Posted July 24, 2016 Probably one of the most wanted features for wurm is to turn it into a 3D Game from its current 2.5 roots Always wondered how people currently feel about the below or if the development team is currently working on 3D stuff such as 3D Caves and Jumping still Past Dev Quotes---------------- "in the future we'll be looking into the introduction of a 3D cave system as well as flowing water" http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/140024-thanking-alex-and-erik/ "we could give you the possibility to fly in various ways. It is possible that it should be a fairly rare thing in Wurm but attainable to anyone who happens to find such a creature or ability and probably body control based. Such creatures should not be breedable." "if we add some jumping which we might want to " http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/93345-feedback-request-on-fence-stuff/#comment-935368 ------------------------------------- Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 24, 2016 (edited) 3d caves and flowing water would be cool. Not really in favor of people or monsters leaving the ground. How many deeds would require a complete rebuild if monsters or other players could jump over a waist high fence suddenly? Judging from... basically every patch, any announcement of jumping or flying would be followed with "Disabled on PvP servers." Edited July 24, 2016 by Darmalus 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 24, 2016 The development of flowing water is already stopped from what I have heard. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 24, 2016 For first time i give my friend to play wurm and he says.... bad gui and why i cant jump and run lol Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 24, 2016 6 minutes ago, Sila said: For first time i give my friend to play wurm and he says.... bad gui and why i cant jump and run lol Gotta agree about the GUI. As far as our movement, unencumbered players are already at the top end of long distance running speed (world record for the marathon is 20.2 kmh, my alts move about 17 kmh), which would seem slow if you are used to flying around at 4 times that in DOOM. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 24, 2016 Not knowing anything about the game engine but I really dont understand why they made the game 2.5D to start with. Seems much easier to make it 3D, like minecraft. Even converting current maps to 3D should be easy except for caves. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 24, 2016 If the only way to make this possible was to reset everything underground, I'd pass. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 24, 2016 This is bad theme for devs. They dont like it. It was open manytimes many years ago. Nothing happens. Everywhere y can see great battle wurm pictures, but reality is another. Java is not prepared for large 3d battle games. No important stress tests are done. They only show y some amazing scenes, suck some money and kick off. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 24, 2016 1 hour ago, griper said: Not knowing anything about the game engine but I really dont understand why they made the game 2.5D to start with. Seems much easier to make it 3D, like minecraft. Even converting current maps to 3D should be easy except for caves. Seems that game was fork of some famous 2d mmo( probably ultima online). Can grab most tools from such game and do only 3d render client. So they can do same just now with 3d, can grab some core and add wurm graphic. It will be much faster and effective than do game from scratch. Problem is in devs thinking, such as copyright for codeclub (i am doubt if all code is their own). Opensource is much effective now, but cant earn so much and thats point. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 24, 2016 flying? the views would be nice. I'd guess you won't be able to transport much. Although, the transport aspect could also be achieved with expansions to mail system or bigger and faster vehicles. Its possible folks like the idea of safe ways to travel around (like boats). Again, it would be possible to make safe travel paths on ground. I desire a 3d cave system. I also don't think it should require a complete erasure of existent caves. It will be extra work to recored the existent state and then make code to import that into new code. The current cave system is nothing more then some numbers for elevation of cave floor and cave ceiling. Overall I think 3d isn't worth the work it would take. