Play Wurm Online maps before they were touched (Deli, Xanadu, Indy, etc)

[Sklo:D 2,210]

I'd die for a copy of the old JK home map.

 

 

Yeah me too.

[Uberknot 327]

Personally I'd much rather be able to make my own map.

[Warlander 2,730]

Personally I think that currently existing maps cannot be released because this would reveal all not discovered good deed spots/resources, while original files of older maps are most likely lost forever.

[Mordraug 2,542]

Dammit War >_<

 

I do stick to my point of "a few more maps in the bundle would add huge value to the purchase" ... how 'bout a few more random generates to pick from on launch? *grin* *hands War the stick to throw at Rolf about it*

Edited September 28, 2015 by Mordraug

[Happiness 11]

I do stick to my point of "a few more maps in the bundle would add huge value to the purchase" ... how 'bout a few more random generates to pick from on launch? *grin* *hands War the stick to throw at Rolf about it*

[enoofu 206]

Personally I think that currently existing maps cannot be released because this would reveal all not discovered good deed spots/resources, while original files of older maps are most likely lost forever.

 

A few people here have Photoshop and Terrain Gens so any Old server height-map could be easily be randomized enough to be show  what they were at launch, if they were released

 

Would probably randomized all the resources and some tiles also

[Garit 366]

I posted this in the "WU Map/Terrain Generator Development" post .... http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/130605-wu-mapterrain-generator-development/

 

Posted 19 September 2015 - 07:40 PM

Here's an idea...

 

Why not just ask Rolf and the Dev's to release copies of all these as maps - Storm, Desertion, Affliction, Serenity, Release, Pristine, Exodus ... all these servers are 2048x2048

Which is the same size of the 2 maps that we get with WU when it ships.

 

I'd also like a copy of the Golden Valley map to go with my WU at some point so i can go back to all the old places i use to build places when i first started Wurm

With GV being of a smaller size it should be very easy to copy and add as an add-on map for WU.

 

And b4 anyone says about deeds and stuff on these maps....i mean fresh maps....b4 players added any buildings. That's 8 clean maps that can be added one by one and should be VERY easy to add as they have already being made and they should also add alot to WU for players that already know these maps.

 

 

As for Warlanders post above  -  "Personally I think that currently existing maps cannot be released because this would reveal all not discovered good deed spots/resources, while original files of older maps are most likely lost forever."

 

I don't think adding a copy of the GV (Golden Valley) map to WU would break or effect anything in WO ..... so please think about adding that map to WU .... as everyone here is saying - More maps is always a good thing

[Eldurian 86]

I don't think I will play Unlimited but if I did, I would love to play Golden Valley without the skill cap of 20.

[wipeout 1,355]

if i recall rolf said something along the lines of keeping all backups not to long ago so im sure that the original map of jkh is still there or atleast the settings for it thus allowing it to be recreated to a huge degree

[Lycanthropic 523]

Personally I think that currently existing maps cannot be released because this would reveal all not discovered good deed spots/resources, while original files of older maps are most likely lost forever.

 

Damnit, that makes sense... I would have loved a day1 copy of the independence map, really want to see how my surroundings were before anybody set foot on the server...

[Acurapassion 54]

Personally I'd much rather be able to make my own map.

 

Well certainly, but that might be a while until any decent map making interface is produced.

[Nicrolis 980]

Got quite a bit of people working on them. Budda released a map maker, but its in java and hasnt been compiled yet.

[Xeon 21]

JKH <3

 

Assuming the original map data/settings are still around I see no harm in releasing old offline maps.

I miss the old style maps- the partially eroded terrace cliffs were just sooo good~

[Zenity 728]

The main question is. Do any of the present, or past, server maps exist as untouched files in a state where they'd be usable again?

 

I know that the server files are backed up, but how long is the chain? Most backups are a couple of levels of redundancy, to us this'd be an hour or two at most, once the oldest files reach a certain age they are discarded, otherwise Rolf and co face a mounting and probably unsustainable level of storage of server and player data.

 

Would I keep the original file for a server? As a sole operator, running it all on a reasonable PC, probably, but there's no real reason for Wurm to have the original untouched server map files lying around, it would serve no purpose for them.

 

What's most likely is that server map files are at most a few hours to a day old, to cover major catastrophe.

 

Sadly, due to redundant backup strategies the originals are probably gone forever, especially maps no longer in use.

 

I'd love to be wrong of course, but I suspect I'm not.

[Shalaris 0]

+1

[Acurapassion 54]

I think my support is already evident, but just going to +1 anyway so it's official, and maybe our wishes will be granted.

 

+1

Edited October 8, 2015 by Acurapassion

[joedobo 1,187]

We got the algorithm used to make the map dumps in WurmAPI. There are map dumps of servers before players changed them.

 

If we could reverse engineer them would it be okay to share them?

