This Saddens Me

[ProgNut 6]

I played Epic for a year or so and it was the community I joined that kept me in it mostly.  There were good people there, which I did not expect.  Keeping an large active community feeds itself with more players.  That seems to be the case for EVE from what I have noticed.  However, getting to that point always seemed to elude us, and towards the end for me, I was playing by myself and the people that did hang around were difficult to play with.  With no community for protection, you are a sitting duck and it just became non-fun.

 

My 2 cents, I would like an Epic cluster style of Wurm where the home servers are PVE and a central PVP server like now exists.  No other servers available.  Joining Wurm requires you to pick a kingdom to live in, which you could change like now.  The PVE home server could "ship" resources to the wild settlements to help win territories (watch towers, whatever..)  When one of these territories is taken, that kingdom sends a challenge to one of the other home servers (dragon, herd of champion trolls, etc)  The PVE players would have to deal with the challenge as a group, and hence have a chance to be penalized for not supplying wild settlements with supplies.  The PVE players have purpose and challenges to overcome.  The PVP players then could concentrate on strategy, combat, etc.  And to add a level of complexity, keep the deity spawns, influence, Valrei map, etc. and maybe enhance their influence on players.

 

One idea anyway to bring everyone together...

[Uberknot 327]

I don't think you understand that one of the primary reasons the current combat system is the way it is (the targeting system) is because there are severe desyncs, and the playerbase is incredibly small and diverse.

 

If rolf was to make wurm twitch based (which i would love), if you are anything but a European you couldn't really compete with anyone of a similar or better skill level due to latency on top of desync.

 

With WU and more local servers he might be actually be able to at least try to introduce something more fluid.  And yeah one server that has players from around the world in the MMO would have more latency than some people would except.  I am hopeful eventually to see some improvements in the way combat is come to WU.  It might not happen, but I can hope.

Edited September 24, 2015 by Uberknot

[Chiqa 742]

PvP has no draw for me at this point.I don't care to risk my good gear and i do have it to use, not leave safe at home. . I don't care to risk a pain in the yak corpse retrieval. I cant have a nice little deed there and grind unmolested when I feel like it, PvP when I feel like it. so nope, sorry, while I feel for the chaos server it has little to nothing to offer me at this time.  When it is no longer a full loot risk your ass just getting there situation then I will seriously look at it.  While I have enjoyed PvP on other games it is just to rough here for this carebear. I much prefer opt in type of PVP  Something else  that deters me from it is the extreme seriousness  paranoia etc that goes with it here in Wurm.  I am here to have fun and goof off, not jump at the shadows. Good luck getting more interested. That is tough one .

Edited September 24, 2015 by Chiqa

[LorraineJ 1,099]

...Joining Wurm requires you to pick a kingdom to live in, which you could change like now.  The PVE home server could "ship" resources to the wild settlements to help win territories (watch towers, whatever..)  When one of these territories is taken, that kingdom sends a challenge to one of the other home servers (dragon, herd of champion trolls, etc)  The PVE players would have to deal with the challenge as a group, and hence have a chance to be penalized for not supplying wild settlements with supplies.  The PVE players have purpose and challenges to overcome.  The PVP players then could concentrate on strategy, combat, etc.  And to add a level of complexity, keep the deity spawns, influence, Valrei map, etc. and maybe enhance their influence on players.

 

One idea anyway to bring everyone together...

 

No thanks. I'm not playing the game to be given an agenda. I'll pick my own purposes and challenges. And I don't want to be forced to interact with people whose company I don't enjoy. I don't need obligations in a game. The decay is bad enough.

[CubeManV2 231]

carebears don't know how to socially interact so they don't like epic or chaos.

[topkos 504]

carebears don't know how to socially interact so they don't like epic or chaos.

Absolutely true, for me is impossible to interact with people like...You

Edited September 24, 2015 by topkos

[CubeManV2 231]

Absolutely true, for me is impossible to interact with people like...You

 

tbh im one of the nicest people you could ever pay with in wurm so it proves the point that carebears are uncapable and unwilling of social interaction that requires sharing items or creating stuff for one another for free.

[Chiqa 742]

tbh im one of the nicest people you could ever pay with in wurm so it proves the point that carebears are uncapable and unwilling of social interaction that requires sharing items or creating stuff for one another for free.

Since you do not know me or how I interact with others I think you are talking out your yak. But this is off topic completely.  The tone you are taking does nothing to help entice people to pvp here or even offer anything at all helpful.

[Aeris 3,764]

carebears don't know how to socially interact so they don't like epic or chaos.

 

It's hard to interact with people when you can't tell which end is the butt and which is the face.

