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Nice work, keep it up :)

 

Just don't bother with Iron Plate, it's a really bad idea

Edited by solmark
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1 hour ago, Retrograde said:

Iron plate
This weeks graphics update also saw the iron plate textures sneak through, causing some questions and concern. I'd like to say that absolutely nothing is set in stone with this armour, it not even necessarily being something that would be coming to the game, so rest assured!

 

 

I keep my fingers crossed.. keep it away from us!!

If you want an easy job for a new armor.. buff the Leather armor(not studded) as its not bad looking and right now is just cosmetic cuz its crap.. it should be made better.

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Don't listen to them! Add iron (and copper and bronze and gold and silver, etc.) plate, buff Steel to actually be desirable instead of arbitrarily mandatory.

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imo iron armor needs to come to pvp servers, it's another blocker having to get steel.

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2 hours ago, Retrograde said:

As you all know, the pauldrons are only available via rift loot drops

And when is this being changed? :ph34r:

 

On 14.05.2016 at 2:13 PM, Retrograde said:

Just to clarify too, these are rift based rewards, they are not the only way pauldrons will enter the game, we plan on introducing much more equipment based content down the line (cough cloth pants cough) and it will be available in a multitude of ways, with these simply being the first.

 

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7 minutes ago, Retrograde said:

not for a while yet, no solid plans

 

Well, i heard Xyp released a mod that allows crafting these, maybe it could be used in WO too to fulfill some promise, and the Rift ones just be made rare/supreme/etc by default... Just saying. Heard it's a nice mod.

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Adamantine / Glimmersteel Chain Armour & Visuals

 

The new chain armour looks great but it costs so much for adamantine and glimmersteel lumps that I will probably never get a set. There's no way I'm spending 2-3s (i.e., 2-3e that in my currency is $2.91 to $4.37) per 0.34kg lump just to own one of these sets. Perhaps the rich can do it but as a fairly new player (less than 2 years) there's no way I'll ever afford this unless my skills reach 90+ within the next year or two and I start really expanding the products/services I offer to others in the game. Sadly, these armour sets will be out of reach for most players and especially new players. As far as silver armour goes, if it gets some love that's great but hopefully it will look as good as the adamantine or glimmersteel sets.

 

Iron Plate vs. Steel Plate

 

In terms of iron plate, I have mixed feelings about it. On one hand, I may be okay with it if it has less damage reduction than steel. On the other hand, iron is so much easier to obtain that if everyone starts to want iron plate sets instead of steel plate sets, it may destroy the market for steel and related armour sets.

 

I just obtained my Renowned Platesmith title and I worked really hard using steel to get to the point where I can now finally sell some steel plate armour sets and make some decent silver in the game for them. If iron plate comes out and destroys the steel market, then I suspect that platesmiths will have no choice but to start charging the same price for iron plate as for steel plate if the demand for steel becomes very low. In the end, people will end up paying the same price for less damage reduction than a steel set can provide, with the only upside being that iron is easier to obtain for creation and imping.

 

What I would like to see instead of iron plate, is for steel sets to get some texture love, just like the chain sets are. Perhaps forget about the iron plate altogether. If not, then steel plate should definitely look way better than iron plate and provide more damage reduction.

 

Iron Plate Weight vs. Steel Plate Weight Debate

 

I also heard about the debate regarding whether iron should be heavier than steel and incur a steeper penalty. Iron is only 1 pound per cubic foot heavier than Steel in real life. So, that argument is a waste of time I think.

 

-- ADDED COMMENTS --

 

I edited my comments above slightly and I'm adding some historical info below...

 

I did a quick search and found "Plate armour is a historical type of personal body armour made from iron or steel plates". Japan used solid iron plates for their armour designs based on European armour. The question is, did it provide more or less protection in real life than steel plates? In modern times, plates may be made of ceramic, metal (steel or titanium) or synthetic materials. However, we are in medieval times in Wurm Online so really only iron or steel apply.

 

So I guess it would be historically accurate to have both iron plate and steel plate in the game. However, because iron is so much easier to obtain than steel, plate smithing would become too easy I think and the value of steel and related sets could suffer. It's a tough decision on whether iron plate should enter the game or not.

