How newer players will never be as good as the vets

[Wulfur 32]

This is just a simple question for the vets out there.    Over the years there have been more than a few nerfs to players , skill gains ,  items and a few more.

My question is this how is it fair for the newer players coming into wurm knowing that at one point I use to get crazy body stat  gains , but it got nerfed.   How is it fair for the newer players to say make a priest now knowing I can cast a lot better than they will ever be able to when I  had lowish sd I had way better cast than any new priest will ever hope to get due to a nerf.

 

  So many nerfs over the years seems that the only people to benefit from this are the few top end old timers " vets "   How is this fair ?    Most newish players don't even read / post on the forums. There voice is never heard  all you see , mostly , are these vets.  

 

 

 

So vets tell me if you had to start over and play knowing what you know now would you ?    I bet not

 

 

 

no I am not nearly as salty as this post may seem

Edited June 9, 2015 by Wulfur

[Cornchips 3,037]

WHAT IS THIS, LOAD OF EDGY THREADS DAY

[Wulfgarr 810]

This is just a simple question for the vets out there.    Over the years there have been more than a few nerfs to players , skill gains ,  items and a few more.

My question is this how is it fair for the newer players coming into wurm knowing that at one point I use to get crazy body stat  gains , but it got nerfed.   How is it fair for the newer players to say make a priest now knowing I can cast a lot better than they will ever be able to when I  had lowish sd I had way better cast than any new priest will ever hope to get due to a nerf.

 

  So many nerfs over the years seems that the only people to benefit from this are the few top end old timers " vets "   How is this fair ?    Most newish players don't even read / post on the forums. There voice is never heard  all you see , mostly , are these vets.  

 

 

 

So vets tell me if you had to start over and play knowing what you know now would you ?    I bet not

 

 

 

no I am not nearly as salty as this post may seem

K?

[Odynn 2,248]

Hello,

 

[20:59:09] You have played 477 days, 18 hours and 37 minutes.

 

Half my skills are still a 1,

 

Pick any of them, grind up, be as good as a vet

 

Everything in Wurm isn't about catching up.

[Wulfur 32]

If I had played 411 days  but 300 of those days I got really good skill ticks say in body stats how is that fair to the person that has only played  100 days but will never get them same ticks due to a nerf to body stat gains ?  or to the up and coming priest that will never be able to cast " The way I use to cast " with the same stats at the time. ?  

 

My point is not saying that people should all have the same skills. My point is that I had a lot easier time getting my skills to where they are than the newer players will ever have.

[Steeloxide 146]

WHAT IS THIS, ###### LOAD OF EDGY THREADS DAY

Change is coming. People want to influence how it changes. Just as you do.

[Thorakkanath 444]

I agree with OP in many ways and yet I am one of those vets...how I am not godlike like some others that shall remain unnamed but I have quite a few skills

 

It is true that a new player can never ever catch up to someone that started playing 7-8 years ago that actually plays the game

It is also true that some things that were easier to do in the past are no longer possible (gaining mind speed from yoyos for one)

 

But I cannot really fault old players for having skills, and I would hate that a new player could reach my skills fast, so I don't want the grinding to become any easier than it is now

 

WHAT I DO MIND however, is the fact that account sales are possible - this prevents new players (and experienced as well just not godlike) that do not purchase accounts to ever be on the same level as old players. Why? well characters get recycled so their skills never perish with the real people like it would happen IRL. And because of this ever growing pool of skilled people in every and any skill it becomes increasingly hard for a new player not only to want to play on a beginner vs. buying a high skilled char, but also takes away the whole economy aspect of the game (which arguably is a very large portion of the game, especially on freedom)

 

The result: high entry barriers (e.g. RL cash) to have the same amount of fun that the current vets had when they first started playing this game

 

Ultimately that results in less player retention overall as the game isn't as attractive as it used to be

Edited June 9, 2015 by Thorakkanath

[Arvid 64]

If you're playing on any of the Freedom servers how important is it really to catch up with any veterans? Shouldn't your ultimate goal be to just have fun rather than run around comparing yourself to everyone else?

[ownerpure5 322]

ayy lmao

[revengo 277]

I've played for a little over a year with a 3 month break and I can compete with pretty much anyone on Chaos. Barring the top-tier / sotg / champs, which the last two I can choose if I want to take my char to the next level. My body stats are lacking, but they'll get there eventually. Why should you be able to overtake people who have years of playtime in less time than it took them? Enjoy the game and go from there.

 

Edit for perspective: I've played Wurm since 2004, and every account I've used has been one I built from the ground up.

Edited June 9, 2015 by revengo

[Steeloxide 146]

Shouldn't your ultimate goal be to just have fun rather than run around comparing yourself to everyone else?