[topkos 504]

Let me explain it to you, something tells me you need further explanation:

9 to 17: i get paid to pvp with all kind of people, including your kind cube.

17 to 17:30 pvp with wife, full loot , I lose every single time, and she drains my wallet in less than 5 seconds.

17:30 to 19:00 stupid stuff like showers and dinner.

Guess what then , I pay with real money for 2 accounts in a sandbox to play as I desire and no how a punk like you tell me to

Edited September 24, 2015 by topkos

[Uberknot 327]

It's hard to interact with people when you can't tell which end is the butt and which is the face.

 

lol

[Raybarg 442]

After reading replies in this thread, I must say this:

 

When in games there was no way of classifying me as "carebear", I was not able to classify others as "carebears".

 

When in games some people classify me as "carebear", I still am not able to classify others as "carebears".

 

In both cases, when I was witnessing it, classification of "carebear" seemed arbitrary, subjective classification which most likely seemed to be flinging the term around just to "stir the pot".

 

These days I am using that information as classification myself.

 

Person using "carebear" is there to "stir the pot", which I believe amounts to how classification of "trolling" is also defined in some(most) cases.

 

Answer to the OP:

 

It is unlikely that any message in forums actually do anything towards the increment of players in PvP servers.

 

Outside Wurm forums it is more likely. PvP'ers are generally challenge-driven and theoretically it is possible to engineer some psychology to "trick" more people into trying Wurm's combat system which is described by many people as being "horribly dull". Target "audience" for such would just need to be right material and given true facts. Something along the lines of "You hate it, but you love it." 

 

Or careful description that it is INDEED TRUE that "YOU" can attack other players "RRReally BBBig" villages/buildings/complexes and literally WIPE IT OFF the face of land, turn it into a Grape Garden if you so wish, very flat, or very not-flat. Whatever you choose.

 

As that seems to be the essence of Wurm PvP (1% or less of the time); Complete obliteration of others efforts. Why? Because "YOU" can.

 

Right kind of ppl being told that "Theres some Smug group of Elite Wurm Players sitting in their Glorious Castle who think theyre PVP'eers. Are they really? Do they deserve their bloated Pride? Could you go rip them off of ALL&EVERYTHING they own? Including their PRIDE?!"

 

Just some ideas.

 

But here in Wurm forums? No...

 

Btw, calling ppl not playing PvP servers as "peace loving PvE'eers" is just another pot-stirrageddon, how little you know Wurmians. My bet is that its far more "peaceful" in PvP servers most of the time. Even shedding of other players blood, as far as I've been part of it, has been rather "peaceful".

[geode 292]

I have no problem with other Player's attitudes or how they come across or whether I think Rolf favors PvP or not... to me none of this has anything to do with why I won't play on a PvP server in Wurm.

 

....

 

I'm going to attempt to explain my reasons for never playing on a PvP in Wurm, or any other game... and attempt to do so without breaking any forum rules in the process...

 

If I walked up to someone in real life and attacked someone and/or robbed them, and/or broke into their home and stole their beer and computers I would know I had done an unlawful act. Not only Human law states those acts are bad but so do "other" laws.

 

Now imagine that some people (like myself) believe that those same laws that say it's bad to kill, steal, and destroy in real life also apply and should be observed in every dimension, every plane, every world, real, virtual, in essence... everywhere in the universe.

 

Now ask yourself this: Is it possible for a player like me, that believes what I believe, to ever join a PvP server and play it as intended, i.e. killing, stealing, raiding, destorying, and enjoy it? Or to play on a PvP server without experiencing a moral/ethical crisis? Could I ever justify that kind of behavior just because it's a PvP server?

 

Not if I believe that the laws of acceptable behavior are universal in nature. Not if I believe morals and ethics are important in all facets of life, including how we play games.

 

...

 

No matter how attractive Epic is made to be, no matter how many perks or benefits are given to join it, I will never join it. To do so is to turn my back on what I believe and who I choose to be. I won't do that for a game. To me there is no such thing as "it's just a game".

 

I try like crazy to remember these are my beliefs and not everyone's and so I try not to imprint how I think a game should be played by others, but I have to admit that I and most others have a hard time with this. If others want to go to Epic and PvP then that is their choice. I respect that. I won't do it myself though no matter what.

 

I will not wish the OP is unsuccessful in their attempts to increase Epic's population, but nither will I encourage them and wish for them success. To anyone that read and understood this post you will understand why.

Edited September 24, 2015 by geode

[Raybarg 442]

 

....

 and stole their beer and computers 

...

 

 

You... have... no soul!

