Fix the damn PvE rules!

[New_Unsleep 423]

That's what you're going to use as an excuse for harassment/griefing? Really? 'He was just helping the community!'

 

I'm curious...how many knarrs have you built?

 

Do you know how much work goes into them?

 

Do you know how long it takes to build one?

 

I built 3 in my time playing. The last one, even at my skill level (59-60 shipbuilding when I was working on it, 61+ by the time I was done.), still took me a little over 3 DAYS of hardcore work (As in, I logged in, did maintenance, and then that's all I did for multiple hours...and logged off.). You want to devalue my time investment so you can ride around 'in style' easier?

 

Yes, prices drop some when there's too much supply, and not enough demand...but the way these dropped, that wasn't basic market drop...because I choose not to devalue my own work by selling for 'cheap', I'm 'ripping people off'.

 

Lemme guess, you just steal yours?

Before i switched to pvp servers i built well over 20 knarrs, and no not for selling, because i wanted the collection, its pretty much all i did was build boats. But i didnt no life the game, saw no reason to, its not a game if you make it feel like work. At that point you might as well quit the "game" you've been playing, and if you really care so much about a single "griefer" who wasnt even really griefing, then im sorry for your luck

Edited July 21, 2015 by New_Unsleep

[Booskii 379]

I apparently come off as 'intimidating' and 'gruff' and there's RL reasons why (Of a very personal nature, which I would rather not bring into this thread.)

 

 

 

Nothing more then you have made public yourself...if you recall you spoke to me about this but i am a better person than to bring that up

[Corsan 199]

Nothing more then you have made public yourself...if you recall you spoke to me about this but i am a better person than to bring that up

 

Obviously not, as you just used it as an insult, and brought it up. Way to go being that 'better person'. /sarcasm

[Wargasm 1,928]

So you're admitting to breaking the game code and holding a unique on your deeds in public?

 

Oh I'm sorry, where does it say in the rules that you can't host public slayings for unique creatures?

 

 

Actually I didn't acll you a cheater in front of all your friends.  -snip-

 

Actually, you did.  You don't remember telling my alliance you think I was "botting" because I was logged in with 4 toons?  You may not remember, but I will never forget. 

 

 

I think what you just did there is a blatant example of you 'judging' someone else without all the facts.

 

People get "judged" every time they are being considered for joining an alliance or a deed within an alliance.  Just like people get "judged" in real life when they are applying for a job, or to buy/rent a house/apartment, or any other example that would involve one entity taking a potential risk to trust another person or entity.  The drama that follows you everywhere you go, proven by your whiny ramblings here in this very post, are one of the principal reasons why you may have trouble selling things, being recruited to new deeds and alliances and even making new friends.

 

It's not against the game rules if someone doesn't like you, no matter how bad you want it to be.  It's also not against the game rules to sell boats for way more than they're worth, and it's certainly not against the game rules for players such as Xyp to help other players find a better deal on items they're looking for.

Edited July 21, 2015 by Wargasm

[Corsan 199]

Oh I'm sorry, where does it say in the rules that you can't host public slayings for unique creatures?

 

 

 

Actually, you did.  You don't remember telling my alliance you think I was "botting" because I was logged in with 4 toons?  You may not remember, but I will never forget. 

 

 

 

People get "judged" every time they are being considered for joining an alliance or a deed within an alliance.  Just like people get "judged" in real life when they are applying for a job, or to buy/rent a house/apartment, or any other example that would involve one entity taking a potential risk to trust another person or entity.  The drama that follows you everywhere you go, proven by your whiny ramblings here in this very post, are one of the principal reasons why you may have trouble selling things, being recruited to new deeds and alliances and even making new friends.

 

It's not against the game rules if someone doesn't like you, no matter how bad you want it to be.  It's also not against the game rules to sell boats for way more than they're worth, and it's certainly not against the game rules for players such as Xyp to help other players find a better deal on items they're looking for.

 

They quite clearly stated they were making uniques not able to be trapped/able to roam until a party was formed to take them down. The fact that you and your ilk figured out a way around that is just one more example of what's wrong with this game. But that wouldn't be 'cheating' at all. *rolls eyes*

 

Innocent questions asking why someone is still moving their toon while AFK, and the anger over being caught is what's fogging your memory there.

