the long run this just encourages more animal hoarding (which its looking like a minimum of 18 mobs just to keep the grind going).

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10 minutes ago, SeeD said:

Last dev that PvP'ed was driven out of his kingdom, as both sides accused him of bias in favour of the other side.

 

Considering PvPers can't agree on what colour the sky is, I'm not surprised any devs PvP, it's not worth the hassle.

 

Moving to a different creature isn't all that hard compared to moving back to the same one, do people really struggle with that?

It's more unneeded effort for basically the same shitty skillgain, so it's no wonder people are disliking the change

It personally does not affect me since I already change creature every now and then for the stance gains, but I can definitely see people hating having to do that since it's such a long, boring and REQUIRED grind

 

Edited by Worksock

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As has already been stated, with this change coming in it allows us to address and improve shield skillgain mechanics.

 

This means that you will not be able to shield train for hours on a single creature, but skillgain will be designed to flow much easier.

 

 

Sometimes changes come in for various reasons, in this case it was to patch an exploitative mechanic and the abusers of those exploits have been handled as well. It's clear to us that while the shield skill grinding mechanics have been incredibly broken , grinding it needs attention and could be much more dynamic, which is what we will be looking at and most likely including in the 1.3 update if not sooner.

 

Stay tuned for details on that in future news.

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Sounds nice, but wouldn't it be better to think the fix and its consequences through before implementing it and tweak the shield skillgain from hunting in the same update?

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might aswell look into shield bashing aswell, not sure if any of you devs ever tried  to grind that skill

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18 minutes ago, zigozag said:

Sounds nice, but wouldn't it be better to think the fix and its consequences through before implementing it and tweak the shield skillgain from hunting in the same update?

The "fix" came from addressing an exploit, which is better done sooner than later while we work on improving shield skill gains..

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I remember when Devs and GMs were known to be actively involved in pvp... and the moaning and whining that ensued.

 

Meh the unattended fighting skillgain setups rear their ugly heads again... I hope offenders were severely dealt with, especially the repeat offenders. <_<

Edited by Klaa

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If they dont pvp = "omg you don't understand pvp"

if they do pvp but are in the wrong kingdom = "omg you are biased and making changes to suit your kingdom"

if they do pvp and are in the same kingdom = "omg why don't you do everything we say?"

 

Declaring that someone is an outsider thus does not "get it" does not win you favor, it merely shows you are failing to communicate properly

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31 minutes ago, Retrograde said:

The "fix" came from addressing an exploit, which is better done sooner than later while we work on improving shield skill gains..

However it's hurting players and most likely your [the team] reputation.

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4 minutes ago, zigozag said:

However it's hurting players and most likely your [the team] reputation.

Exploits hurt the game more.

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3 hours ago, SeeD said:

Last dev that PvP'ed was driven out of his kingdom, as both sides accused him of bias in favour of the other side.

 

Considering PvPers can't agree on what colour the sky is, I'm not surprised any devs PvP, it's not worth the hassle.

 

Moving to a different creature isn't all that hard compared to moving back to the same one, do people really struggle with that?

 

Next time someone has a hissy about how many animals I have, I will hit them in the eye with my shield. 

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21 hours ago, Madt said:

 

But why?

Wurm's been that way for years and it's been fine. You cant change it 10 years into the game where everyones used it to grind for that entire time, where the playerbase has very high shiedskill already. You need to make that change at the beginning when everyones starting off with 0 skill, on the same level.

Because now all the newer players who come over to PvP servers with no shieldskill are going to be told sorry, you're gonna have to grind for atleast a year now because its been changed and you're useless in pvp before that.

 

Also, why is pen training viewed so badly? Like, why do the opinions of the devs disagree with it? If you wanted to look at it in a 'role play' sense. It's like a guy slapping his pet horse on the backside and agrivating it so it kicks him and he learns how to block with a shield

 

If you'd rather people hunt to grind skills, make hunting give better skills so that pen training is seen as the most unefficient way to do it anymore and everyone will stop pen training and start hunting. I know that sounds too simple to be true, but it will work i've seen it happen in other games and it worked fantastc.

 

Come on Madt, you know why

 

Rolf stepped back

 

The current Dev team have a different viewpoint about the game than he does and this is going to be reflected in how they develop and progress the game. Its also natural for them to want to place their mark on the game, claiming their territory.

 

Its going to take some getting used to and this won't be the only change where our response is "but why?"

 

I'm not saying its better or worse, just different. Whether different is something I'm going to like or not only time will tell.

 

My own recommendation is always look to the root cause of any problem, fix the foundations first then you get way way less complaints.

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