 

Anyhow, I agree with your long explanation. As its speaking of my feelings. Killing, stealing, raiding, destroying is not providing me with enjoyment. Getting killed, robbed, raided and destroyed is not providing me with enjoyment either.

 

I enjoy building and prosperity, I enjoy seeing others build and prosper. I enjoy helping everyone to build and prosper.

 

Only reason I would enjoy destruction is the weak moments of vindictive behavior. Those just leave me with bad aftertaste when I recover from those moments and think about all the things I did.

 

 

Your reasoning is also the foundation of my opinion that Wurm population has already found their places in PvP/PvE environments and seeking for more PvP meat to the grinder, one should seek from outside Wurm community.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Need to find these people

 

Edited September 24, 2015 by Raybarg

[FasterDoudle 7]

This is going to be an echo chamber and not a great place to discuss how to fill Epic.

 

Most of us who might be part of a solution are not playing Wurm (never mind reading it's forums) and changes necessary to make PVP and so areas like Epic a draw for us PVP'ers would likely be unwelcome to the current Wurm community. If you want to understand how to pull in PVPers, you might try posting in the subreddit or forums of a game with strong PVP, e.g., asking r/Eve why we don't PVP on Wurm too.

Edited September 24, 2015 by FasterDoudle

[LorraineJ 1,099]

carebears don't know how to socially interact so they don't like epic or chaos.

 

I'm starting to believe that the definition of "carebear" is a person who plays this game without expectations from other players. We don't expect people to HAVE to buy things from us. We don't measure our self-worth in how we compare to other people. We don't run our lives thinking "For me to feel good, I have to make you feel bad." We don't feel that to have self-worth, we have to make some giant smear on the server, on land we don't even own, that shows "I MADE MY MARK." Here's hoping this is the only game where being self-actualized is something to look down on and try to be rid of.

[Gaeron 551]

Lets see

 

A lot of disinformation about PvP is out there, it doesn't help

 

Wurm PvP is not PvP as many games offer it, its really KvK. The focus is not the player but the kingdom, its not so much about an individual fight but territorial gains. This generates a strong sense of community.

 

Too many have come to Wild/Chaos thinking that they can walk in, face up to an individual somewhere, have a nice one on one fight and then leave.

 

The reality is that when you face one person, you are facing a kingdom who start wondering if this toon can be taken at face value or whether its another alt of a player in one of the other kingdoms. Sometimes the visitor is a "name", someone generally known within the wurm community in which case they may well have friends on Chaos who vouch for them, more often its just a new player or yet another alt.

 

On Chaos there are ways to do things and ways not to. At the top of all this is communication and awareness of where you are. Ignore questions from resident players... bad. Wander close to a war deed while ignoring questions.... worse.   Considering much of the east side of the map is wardeeds it means the visiting freedomer is already walking into a potentiially fraught situation. The kingdoms don't watch out for freedomers, they watch out for enemies and any unknown is potentially an enemy. Unfortunately there has been enough meta gameplay that all sides are very cautious. There are some players who automatically assume an unknown is an enemy which is where you get the "hi there - *slash* - I just want to - *stabby stabby stabby*" type stories.

 

A freedom player coming to chaos has to make quiet a large mental shift in how they view the game. Communicating before crossing over is good, unknowns are disappearing while slapping a deed down or building where you feel like it is very very bad, a kingdom has a very strong territorial awareness and doing that causes a bad itch. one that gets scratched. I've seen a lot of freedomers come and go over the years and I do have to say the ones who are more team players tend to do a lot better at finding their niche on the server.

[Tikki 65]

if you made it so i did not lose my armor or gear , i would pvp with you every day

[Mausmane 2]

I played Epic for a year or so and it was the community I joined that kept me in it mostly.  There were good people there, which I did not expect.  Keeping an large active community feeds itself with more players.  That seems to be the case for EVE from what I have noticed.  However, getting to that point always seemed to elude us, and towards the end for me, I was playing by myself and the people that did hang around were difficult to play with.  With no community for protection, you are a sitting duck and it just became non-fun.

 

My 2 cents, I would like an Epic cluster style of Wurm where the home servers are PVE and a central PVP server like now exists.  No other servers available.  Joining Wurm requires you to pick a kingdom to live in, which you could change like now.  The PVE home server could "ship" resources to the wild settlements to help win territories (watch towers, whatever..)  When one of these territories is taken, that kingdom sends a challenge to one of the other home servers (dragon, herd of champion trolls, etc)  The PVE players would have to deal with the challenge as a group, and hence have a chance to be penalized for not supplying wild settlements with supplies.  The PVE players have purpose and challenges to overcome.  The PVP players then could concentrate on strategy, combat, etc.  And to add a level of complexity, keep the deity spawns, influence, Valrei map, etc. and maybe enhance their influence on players.