 

It's a wonder you found a deed to take you in with your arrogance and grandstanding behavior. Nobody can ever comment on anything you say without you blowing your top on them. Many of us have witnessed it on public chats. But yet, somehow I'm the problem here? lol

[Wargasm 1,928]

The measures they took to prevent uniques from being penned were to deter people from keeping pets.  This is why uniques will bash down house walls and structures in their way, and even mine walls in their way.  Since December of last year when we killed the forest giant, there have been numerous public slayings on all servers, and even recognition by the staff in the weekly news about the events.  The staff knows full well what's going on with penning uniques, so you need to take it up with them, not accuse players of cheating.

 

Yep, you're the problem here.  I had no intention of replying to this thread, nor did I have knowledge of it until someone brought to my attention that my name was mentioned and we were being dragged into some kind of finger pointing.  I'm not the one trying to sell knars for 14 silver (which I find laughable, considering your boat prices have always been over priced), I'm not the one with people with people following me around and telling others that there's cheaper goods elsewhere, and I'm definitely not the one posting chat logs on the forums complaining about being picked on.

 

Sorry, that's your problem.  I have my own deed so I don't need to impress anyone. 

[Cecci 1,611]

Now this is getting really silly.
 

[Kruggan 519]

How come I never, ever in 4 years of playing have seen or run into this happening to me or someone I know in my various alliance?  Perhaps it's luck... or perhaps I deeded everything i cared about and put locks on things I wanted to protect.  

 

Is it really that complicated?

[Corsan 199]

I have my own deed so I don't need to impress anyone.

I had no intention of replying to this thread, nor did I have knowledge of it until someone brought to my attention that my name was mentioned and we were being dragged into some kind of finger pointing.

 

Apparently you do. You're in here 'defending your honor' or some nonsense, trying to impress people. The rationality of someone who doesn't want to impress anyone for sure!

 

The staff knows full well what's going on with penning uniques, so you need to take it up with them

 

Funny, that's what this thread is about! The staff needing to fix all this stuff. We are taking it up with them in the only way we can...(Does a derp need to be included here, or are you catching on yet?)

 

I'm using my personal happenstances as ways to show them how things are going bonkers in their current system.

 

My premium expires this week, and I already moved anything I cared about on my toon and all my stuff has long since been locked up and I moved my caravel with everything else way offshore. I almost certainly won't be paying for this game again. I'm here attempting to show things I wasn't allowed to talk about for 'fear' of being removed from the game by a jury rigged system that's built to protect certain people (Which isn't protecting the people it should.)

 

You're really going to come in here and say 'It's your fault the community attacked you!'? That's the defense you've got?

[New_Unsleep 423]

tbh you did bring this on yourself

[Corsan 199]

tbh you did bring this on yourself

 

I logged in and played a game. I dug some dirt. Someone got mad about my digging of said dirt and thus the nonsense began. You are very correct. I brought this upon myself by playing said game in the way it was intended and described on the front page itself, and should never have attempted to play said game, much less funded it.

 

That's what you're basically saying.

[Wargasm 1,928]

Yeah, that's what I've got.  If you're trying to sell a knar for 14 silver AND you're having PM wars with people because they are willing to sell the same thing you have for nearly HALF the price, that's not an issue with the PvE rules.  That's an issue with your ability to create and maintain interpersonal relationships and your ability to adapt to a changing economy.

 

And no, Corsan, digging dirt isn't the reason you get in trouble.  Needing to have the last word, bickering when someone disagrees with you and begrudging people based on your own poor assumptions are what get you in trouble.

 

Seriously dude.... just walk away.

[New_Unsleep 423]

Sometimes i think to myself "what would this person be like on a pvp server" and then i realize that i dont even want to think about it. 

[Lotus1 315]

I logged in and played a game. I dug some dirt. Someone got mad about my digging of said dirt and thus the nonsense began. You are very correct. I brought this upon myself by playing said game in the way it was intended and described on the front page itself, and should never have attempted to play said game, much less funded it.

 

That's what you're basically saying.

 

Every conflict is preventable. You could have solved the situation diplomatically, but from what you're describing, "diplomatically" is not a word in your vocabulary.