 

This approach won't give anything in the cave layer. Nor will it give us the rock layer and dirt layers. But it should be possible to get a rough estimate of the surface shape.

[Drpox 73]

Sorry Joe,  I already asked and it has been answered.  We wont be able to reverse engineer map dumps as a large majority of the critical information is removed in the map dump process. I will edit with link to warlanders statement.

 http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/131691-wurmapi-create-your-own-wurm-world/page-4

 

Post #70

Edited October 8, 2015 by Drpox

[joedobo 1,187]

Sorry Joe,  I already asked and it has been answered.  We wont be able to reverse engineer map dumps as a large majority of the critical information is removed in the map dump process. I will edit with link to warlanders statement.

 http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/131691-wurmapi-create-your-own-wurm-world/page-4

 

Post #70

 

Thanks for the link.

 

The answer is that Wurm won't stand in the way if someone can do it.  It seems folks think its not possible. I agree you'll only get an approximation. If you look at the map dumps  there are areas that are pure black, and some that are very white. 

[yarnevk 257]

It is theoretically possible with multiple projections at different angles , the terrain that is shadowed can be used to back calculate height undoing the known math that was used to calc the shadow in the first place, get enough angles of view you can cover the other terrain that is not shaded or hidden behind other terrain.  The same math that is used on earth to measure tree heights given the exact position of the sun that was casting the tree shadow.  But do you know the exact azimuth and elevation angle of the sun used to make the old dumpmaps, is the WurmAPI doing that exactly the same way?   At any rate you cannot find my Indy deed on any dumpmap because it is behind a mountain, multiple view maps do not exist thus that information is entirely lost as well as any censoring or terraforming that happened that lost the original terrain. 

 

I think coding and creation time is better spent on understanding what features it is that you liked about the old maps rather than engaging in a NSA level satellite photography coding expedition to recover that which is lost.

Edited October 9, 2015 by yarnevk

[Xeon 21]

I think coding and creation time is better spent on understanding what features it is that you liked about the old maps rather than engaging in a NSA level satellite photography coding expedition to recover that which is lost.

 

Exactly- For me one distinguishable feature that is no longer included in the newer server maps are the eroded cliffs that are present on JKH and Chaos.

 

 

From what I can tell it seems these maps were made using World Machine. I have messed around with the basic version for a few hours and it seems these maps have an initial perlin noise pass, then a terrace pass, and then an addition pass to add the mountains? I am by no means an expert with World Machine, but from what I can tell this seems to be a close estimation. I have had no luck however replicating this style- perhaps because of the basic limitations?

 

Perhaps the devs would be willing to enlighten us of their technique- assuming that they do indeed use World Machine.

[yarnevk 257]

Realistic cliffs require beach, river and rain erosion algorithms, that you run after you have done the initial terrain shaping algorithms.  But I wonder if they was dropped because of too many stuck Wurmians asking for GM help?  Wurm travel does not deal with crevices well.  Or is it just that the current map generation tool just has smooth mountains/cliffs algorithms?

 

But for an incredibly easy way to make cliffs?   Run a 16b map thru an 8b image format then add 16b fractal noise to rough it up.  Which is actually what that map looks like to me!

 

The question though is why do you like cliffs?  I am guessing them being a PVE barrier is exactly why you like them in PVP?  Natural defense?

Edited October 9, 2015 by yarnevk

[Rotab 121]

Exactly- For me one distinguishable feature that is no longer included in the newer server maps are the eroded cliffs that are present on JKH and Chaos.

 

From what I can tell it seems these maps were made using World Machine. I have messed around with the basic version for a few hours and it seems these maps have an initial perlin noise pass, then a terrace pass, and then an addition pass to add the mountains? I am by no means an expert with World Machine, but from what I can tell this seems to be a close estimation. I have had no luck however replicating this style- perhaps because of the basic limitations?

 

Perhaps the devs would be willing to enlighten us of their technique- assuming that they do indeed use World Machine.

If I remember correctly, Notch was the one that made the maps back in the days

[enoofu 206]

Notch used WM and apparently they also do some editing of WM results

[Karys 77]

I'd also like a copy of the Golden Valley map to go with my WU at some point so i can go back to all the old places i use to build places when i first started Wurm

With GV being of a smaller size it should be very easy to copy and add as an add-on map for WU.

 

...

 

 

As for Warlanders post above  -  "Personally I think that currently existing maps cannot be released because this would reveal all not discovered good deed spots/resources, while original files of older maps are most likely lost forever."

 

I don't think adding a copy of the GV (Golden Valley) map to WU would break or effect anything in WO ..... so please think about adding that map to WU .... as everyone here is saying - More maps is always a good thing

 

I would absolutely love to have a copy of the old GV map for WU use.  It seems like it would be about the perfect size for a single player or small group (I'm thinking 1-4 players as "small").  That and the nostalgia factor would make this a great addition to WU.