You do know that "fun" is subjective right?

Meaning everyone finds Wurm "fun" for their own reasons.

Personally I derived alot of my enjoyment from competitively growing my skills with those around me.

Who are you to say that my version of fun is wrong.

Edited June 9, 2015 by Steeloxide

[Alyeska 2,621]

To have comparable fun as when I started playing, you need to not use any of the following;

 

 

horses

wagons

large carts

boats

mounting animals

hellhorses, hellhounds, hell scorpions, respawning uniques

sheep, bison, all the sea creatures

valrei missions and their rewards, includes tomes from uniques

karma, and meditation

generic pretty things like nice textures and flowerpots (lots of pretty things, thanks team!)

two story buildings, bridges, and character customization

crates, and the ability to load items

pendulums and water sources

marble and slate

50 ql iron, max, unless you visit the pvp server

no skill decay (use your skills at least once a week or they start to go down on their own)

rare and better items, easy coin by a bit of luck

foraging for coins

buying premium with ingame coins

rewards for being premium

sleeping powders, magic chests, all that shiny stuff

all those new enchants, like LT and mindstealer, nimbleness

enchants in general were far and few inbetween because servers only had 50 some people playing, hardly any of them priests

8 freedom servers (including one pvp) and 4 epic servers - skim that back down to 2 pve and 1 pvp server

Seryll as an additional high-end metal for better tools and weapons and armour

Sermons and linking priests, you can only become a priests by visiting the lights on the pvp server

less skill loss on death ( used to lose .25 in all skills and every skill upon death)

probably more that I can't think of from the top of my head

 

 

 

 

While a lot of "windows of opportunities" have been removed, that may make it harder or different to skill up certain skills, there has also been a LOT of new, helpful things added that in turn make it more fun and easier in different ways to play and skill. Maybe I just don't have a desire to always be the very best but to have fun, and there is a LOT more stuff now to have fun with than there was 6-7 years ago when I first played...

 

 

I remember going to the impalong at newtown, an event that still happens todat but was much different then. This was when I just started playing. I walked from my little wooden house to newtown, which on the roads took about an hour. Horses or large carts were not a thing, animals couldnt be ridden. Walking is the only option. I got there, there was about 20 people off and on. They imped one or two tools to 55 ql, which was exceptional. The iron had to be imported because on the pve servers, iron was capped to 50 ql. There were no priests to enchant. Blacksmiths had 50-60 skill. This was wurm life then, and I had fun playing, but I cannot possibly say I had an much easier time gaining skill then, despite that some skills were faster. Skills also did decay, if you did not use them for a certain amount of time they would start to drop. If you died, you lose .25 in ALL skills. My greatest, most valued possession was a 70 ql leather pants with 27 aosp that metaldragon gave to me when he came to visit from chaos. A friend bought me premium for christmas, I had to give him my password and in return he got my referal and I could keep the christmas gift. Thanks, Johnny

 

 

---

 

 

I went to the impalong last year. There was about 20 good priests online at all times. 90+ in all smithing skills, people imping loads and loads of items to 70, 80 or even 90 ql for free. Entire sets of tools, armour and horse gear, enchanted and imped. There are tons of people to help out each other with tips for skilling, or free tools, meals, and beds for sleeping bonus. Stuff is given away for free left and right anywhere in the game. Because of these older, high skill accounts, good tools and enchants are available to use for the masses to help them have an easier time in wurm online. Deeds can be placed by non-premiums, and premium is fairly easily earned and kept by foraging for coins or doing some simple chores. In which case, you have acces to mount a horse to help you move from a to b faster and enjoy hunting more with the additional CR you get from riding.

 

 

 

 

To answer the OP; if I were to find the game today and try it, I would stay, despite the "skill windows" being gone now. Comparing for myself how easy it is to grind skills now and then, I think that it by far makes up for those skill windows....

Edited June 9, 2015 by Alyeska

[Hailene 362]

As Alyeska said, some things have gotten harder and some things have gotten easier relative to the past.  I think for getting really high BC, the general increase for skills that give BC (while nerfing archery) is probably a buff for most people.  I know my BC stat has sky rocketed since the change (chilling a bit over 46.52), and I've never fired a bow in my life.

 

It's sorta a wash mostly across the board.

 

I've only been around for a couple of years, but I hear some things were rougher.  Like 30 second mining timers and no imp column for items (my God, how did people live back then?)

[Lotus1 315]

There are players who have only played a year who are better than players who have played 4 years. It's like any game (aside from games like Eve), where the more work you put in the more rewards you'll get. It's completely fair in that sense. You put in the work so why shouldn't you get rewarded? Some vets do start over again believe it or not. It can be refreshing at times.