 

It's unfortunate but it's your loss in the end. You could have a much happier time in Wurm if you weren't so negative and accusing everyone of everything. All this thread has proven, at least to me, is that you have a lot to learn about how to talk to people.

 

Let me ask you this: Why should people treat you better in this game than you have been treating them? If you are going to accuse others of macroing, why should those people treat you with respect? If you are going to be negative to others in general, why should those people think positively about you?

[Corsan 199]

As once again he shows his lack of comprehension. It's kinda sad really.

 

The much vaunted 'community' strikes again.

 

Pray tell, what do you plan to do when there's no more people to 'take advantage of'?

 

Do you enjoy preying upon what you consider to be 'the weak'?

 

What does that say about your ethics and your morals?

 

Do you even have any?

 

All good questions to ask the 'community' that would attack someone who plays a game as an outlet to get away from the myriad troubles of RL.

 

Do you feel you've achieved something here today?

 

Did someone bully you as a child, so you grew up to be one?

[Wargasm 1,928]

Okay.  I think he's proven my point.  I'm done here.

[Lotus1 315]

As once again he shows his lack of comprehension. It's kinda sad really.

 

The much vaunted 'community' strikes again.

 

Pray tell, what do you plan to do when there's no more people to 'take advantage of'?

 

Do you enjoy preying upon what you consider to be 'the weak'?

 

What does that say about your ethics and your morals?

 

Do you even have any?

 

All good questions to ask the 'community' that would attack someone who plays a game as an outlet to get away from the myriad troubles of RL.

 

Do you feel you've achieved something here today?

 

Did someone bully you as a child, so you grew up to be one?

 

No one's out to get you dude. You are talking to players, just like you. They are here to play the game, just like you.

 

Bullying is a common misconception. The only bullying that takes place is the bullying YOU allow to happen. You control it if you get bullied or not as you, and only you, control your feelings. If you don't let people affect you, you can't be bullied.

[Corsan 199]

Every conflict is preventable. You could have solved the situation diplomatically, but from what you're describing, "diplomatically" is not a word in your vocabulary.

 

It's unfortunate but it's your loss in the end. You could have a much happier time in Wurm if you weren't so negative and accusing everyone of everything. All this thread has proven, at least to me, is that you have a lot to learn about how to talk to people.

 

Let me ask you this: Why should people treat you better in this game than you have been treating them? If you are going to accuse others of macroing, why should those people treat you with respect? If you are going to be negative to others in general, why should those people think positively about you?

 

You and I had some discussions in-game actually...after you tried to msg me to buy my rare ornate fountain. Did I go out of my way to treat you badly? Did I 'talk down to you'?

 

I approach everyone with a friendly attitude, and return that whence I receive.

 

If you talk to me insultingly, I return the favor.

 

Wargasm has belittled me from the minute he started talking to me (Way back when I met him on Pristine.). I later informed him of why I'm not so good at the social 'graces' when I was trying to join Booski's deed and he proceeded to turn UP his belittling...even after admitting to similar issues himself. He's just garnering that which he provides.

[Teberon 4]

So currently GMs have tied our hands behind our backs, thrown us into the water and now they tell us, that it is our own problem, how we swim out. And of course the sharks, who swim in the water among us are rubbing their hands and tell us the situation is perfect.

I have to disagree with you. Why should something in the game be different to the real world? You throw your lotto ticket in the trash and two days later you're missing it. You won't be able to get it back. You're on vacation in another country and somebody steals the mobile right out of your hand. You'll never see it again. So why do you want to be less careful in the game and want others to do your job? Be active and save your stuff before it's to late.

 

A Game master normally has many things to do and playing babysitter for someone not taking care of his stuff is nothing what their job is intended to be.

[Corsan 199]

No one's out to get you dude. You are talking to players, just like you. They are here to play the game, just like you.

 

Bullying is a common misconception. The only bullying that takes place is the bullying YOU allow to happen. You control it if you get bullied or not as you, and only you, control your feelings. If you don't let people affect you, you can't be bullied.

 

Pretty sure you don't know what actual bullying is. You're going to say that someone (For example) who is bullied incessantly who then proceeds to take their own life because of it, is at fault?