Edited by Neville
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Holding back on variety of armor types and materials able to create armor will continue to hinder the game in options for players. There is nothing wrong with iron plate and in real life it does exist. Iron is not the same strenght as steel so in terms of Damage reduction it could be 60% instead of 65 of steel plate. Make it a tiny bit heavier as well that affects speed by something like .5km this way it is a bit heavier a bit slower and a bit weaker in the DR department then steel plate. But at the same time it provides a new options new players can get their hands on a little bit easier. Give it the same resistances and vulnerabilities as the new armor stats of steel plate. 

 

People stop worring about your pockets and realize the greater potential allowing more options for newer players. It can be implemented in a way that provides the option but at the same time is inferior to its predecessor.

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6 minutes ago, MaurizioAM said:

Holding back on variety of armor types and materials able to create armor will continue to hinder the game in options for players. There is nothing wrong with iron plate and in real life it does exist. Iron is not the same strenght as steel so in terms of Damage reduction it could be 60% instead of 65 of steel plate. Make it a tiny bit heavier as well that affects speed by something like .5km this way it is a bit heavier a bit slower and a bit weaker in the DR department then steel plate. But at the same time it provides a new options new players can get their hands on a little bit easier. Give it the same resistances and vulnerabilities as the new armor stats of steel plate. 

 

People stop worring about your pockets and realize the greater potential allowing more options for newer players. It can be implemented in a way that provides the option but at the same time is inferior to its predecessor.

 

I edited my comments a bit after I posted but I will add a bit more here.

  • I agree that it could provide new options for players.
  • Like you, I believe that there should be less damage reduction for iron plate.
  • Unlike you, I said weight is kind of a waste of time because (but that's just my opinion):
    • A cubic foot of iron in real life is 491lbs. A cubic foot of steel in real life is 490lbs.
    • A steel plate set that is 20.50kg in the game is equivalent to 45.19lbs.
  • I wouldn't say stop worrying about our pockets but I would say perhaps iron plate can provide new options for players to make silver in-game.
    • Reason being that EU conversion to some currencies can be quite expensive so some of us do worry about our pockets more than others.

That about sums up all the thoughts I have. Either way I will adapt if iron plate enters the game. I can't really say if I'm for or against it at the moment.

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4 hours ago, Darmalus said:

I know that feeling.
I wonder why there isn't a standardized material color chart that can be used?

Aren't they still working on the textures throughout the game?   They may be working to get all on the same page, but these things do take time. They have been working on alot of things at once. Be pattient.

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1 hour ago, Lolabelle said:

Aren't they still working on the textures throughout the game?   They may be working to get all on the same page, but these things do take time. They have been working on alot of things at once. Be pattient.

I've only ever done character sheets (both my own and ones I've commissioned) but generally the first time you decide on something's color scheme, you save a sample of all the colors, label them and use those every time you draw that person/item again. Saves a ton of time and keeps things consistent.

It's a different issue if the current moon metal colors are just placeholders, but they should let people know to expect their armor to suddenly change color in the future once they come to a decision.

 

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Iron plate should probably take significantly more damage from use than steel plate. That would be realistic (pig iron - what we should be getting from just smelting ore - is way more brittle than steel), and it will also gibe more work to platesmiths (reimping) so they don't loose out on money.

 

Bronze plate should be a thing and be equivalent to steel.

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7 hours ago, Retrograde said:

not for a while yet, no solid plans

 

It's sad that in a game that's mostly about crafting, 2 armor slots can't be filled by crafting with no splid plans to change it (unless you play on WU).

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Just my opinion but market and real life money for virtual item trading should never be the basic of gameplay balance.

