Postes

A visualization of updates and who they benefit.

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You forgot easter eggs, yule trees, those reindeer statue jingle bell things, santa hats, snow globe lamps, gnomes, fancy hats... for the PvE side.


 


You forgot nerfed guards, nerfed templars, functional archery towers and turrets (the ballista works here so mark that as both)... for the PvP side.


 


I'm sure I missed about 10,000 decorations PvP got for PvE to have and 20 or so changes that we got on PvE for PvP to have.


 


EDIT: You also need a column for things neither side wanted.


Edited by Audrel

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Minor issue with some of the logic in this thread.


 


PvE, ie. Freedom, has titles unavailable on PvP, ie. Epic.


 


Functional?  Nope, nothing functional about it.  Useful in battle?  Nope, not even a little bit.


 


and yet...


http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/125139-make-all-the-skill-titles-available-on-epic/


 


I'm perfectly willing to believe the OP (postes was it?) speaks for his immediate circle of friends.  These may well be the most important people in the world as we know it.


 


It doesn't change the fact that OP really only speaks for his immediate circle of friends.


 


There is no dichotomy.


 


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You do know PVP ers   spend more money on the game than Freedomers.       Soo many poors on Freedom.


 


 


 


I live on freedom and am poor.   :(


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A month?  I put in the first post it's based from updates from December 2014 to now.

I don't know if I can believe you, I was looking at these lists of updates:

* http://www.wurmpedia.com/index.php/Wurm_Server_Release_Notes_2014#141202_Planting_options (First update in December 2014 and onwards)

* http://www.wurmpedia.com/index.php/Wurm_Server_Release_Notes_2015

They seem to be a little bit longer than your spreadsheet. And as I said, you won't catch all the ninja changes that have been forgotten to be included in the patch notes. You've only picked a very chosen few, then categorised them as you felt was right, and there's certainly nothing wrong with the latter. The final result though is very misleading, considering the number of updates you picked.

Edited by Ulviirala

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I went off the news and updates posts, and took those, not that list.  The ones the Wurm team choose to publicize.  


Edited by Postes

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I agree, these PVEers are babies

 

It was not a PVEer that started this whine thread, it was a PVPer whining.

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Silly thread, the only things that doesn't benefit all servers are Epic and PvP only additions. All the rest obviously is available for everyone. Why can't PvP players care about design and nice looks!?  Just silly. 


 


It's not a competition anyway...


 


I don't mind PvP getting some attention. What I think is a bit sad though is that the devs do nothing at all for fighting/hunting aspects on freedom, everything is just new items. New items, building and such is nice, sure, but figthing is a part of freedom as well and it is still as boring as it was 5 years ago. 


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Thanks for this, it will help us keep track of who deserves the next update.

 

I'm kidding, this is nonsense.

 

 

But if you must know, that's the reaction on PvE side many of the times we get some PvP "balancing" messing with our gameplay.

 

Edit:  Maybe I should start a suggestion' poll regarding removing bridges from PvP?  You know, so Freedom-only mechanics stop being used as exploits over there?

Edited by Mordraug

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Doesn't matter. It's content. Content is content. A texture change to grass going live on both servers is content on both servers.

Okay, then refer back to the part where I said Freedom chooses not to have PvP-related updates. To voluntarily opt out of a specific set of the game's features and then cry that you're not getting those features that you chose not to have is ridiculous.

These aren't two separate games; PvP is the full game, and PvE is "creative mode" (to borrow from Minecraft terminology). PvP will always have more features than PvE, because there's more to the game on a PvP server.

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Okay, then refer back to the part where I said Freedom chooses not to have PvP-related updates. To voluntarily opt out of a specific set of the game's features and then cry that you're not getting those features that you chose not to have is ridiculous.

These aren't two separate games; PvP is the full game, and PvE is "creative mode" (to borrow from Minecraft terminology). PvP will always have more features than PvE, because there's more to the game on a PvP server.

 

The same applied to decorations, Fawkes. I'm not the one crying here. The one crying is a PvPer who listed 3 updates exclusive to PvP vs many updates he is saying were for PvE. They went live on all servers. There is no PvE exclusive content. You guys over there get it also. Check cheeks and hand the kleenexes where the tears are flowing. They aren't on these cheeks.

 

EDIT: Correction. We get GM run scavenger hunts that PvP players from Chaos are welcome to join. Guess that means they aren't exclusive either.

Edited by Audrel

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The same applied to decorations, Fawkes. I'm not the one crying here. The one crying is a PvPer who listed 3 updates exclusive to PvP vs many updates he is saying were for PvE. They went live on all servers. There is no PvE exclusive content. You guys over there get it also. Check cheeks and hand the kleenexes where the tears are flowing. They aren't on these cheeks.

 

EDIT: Correction. We get GM run scavenger hunts that PvP players from Chaos are welcome to join. Guess that means they aren't exclusive either.

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There's so much more to the game on PvP servers than what Wurm seems to be on paper.