 

One idea anyway to bring everyone together...

Hire this man rolf.

[bigsteve 378]

From want i have learned from old PvEers going to Epic, especially to Elevation, its contacts that u need.

A referal from an existing PvPer, will help you a long way.

Going to Epic and trying to join any kingdom with out a referal, or being good friends, usually gets u labelled as spy.

[Eyesgood 2,121]

I would very likely have remained on Elevation were it not for the cost of spirit templars driving my deed cost so high I could not justify the price.  It's bad enough that a raid very likely means no allied help due to low pop numbers, but to fork out 3 silver for every templar every month plus upkeep to help protect a deed is just not economically sensible to me.

[Garit 366]

Every time i think that this "Dead pigs head" has been put into the ground / laid to rest for good.... someone digs it back up and starts to play football with it AGAIN !!!

 

PVE players don't want to PVP ....there happy where they are and no amount of carrots on sticks will make them go over... and it's not about poor combat it's just...

 

THEY DON'T LIKE PVP !!!

 

Now put this "Dead pigs head" back into the ground .....and for gods sake leave it there for good this time. LOL

[Mausmane 2]

I have no problem with other Player's attitudes or how they come across or whether I think Rolf favors PvP or not... to me none of this has anything to do with why I won't play on a PvP server in Wurm.

 

....

 

I'm going to attempt to explain my reasons for never playing on a PvP in Wurm, or any other game... and attempt to do so without breaking any forum rules in the process...

 

If I walked up to someone in real life and attacked someone and/or robbed them, and/or broke into their home and stole their beer and computers I would know I had done an unlawful act. Not only Human law states those acts are bad but so do "other" laws.

 

Now imagine that some people (like myself) believe that those same laws that say it's bad to kill, steal, and destroy in real life also apply and should be observed in every dimension, every plane, every world, real, virtual, in essence... everywhere in the universe.

 

Now ask yourself this: Is it possible for a player like me, that believes what I believe, to ever join a PvP server and play it as intended, i.e. killing, stealing, raiding, destorying, and enjoy it? Or to play on a PvP server without experiencing a moral/ethical crisis? Could I ever justify that kind of behavior just because it's a PvP server?

 

Not if I believe that the laws of acceptable behavior are universal in nature. Not if I believe morals and ethics are important in all facets of life, including how we play games.

 

...

 

No matter how attractive Epic is made to be, no matter how many perks or benefits are given to join it, I will never join it. To do so is to turn my back on what I believe and who I choose to be. I won't do that for a game. To me there is no such thing as "it's just a game".

 

I try like crazy to remember these are my beliefs and not everyone's and so I try not to imprint how I think a game should be played by others, but I have to admit that I and most others have a hard time with this. If others want to go to Epic and PvP then that is their choice. I respect that. I won't do it myself though no matter what.

 

I will not wish the OP is unsuccessful in their attempts to increase Epic's population, but nither will I encourage them and wish for them success. To anyone that read and understood this post you will understand why.

One of the most unexpected and 'whoa' replies ever.

You could come play on epic and let us protect you as you build and mine.  

There's so much prime land that's going unused... I'ts not THAT dangerous. 

[Mordraug 2,542]

carebears don't know how to socially interact so they don't like epic or chaos.

 

tbh im one of the nicest people you could ever pay with in wurm so it proves the point that carebears are uncapable and unwilling of social interaction that requires sharing items or creating stuff for one another for free.

 

Funny, we do fine sharing the wealth among allies, outside alliance it's more commercial yeah...doesn't sound too different from the love fest you claim PvP to be.  And I see you're quite the socialite, "Come join us, you guys don't even know how to hang out!"... ever consider a career in marketing?  (Hint:  You wouldn't do very well)

 

From want i have learned from old PvEers going to Epic, especially to Elevation, its contacts that u need.

A referal from an existing PvPer, will help you a long way.

Going to Epic and trying to join any kingdom with out a referal, or being good friends, usually gets u labelled as spy.

 

Well THAT's gonna keep the influx of new players strong, with or without WU.

[Sobotnik 365]

the difference between pvp servers and pve servers is that the epic community is really much like a much bigger community

 

even with people in different kingdoms they keep in contact with one another, play games with each other a lot, switch kingdoms, and generally all know each other. they play largely because there are other people to play with

 

in pve, there's a lot less of that i think, and much of the population consists of people who would much rather play in single player for the crafting or terraforming or deedbuilding

 

i think that when wurm ultimate comes out, the freedom servers are going to have a noticeable population decline, while the pvp servers will mostly stay the same.