 

Is this more of the 'blame the victim' mentality that seems so prevalent on these boards/in this game?

 

I'm guessing there's a few lawyers and psychologists who'd disagree with you on the matter.

 

I love how people run around with misconceptions about people in their heads, and then treat them badly because of their (Often overly harsh) misjudgments.

 

Serraphine approached me with a 'This horrible noob is just shacking up by my deed to ruin my playtime' mentality...and greeted me in a very rude way, so I responded in kind. Was it my fault they greeted me in such a way?

 

I greeted them in game with a /wave emote and said something along the lines of 'Hey, how's it going?' when they rolled by my place and went in the mine that I didn't even know about...they ignored me and so I was like "Are you the person who owns that hidden door there?" and they replied with 'i am the person who put this road from here to the other deed' and so I scratched my head and was like...uh..that's not what I asked...to myself...so I was like 'I wasn't destroying the road.'...and they responded with 'lets just say that i'mn not thrilled that you are here and leave it at that'...and I'm like...'Uh, OK, what crawled up their rear?' in my head....and replied with 'So that's a yes? You built a hidden door and are trying to hide the resources in there?'...and I was trying to explain myself...'Well, if I'd known there was a 'hidden' door there and you owned some mine in there, I would've kept up with my plan to move across to the island. But these folks around here seemed to want me to stick around.'...and they just ignored me. No answer. So I was like 'Well excuse me for moving onto what looked like empty land after talking to the previous owner who gave me their writ so I could set up. If you weren't milking your little cash cow mine in secrecy...I wouldn't have wasted my damn time.' and was explaining myself further 'I was uncovering the hillside to see what was there because I want to be a smither on this game.'....and then I heard from a person who'd dragged me out that way that they were badmouthing me in alliance chat...'I've heard on the alliance channel you are like one tile off his alts deed ' (Which wasn't true, I was 6-8 tiles off their PERIMETER)...

 

So yes, at that point, I did get a bit hot-headed/said something I shouldn't. It's pretty rude to approach someone like that and be that insulting.

 

'[21:36:34] <Corsan> People like you are jackasses.

[21:59:35] <Corsan> I'm curious what deed you think I'm trespassing on....since there's no deeds within range. You don't own the whole coastline.

[22:01:05] <Corsan> And for your information, I asked everyone around before I bleeping moved here.'

 

Like I said, I have the logs of all this stuff still.

 

It's all in how people approach you...drama started over their own behavior, and all the way down the road, I'm somehow held 'at fault' for the continued stuff? Really?

[Zundy 99]

Mods it's happening again! Moderation please!

[Lotus1 315]

EDIT: You know what? This isn't worth it. Good luck in your future endeavors Corban.... and I hope you figure your stuff out.

Edited July 21, 2015 by Lotus1

[Corsan 199]

It wasn't your fault that they greeted you in such a way, but it is your fault for greeting them back in a similar way. That's not how you solve conflict. You solve conflict by talking to them nicely, even when they talk to you rudely. It diffuses the situation and allows for a better chance of a solution that solves the problem.

 

I know very well what bullying is. I've been bullied many times before as I allowed myself to be bullied many times before. It's happened in this game. It's happened in real life. But I have learned that I control my own feelings. You also control your own feelings.

 

You can bring out the inner child in you in every conversation and lash out at others rudely, but it will never solve any problem. However, I'm going to digress. It's up to you how you want to take my posts. You can choose to ignore them and nothing will change, or you can at least contemplate some of the things I've said and make a step in a more positive direction.

 

In the end, it's your ulcer, not mine.

 

Well, it's pretty obvious they want all the infighting/treating eachother like crap to continue. That's why I'm leaving.

 

I signed onto PvE because I wanted to be able to play without all that drama/infighting and be able to play WITH other people, only to find that on this game, it's actually worse on PvE servers because you can't do anything about it. You just kinda bend over and take it, or retaliate and get removed from the game.

 

I actually have the combat skills to go over to PvP, but I have no desire for all the political intrigue brouhaha and ability to just randomly get shot in the back while you're crafting, or to login and find nothing there anymore, or any of multiple other stories I've heard come from players who were there.

 

Especially after I read that GM's and the game's creator himself participate in the PvP. Talk about corruption...