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 24, 2016 5 minutes ago, ftoz said: Seems that game was fork of some famous 2d mmo( probably ultima online). Can grab most tools from such game and do only 3d render client. So they can do same just now with 3d, can grab some core and add wurm graphic. It will be much faster and effective than do game from scratch. Problem is in devs thinking, such as copyright for codeclub (i am doubt if all code is their own). Opensource is much effective now, but cant earn so much and thats point. Wurm wasn't a fork of UO. It's likely they did use various elements of UO as inspiration. I think Wurm's 2.5d state is explained simply because 3d technology was limited 13 or more years ago (especially for Java implementations 13 years ago). Remember that the 10 year anniversary was using the Gold relaunch date. Wurm did exists before that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 24, 2016 (edited) 55 minutes ago, joedobo said: flying? the views would be nice. I'd guess you won't be able to transport much. Although, the transport aspect could also be achieved with expansions to mail system or bigger and faster vehicles. Its possible folks like the idea of safe ways to travel around (like boats). Again, it would be possible to make safe travel paths on ground. I desire a 3d cave system. I also don't think it should require a complete erasure of existent caves. It will be extra work to recored the existent state and then make code to import that into new code. The current cave system is nothing more then some numbers for elevation of cave floor and cave ceiling. Overall I think 3d isn't worth the work it would take. Completly rewrite is bad idea. But i am talking about graphic port. I saw that some ppl do lif mods. Lif seems also stop work or have some trouble. Many such games finish in alpha beta state in trash. Dont see any bad in these times to copy some parts of code. Lif also steal some ideas and maybe graphic(grass?) from wurm. These times are different and copyright little outdate. Dont understand idea rewrite all code to tell my ego "the game is mine". Good 3d engines are free now, server sides and coumications with client are done in most cases, map editors free. The best way seems get some old lif or similar game version and port wurm graphic to start and save 3 or more years work. Has playable version just now and good startpoint. Question is what is worth on wurm and what is not to port? Edited July 24, 2016 by ftoz Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 25, 2016 Jumping would already be possible in the current system, considering we have 3D collision. You can already do similar things by way of, say, bouncing off the side of a cliff. Just food for thought. 7 hours ago, griper said: Not knowing anything about the game engine but I really dont understand why they made the game 2.5D to start with. Seems much easier to make it 3D, like minecraft. Even converting current maps to 3D should be easy except for caves. A heightmap with certain values at each node is much, much easier to store and handle than any sort of "true" 3D representation, with overhangs and such. It works in Minecraft because Minecraft uses a very fundamentally different voxel-based approach to the problem. It really doesn't apply much here. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 25, 2016 Could you guys go make a "non developers talk about game development" thread so I can subscribe to it and have all the comedy in one place? Thanks. 5 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 25, 2016 1 hour ago, Chakron said: Could you guys go make a "non developers talk about game development" thread so I can subscribe to it and have all the comedy in one place? Thanks. Could you go make an arrogant developer's thread where know-it-alls brag about how leet they are and how they are most qualified to decide what players really want. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 25, 2016 (edited) I'm not a developer in the sense you're thinking of, nor have I implied I'm qualified to decide what the players want. Don't recall bragging about leet skills either. Unless you are a game developer you can't form a basis for a valid argument regarding "Wurm should be 3D", "Wurm should move away from Java", etc. Anyone explaining how to fix Wurm from their armchair usually has no idea what they're talking about and it comes across as really funny! I have a very wry sense of humor, sorry. Edited July 25, 2016 by Chakron Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 25, 2016 Posting feature requests and pondering on what "the players" want (assuming those who posted here represent "the players") is perfectly OK. However, speculating on particular implementation aspects or stating confused theories ("Seems that game was fork of some famous 2d mmo( probably ultima online) ") doesn't help a bit. Unless we are experienced game developers ourselves we should refrain from giving our Wurm devs (who, for the most part, are unpaid volunteers, and are doing a great job) any advice on how to do their job. And: Yes, true 3D would be cool! (But probably very hard to accomplish, as Wurm's basic concept is intrinsically 2D.) 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 25, 2016 2 hours ago, joedobo said: Could you go make an arrogant developer's thread where know-it-alls brag about how leet they are and how they are most qualified to decide what players really want. I don't see any reason to be that rude, mate! (Doesn't help your point either...) 