There's so much more to the game on PvE servers than what Wurm seems to be on paper.

Feeling like one is better than the other, quickly makes you forget that both play styles bring forth things that are very unique, and make the game so special for every player. Both accomplish great achievements nonetheless, and both are very important to Wurm. To Wurm as a game, and as a business, that allows it to keep running, and keep developing.

Any update really benefits both sides in the end. If you can't see that, or admit that, you haven't gotten over yourself just yet, I think. *whispers* we all are a bit selfish, maybe in our own special way even ;)

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I wouldn't say he's crying.  PvP players are so often depicted as Rolf's favored children and scapegoated at every turn, especially in regard to what updates we get. With that in mind, the post seemed intended to set people straight more than anything. Especially considering that Posteh later said "there's really nothing unfair in how Wurm Online develops the game, it favors no one."

 

Of course, we all know mighty PvPers never cry, tears are an exclusive behavior of carebears...

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whats even the purpose or intent of this thread? I just see a list with "some" updates that are randomly categorized into PVP, PVE and both and then alot of chattering about PVE vs PVP and biases...


 


is this supposed to be informative? or is it an attempt of criticism? or an attempt to make people think about wurm? I don't get it.


 


Could you maybe explain what this list means to you?


Edited by Miretta

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Can we go back a little further and include about 6 months of the devs time spent on challenge? And by the way, how exactly do challenge rewards benefit pve, when only pvp players get them?

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Can we go back a little further and include about 6 months of the devs time spent on challenge? And by the way, how exactly do challenge rewards benefit pve, when only pvp players get them?

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I was looking at the OP again and I see the biggest problem with his list.  It is only for the last 6 months.  You take any random period like that and you will find one side or the other got a bit more in updates.  How about being honest and look at the entire time the game has been playing, how many updates were for pvp and how many were pve?


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Inb4 someone calls the latest Java update "PvE exclusive".


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Challenge rewards benefit both playstyles, since PVE players were also welcome to play there, Also, look at how much people are selling the statues/masks/whatever other challenge rewards there were, on Freedom. That's certainly benefitting the PvE'r who won the item.

uhm...with THAT logic, one could say that everyone is free to benefit from every update! :o 

 

hm....something itches my mind....oh yeah! i think we are all playing wurm online! so every update actually benefits everyone, because it's for the same game...>.>

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uhm...with THAT logic, one could say that everyone is free to benefit from every update! :o

 

hm....something itches my mind....oh yeah! i think we are all playing wurm online! so every update actually benefits everyone, because it's for the same game...>.>

I am in fact trying to say that. This whole PvP vs PvE crap is ridiculous.

 

Only thing I will say is that the kingdom specific wagons/tabards/banners/whatever stay kingdom exclusive.

Edited by Firestarter

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I am in fact trying to say that. This whole PvP vs PvE crap is ridiculous.

 

Only thing I will say is that the kingdom specific wagons/tabards/banners/whatever stay kingdom exclusive.

 

Make up your mind =)

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whats even the purpose or intent of this thread? I just see a list with "some" updates that are randomly categorized into PVP, PVE and both and then alot of chattering about PVE vs PVP and biases...

 

is this supposed to be informative? or is it an attempt of criticism? or an attempt to make people think about wurm? I don't get it.

 

Could you maybe explain what this list means to you?

 

TBH it has been much more interesting to see what this post means to you, and everyone else in the thread.

 

It's interesting to see how people can read the same data and come to such different conclusions on it :D

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I fixed that, it was merely an oversight.  

 

But again, it's not about PvP vs PvE, it's about showing a visual representation that really no one side is favored.  A lot of stuff can be considered both perhaps, but visual aesthetics aren't as important on PvP servers compared to PvE.

Do it again, but go back some time... As in a large time frame, use the wiki update page, and count the updates that only work for PvP. And not just major features, look at changes in general, because even small bugfixes like when they put Magranon Hammer 2h, then 1h or whatever it was, that's 2 changes for PvP.

With half a dozen developers working on code, that's HUGE.

Then do the same.

Count EXCLUSIVE PvE changes. Not what you think is meant for one or the other. Because honestly, Chaos players make a mint from their exclusive Decorative items.

 

Its not too hard to see how much more care is devoted to PvP just look at how many posts Rolf posted about "How shall we improve PvE?".

I'm not saying its the PvP comunity's fault, its the game development plan and policy (or its absense) that generates this. That and the inability from the devs to leave the comfort zone, and their tendency to overvalue the conservative players point of view (maybe because its the easiest one) which pretty much means that Wurm development is pretty much like deaths in comics, Superman dies, there's a whole lot of cry and teeth grinding, and a couple issues later everything is back the same. Look at challenge, lots of flash and whatnot, the "future of Wurm" where is it now?

Nowhere. What did we get from it? A bunch of stuff that's had to be continuously nerfed and bugfixed because the devs can't seem to see fit to break the mould.

Edited by KanePT

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I'm amazed I missed such a bad thread this long.


 


-1 despite not being a suggestion


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