[rixk 830]

I have to disagree with you. Why should something in the game be different to the real world? You throw your lotto ticket in the trash and two days later you're missing it. You won't be able to get it back. You're on vacation in another country and somebody steals the mobile right out of your hand. You'll never see it again. So why do you want to be less careful in the game and want others to do your job? Be active and save your stuff before it's to late.

 

A Game master normally has many things to do and playing babysitter for someone not taking care of his stuff is nothing what their job is intended to be.

OK, like real life? Fine. If your neighbor forgets to lock the doors of his car and/or the keys into the car.. go jump in and park his car in your garage, you can always explain later to the police, that it was his own fault. Yes, he could've prevented it to happen, but that doesn't in any way make your actions legal.

That brings me back to what I wanted to say with my previous post... Despite how secure you make the system, s**t still happens, because people do mistakes, that both in game and in real world(even devs make mistakes, because one of their mistakes PvP was recently put on hold).. And someone taking advantage of others mistakes IS offender.

When GMs are overloaded with work, that is not really my(or any of the players) problem, but the problem of the person, who is managing the GMs. But how it was decided to start ignoring certain support calls to lower GMs workload is very interesting approach. Using this approach we could close down the GM service entirely and reduce their workload to zero. How good idea it is, is another thing of course..

[Reylaark 1,100]

Bottom line to me is the same as everyone else's, on all sides of this issue.

• No one wants the GMs being forced to babysit, to police, to reprimand, to be forced into exercising judgment when it'll bite them in the bum whichever way they rule.

On PvP, how is something addressed when people do bad things?

• Get annoyed.
• Vow to put a stop to it.
• Sharpen double-headed axe.
• Talk to alliance, kingdom, spies, Gods and locate culprit.
• Introduce culprit to #3.
• Repeat introduction with increasing violence until satisfied.

On PvE, how is something address when people do bad things?
^{Conceding that even with deeds, people will do bad things.}

• Get annoyed.
• Vow to put a stop to it.
• Put on KOS, unless highway, then skip to #4.
• Get annoyed.  KOS is ineffective.
• Vow to put a stop to it.
• ?

Some thoughts as to solutions:    Please modify these, discuss, add your own, say something stupid (thx for the bump!)
KOS should result in a sinking feeling in the pit of someone's stomach.  It should be serious, I mean, Kill On Sight, sounds rather serious to me.  KOS should mean just that on PvE, emphasis on the K.
 
Code in varying levels of KOS:

• Detain: slows the offender's speed by 50% while on/around deed.
• Harass: Don't kill the man, but make him bleed.
• Angry old man:  Shake your fist at the offender wildly, yelling out "why you little whippersnapper!"
• KOS: Detain + Kill.  Spirit Guards and tower guards strengthened by Rage and cannot be killed by human player.
• Wrath of Community(WC): no, we're not banishing the offender to the toilet.

• Requires KOS on 5 deeds.
• Does not offer the offender protection for highways.
• Automatically, every mayor on continent provided with the 5 mayor names who initiated WC so they may inquire and choose to join in KOS directive.
• slows offender 75%.  Spirit guard and tower guards strengthened by Rage.  All immediately descend upon offender and tear him to little tiny pieces, then point to little tiny pieces and laugh.

     6.  God's Wrath: Offender still manages to cause trouble?  Then, and only then, a GM gets involved to deny the offender's right of existence.  Hopefully it doesn't carry on all the way to this.
 
Benefit: Not every offense warrants death, so players have options.  Harshest penalty option provided to community and demands consensus.
Problem: Hopefully the requirement for multiple deeds using KOS will curb abuse/exploit/grief?
 
^{Tracking could be improved, but keeping longer logs of everything that happens to walk by may not be technically sound.}
WatchDogs:

• Tamed dog on deed will hone in on any human scent and remember for (level of dog's taming) determined amount of time.
• Dog can be clicked to request information, which provides player name, entrance time stamp, and exit time stamp.
• Number of players the dog can remember depends on taming skill.

Benefit:  Improve accountability and evidence/deduction.
Problem:  Only one tamed animal means player would have to forgo that assurance for another pet.

Edited July 21, 2015 by Reylaark