 

I'm curious as to what the op is trying to accomplish with this thread. So many false assumptions seem to be made.

Edited June 9, 2015 by Lotus1

[Thorakkanath 444]

To have comparable fun as when I started playing, you need to not use any of the following;

 

[snip]

 

To answer the OP; if I were to find the game today and try it, I would stay, despite the "skill windows" being gone now. Comparing for myself how easy it is to grind skills now and then, I think that it by far makes up for those skill windows....

 

 

That sounds so wonderful I wish I started playing back then

[Arvid 64]

You do know that "fun" is subjective right?

Meaning everyone finds Wurm "fun" for their own reasons.

Personally I derived alot of my enjoyment from competitively growing my skills with those around me.

Who are you to say that my version of fun is wrong.

I don't think fun is "subjective", but I do think there's countless ways to have fun and that none of them are more right or wrong than any other.

[NeoRuger 65]

When you're able to buy/trade accounts, this is irrelevant.

[Steeloxide 146]

I don't think fun is "subjective", but I do think there's countless ways to have fun and that none of them are more right or wrong than any other.

"Subjective is the opposite of objective, which refers to things that are more clear-cut. That Earth has one moon is objective — it's a fact. Whether the moon is pretty or not is subjective — not everyone will agree. Facts are objective, but opinions are subjective."

"Fun" is subjective.

Edited June 9, 2015 by Steeloxide

[Arvid 64]

"Subjective is the opposite of objective, which refers to things that are more clear-cut. That Earth has one moon is objective — it's a fact. Whether the moon is pretty or not is subjective — not everyone will agree. Facts are objective, but opinions are subjective."

"Fun" is subjective.

I think you're completely misunderstanding what I'm trying to convey to you.

[Steeloxide 146]

When you're able to buy/trade accounts, this is irrelevant.

This is made relevant by the ability to buy and trade accounts.

If high skilled accounts never leave, and every month more accounts become high skilled then eventually there will be a surplus and characters will devalue, and anyone will be able to buy a high skilled character for cheap.

The economy sure will be bland when everyone is a pro at everything.

[Lotus1 315]

When you're able to buy/trade accounts, this is irrelevant.

 

This depends on the kind of player you are. Some people don't want to buy accounts. In fact, most players don't.

[LorraineJ 1,099]

WHAT I DO MIND however, is the fact that account sales are possible - this prevents new players (and experienced as well just not godlike) that do not purchase accounts to ever be on the same level as old players.

 

Do you think people are going to be willing to put in this kind of grind if they don't know that ultimately they can at least sell the toon to offset all of the investment they made in it? You don't see how that would shrink the player base even smaller?

 

Can people please give some consideration to the fact that the devs need to survive? Devs need to make income. Players need to have amusement. Please be fair.

[LorraineJ 1,099]

If you're playing on any of the Freedom servers how important is it really to catch up with any veterans? Shouldn't your ultimate goal be to just have fun rather than run around comparing yourself to everyone else?

 

Exactly.

 

I think the home page needs to be changed from:

 

WURM - The Sandbox MMO

 

to:

 

WURM - The Player-Based Economy

[Thorakkanath 444]

Do you think people are going to be willing to put in this kind of grind if they don't know that ultimately they can at least sell the toon to offset all of the investment they made in it? You don't see how that would shrink the player base even smaller?

 

Can people please give some consideration to the fact that the devs need to survive? Devs need to make income. Players need to have amusement. Please be fair.

 

 Your first statement, no other game (that I know of) has this system where you can get money out of the game time they invested in. So your comment "Players need to have amusement" needs to be edited to "amusement and cash" to totally capture your own statement. Also because on the TOS you have very clearly stated that there are no refunds I do not think anyone NEEDS to get money out of the game by selling their characters. There are literally millions (or hundreds of millions) of players playing thousands of games that do not give them the option to get money back.

 

Your second comment:

 

Buying and selling of accounts does not influence the money CC gets as the money used to purchase them do not come from the shop but from players. Moreover these new accounts will buy gold from the players as it's cheaper, again, not benefiting CC in any way.

 

How am I not fair?

[Wulfur 32]

Thing is if ROLF went back and took everyone's body stats b4 that nerf hit and put them stats in line with the current skill ticks    every vet that was able to get there stats during the prenerf period would be up in arms.   

 

My point for making this thread was to simply point out that there was time when the current ' Vet '   had it much easier for a lot of things.  That have  either 1) been nerf 2)  " fixed "   3)  bug fixes

 

 

 

 Vets had it much easier than the current up and coming person.   

Edited June 9, 2015 by Wulfur