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 25, 2016 20 hours ago, Darmalus said: Gotta agree about the GUI. As far as our movement, unencumbered players are already at the top end of long distance running speed (world record for the marathon is 20.2 kmh, my alts move about 17 kmh), which would seem slow if you are used to flying around at 4 times that in DOOM. Believe Flying is a way for some mobs like Dragon to not be trapped and also allows them not to become a indestructible force that has to destroy fences and walls Would also be useful in PVP since no one mounts Dragons, even though half the problem is a bad point of view mounted on them Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 25, 2016 3 hours ago, enoofu said: Believe Flying is a way for some mobs like Dragon to not be trapped and also allows them not to become a indestructible force that has to destroy fences and walls Would also be useful in PVP since no one mounts Dragons, even though half the problem is a bad point of view mounted on them I can get behind this. We gotta get that flying beast down, man the nets and harpoons! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 25, 2016 4 hours ago, enoofu said: Believe Flying is a way for some mobs like Dragon to not be trapped and also allows them not to become a indestructible force that has to destroy fences and walls Would also be useful in PVP since no one mounts Dragons, even though half the problem is a bad point of view mounted on them For what it's worth, no one mounts dragons because dragons can't be mounted. The ability to dominate them was removed a while back. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 26, 2016 On 7/24/2016 at 9:42 PM, Darmalus said: As far as our movement, unencumbered players are already at the top end of long distance running speed (world record for the marathon is 20.2 kmh, my alts move about 17 kmh), which would seem slow if you are used to flying around at 4 times that in DOOM. The speeds shown in the GUI are actually inflated by a factor of 8. It shows Wurm-Kilometers per RL-Hours. Time in wurms passes 8 times faster, so if the game says you are running at 16 km/h - you are actually crawling at 2 km/h. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 26, 2016 On 7/24/2016 at 0:46 AM, ftoz said: Java is not prepared for large 3d battle games. This has nothing to do with Java, cut the FUD. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 26, 2016 (edited) 1 hour ago, bdew said: The speeds shown in the GUI are actually inflated by a factor of 8. It shows Wurm-Kilometers per RL-Hours. Time in wurms passes 8 times faster, so if the game says you are running at 16 km/h - you are actually crawling at 2 km/h. Unfortunately, it's not as simple as that. In our "Wurm Astronomers" group we discussed this to some extent, because the passing of Wurm time seems somewhat paradoxical. The character's speed is actually displayed in the status window and is based on real time. Also every action a character takes implies that Wurm time actually flows at RL speed. (If not, we would be slow as snails in everything we do.) On the other hand, we all know that Wurm "days" are 8 times shorter than Earth days, and that plants and animals also seem to grow 8 times faster than they would in real life. Following the principle of "Occam's Razor" the best theory to solve this apparent paradox is this: physical Wurm time actually passes at the same rate as RL time, but the planet Wurm rotates 8 times faster than Earth, so one rotation takes place in 3 hours real time. (In addition, the orbital period of the planet around Sol is also a lot smaller than that of Earth.) Therefore the units for measuring time in the Wurm universe have been decreased by a factor of 8, so that we define "1 Wurm hour" (= 7.5 RL minutes) to be 1/24 of a "Wurm day". Thus we can fit 24 Wurm hours in one Wurm day, as we are used to. The accelerated growth of living things in Wurm's nature can be attributed to the rapid rotation of the planet itself. Experiencing the 4 seasons of an entire Wurm year in only 1.5 RL months has made everything grow faster! TLDR: Physical time in the Wurm universe flows at the same rate as our RL time. We are only using smaller units of measurement to account for the rapid rotation of the planet Wurm. Edited July 26, 2016 by Yaga 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 26, 2016 I don't see much point in jumping. All the low fences will become pretty much obsolete unless the "jump" would be somewhat unrealistically limited and not allow you to jump over them just because. Flowing water, and water tiles above zero-level in general, now that I would like. We've got transformation liquids, we've got divining, add them together and woila! there's a pond Also, a big NO for flying mounts. Every game has them, Wurm needs something different. What exactly, you may ask? Airships, dude. AIRSHIPS! Spoiler ... one can dream... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