Better player retention > some happy people making money in a video game

 

Same DR as steel, steel takes way less damage compared to now, done, big deal if steel isn't as useful.  No different than longsword and large metal being the meta for many years and people stocking up/selling them and then the metas branch out and those items aren't near as popular as before.  If it's REALLY that bad for a virtual market, then just make it Epic only, none of us will complain pretty sure

 

7 hours ago, Neville said:

Adamantine / Glimmersteel Chain Armour & Visuals

 

The new chain armour looks great but it costs so much for adamantine and glimmersteel lumps that I will probably never get a set. There's no way I'm spending 2-3s (i.e., 2-3e that in my currency is $2.91 to $4.37) per 0.34kg lump just to own one of these sets. Perhaps the rich can do it but as a fairly new player (less than 2 years) there's no way I'll ever afford this unless my skills reach 90+ within the next year or two and I start really expanding the products/services I offer to others in the game. Sadly, these armour sets will be out of reach for most players and especially new players. As far as silver armour goes, if it gets some love that's great but hopefully it will look as good as the adamantine or glimmersteel sets.

 

Sorry, that's another thing ruined by the desire to make money off a video game.  No matter how much moon metal is on Freedom, that won't change.  If you really want moon metal, this is a good incentive to join a kingdom on chaos/epic, where it's more about the players succeeding rather than selling things.  Where people give away tomes for free rather than trying to make 100-400e+ or whatever insane value per charge. That said, even with these armor balances I kinda doubt pvpers will be making moon chain, especially coifs that don't protect the face I mean that's a disaster waiting to happen unless we just finally let every hat protect the face.  Precedent:  summer hats don't visually cover face but pretty sure they do

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This game could have more nice looking avatar models and armor... even on an older or limited game engine. 

More then 2 years ago 1 GM made his own avatarmodel that showed us what can be possible. 
And still we're playing boxy shaped avatars and armortypes.

This new chaintype armor is realy a small effort. Just some adjustments to the original chainmail. Everyone who knows a bit about 3d models and textures knows that.
Beside this realy small effort: for the most players is gaining enough lumps for these new types of armor a hell of a job.

 

So whats the deal inhere, don't mistaken i like the game, but what's the gain in this then only getting some kudo's from fellow staff members and some others?
 

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20 hours ago, zigozag said:

 

Well, i heard Xyp released a mod that allows crafting these, maybe it could be used in WO too to fulfill some promise, and the Rift ones just be made rare/supreme/etc by default... Just saying. Heard it's a nice mod.

Yeah it is nice just to have them craftable even though my mod only makes them as a decorative item. Funny enough I tried to set them to be armour but when you do that you can not equip them.

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13 hours ago, MrGARY said:

Just my opinion but market and real life money for virtual item trading should never be the basic of gameplay balance.

Better player retention > some happy people making money in a video game

 

Same DR as steel, steel takes way less damage compared to now, done, big deal if steel isn't as useful.  No different than longsword and large metal being the meta for many years and people stocking up/selling them and then the metas branch out and those items aren't near as popular as before.  If it's REALLY that bad for a virtual market, then just make it Epic only, none of us will complain pretty sure

 

 

Sorry, that's another thing ruined by the desire to make money off a video game.  No matter how much moon metal is on Freedom, that won't change.  If you really want moon metal, this is a good incentive to join a kingdom on chaos/epic, where it's more about the players succeeding rather than selling things.  Where people give away tomes for free rather than trying to make 100-400e+ or whatever insane value per charge. That said, even with these armor balances I kinda doubt pvpers will be making moon chain, especially coifs that don't protect the face I mean that's a disaster waiting to happen unless we just finally let every hat protect the face.  Precedent:  summer hats don't visually cover face but pretty sure they do

 

I agree with you that paying real life money for items in this game leaves a bad taste in my mouth. In my post, I referred to the cost of adamantine/glimmersteel lumps in silver and also my country's currency. Most players who don't have high skills or in-game silver cashflow will have to pay for silver from the shop or buy silver from other players to purchase enough lumps or a full set. That's where things become cost prohibitive. Of course, with ideas like iron plate floating around, perhaps there will be other more cost effective options to have as nice looking armour as the new adamantine/glimmersteel sets.

 

As for the real life money issue, I have no desire to make money in the game. I sold silver once and it ended up being the famous Niru who scammed a whole bunch of Wurm players out of money. He bought a bunch of items/silver off people in the game, got the items, and then turned around to dispute all the charges. PayPal opened cases against everyone, submitted evidence to Niru's credit card company to no avail, and neither Niru's CC company or PayPal protected anyone. In the end, everyone lost their money and on top of that PayPal issued chargebacks and called collection agencies on some people to recover funds. Some people lost hundreds of EU in Niru's scam. It's only a matter of time before more players using PayPal to buy in-game items/silver get scammed in this way. I mean, Niru won so that sets the precedent for future crooks to come and do the same thing now. I closed my PayPal account permanently after that and fortunately I didn't lose a lot of money but it could have been much worse. This is why I only use in-game silver now. Lesson learned. For those still buying items/silver off players with PayPal, you're taking your chances. I have also seen a lot of items being sold for insane values like 100e-800e. However, I don't expect that to change unless the devs change the ToS and ban the selling of in-game items/silver for real life money. I doubt it though because it's too late now and too many people would get pissed off probably.

 

I digress...

Edited by Neville

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this all not bad, but, besides new additions...

i'm also waiting for things like hedges to finally be finished and have proper graphics :)

please :P

 

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Hard to make a good comment on this post... Maybe you guys could make some plate skirt types inset of making all the Armour genderless. 


Also maybe you guys would make a slight increase to DMG on weapons made with steel... Seeing steel is better than iron! 

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On 2016-08-19 at 9:39 PM, Aniceset said:

Those are sure some pretty chain colors! Wish I could bribe someone for some girly armor tho!

 

8 hours ago, princesszelda said:

Maybe you guys could make some plate skirt types inset of making all the Armour genderless.

~_~

 

Yea lets introduce chainmail bikinis and stuff.... who needs these logicaly protective genderless armortypes... >_>

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19 hours ago, Neville said:

 

I agree with you that paying real life money for items in this game leaves a bad taste in my mouth. In my post, I referred to the cost of adamantine/glimmersteel lumps in silver and also my country's currency. Most players who don't have high skills or in-game silver cashflow will have to pay for silver from the shop or buy silver from other players to purchase enough lumps or a full set. That's where things become cost prohibitive. Of course, with ideas like iron plate floating around, perhaps there will be other more cost effective options to have as nice looking armour as the new adamantine/glimmersteel sets.

 

As for the real life money issue, I have no desire to make money in the game. I sold silver once and it ended up being the famous Niru who scammed a whole bunch of Wurm players out of money. He bought a bunch of items/silver off people in the game, got the items, and then turned around to dispute all the charges. PayPal opened cases against everyone, submitted evidence to Niru's credit card company to no avail, and neither Niru's CC company or PayPal protected anyone. In the end, everyone lost their money and on top of that PayPal issued chargebacks and called collection agencies on some people to recover funds. Some people lost hundreds of EU in Niru's scam. It's only a matter of time before more players using PayPal to buy in-game items/silver get scammed in this way. I mean, Niru won so that sets the precedent for future crooks to come and do the same thing now. I closed my PayPal account permanently after that and fortunately I didn't lose a lot of money but it could have been much worse. This is why I only use in-game silver now. Lesson learned. For those still buying items/silver off players with PayPal, you're taking your chances. I have also seen a lot of items being sold for insane values like 100e-800e. However, I don't expect that to change unless the devs change the ToS and ban the selling of in-game items/silver for real life money. I doubt it though because it's too late now and too many people would get pissed off probably.

 

I digress...

See but again you are talking about currency, understandably your value to the Euro might not be in your favor, and it might be expensive for you to get your hands on such an item, but again that is not what its supposed to be about. Head on over to chaos and join a kingdom or there are and have been kingdoms on chaos trying to grow to the point of being able to get their hands on such moonmetal but freedoms are extremely against or afraid to head on over the chaos to fight for it. 

 

When i say people need to stop worrying about their pockets i mean that we as a whole need to stop turning everything into EURO value, this is a game, balance should be done for the game to retain players, not make a select few happy. Not everyone has money to blow IRL, and that is one of the reasons why this game has a horrible retainage rate of non vet players. 

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