Bring Back Weapon Chant Decay

[Nappy 1,369]

Ok, let's analyse what sucking it up costs.

 

5 x 10 silver per month premium = 50 silver

10k of cordage rope = 10 silver

 

So conservatively let's go 60 silver as the monthly cost for a high end weapon making operation with high Vyn and Fo enchants.

 

If I charge an average of 5s per weapon I need to sell 12 weapons just to cover monthly costs.

 

It's a good thing I am not playing this game to make money. Instead I play this game because I enjoy playing it and therefore I spend the money on the required characters to be able to produce these weapons.

 

My monthly costs are not unusual among the others who also make enchanted weapons in this game. 

 

How many of the people requiring enchant decay removal are also supporting the game at the rate of 60+ silver per month?

 

~Nappy

[Tsetse 87]

Thanks for the kind words MD, makes me feel better about the whole situation. Nice to see you and all the others that understand the reality of it. Is a shame a couple of folks needed to get nasty to make their points. Truly shows their immaturity.

 

He is right there are trigger words even in this game and when you mention them people will swarm and unload the comeback replies they wish they would have posted the last time they were debating someone who used the same trigger word.

[Rockmod 17]

I've read as much of this thread as I can but my opinion is... remove shattering on items above a certain ql to make re-enchanting less risky. Make enchanting itself more linear or rechargeable as mentioned, then allow weapon enchant decay but make sure it's an acceptable rate to please those that don't like spending more coin in game.

[Fraeya 341]

 allow weapon enchant decay but make sure it's an acceptable rate to please those that don't like spending more coin in game.

 

Or people can just not buy the super casted high ql weapons if they cannot afford them, a 70ql axe will do you just as well as a 70ql enchanted one. 

[Lotus1 315]

Believe it or not, I don't care either way what happens with the weapon decays. However, I still stand by what I said earlier and, if people wish to refuse to even at least acknowledge my argument, then that's up to them.

 

@Metaldragon. If you need to insult us arguing the other side and claim we're immature, don't you think that's rather immature in itself? This is a debate more than anything and in no way was I trying to insult anyone in this. I don't think you should be either.

Edited June 6, 2015 by Lotus1

[Fdancer 15]

A little light humor for this heated thread, taken from screen shot thread

*edit: a dozen edits later, figures out which link to paste making the image show

Edited June 6, 2015 by Fdancer

[Poshy 58]

What a long thread.

[Ulviirala 431]

I always assumed all enchants decay, even on weapons, in line with how tools do when they take damage from use. Why shouldn't they? Why should you have and keep this immensely powerful weapon, that never gets worse?

Because eh.. what? All I hear you say it's expensive to have 99 power enchants of everything on your weapons? You're damn right it is. Do you need it? Damn no you don't. I've been killing things with no enchants for years, until I actually priested my alt and had a little bit of Frostbrand on my QL50 sickles and that's it. I'm not paying 15s just to kill things in 1 hit less or whatever

I'm fine with weapon enchant decay making a proper return if it's in line with tools.

+1

[Lycanthropic 523]

What bothered people the most with that "bug fix" was:

1. It was a ninja fix
   
2. It was one of those "7year-old-features" that got "fixed"
   
3. And it gave the impression that people with little silver to spare, would have even more problems paying for gear
   

Thats why people jumped on that topic like they did, most of them asking to keep it as it was.

For Rolf to leave such an easy fixable "bug" in the game for 7 years, then he can expect people, who have adapted to it, to get displeased.

 

 

 

Same with all those other "bugs" that are still ingame, but are considered features by now, since they are ingame so long.

Like the 100rafts/boat "feature", Rolf himself said that it was a bug to be able to put 100 rafts in a boat, but he kept it ingame because people used it everywhere to transport bulkmaterials.

So why isnt he keeping some of the other "bugs" ingame that are widely used by almost all of the wurm-playerbase, like this weapon enchant decay.

People pay good money for high end casts, because they know (7-6+ years and counting) that those casts are there to stay, only thing they'll need to keep it ok, is some imping of the ql every now and then.

 

 

 

I know the casting is prety hard with the random fails (I have 3 good friends ingame, all with end-game priests of each kind, so I know what it takes them in cordage/gems to get/got where they are now), but sicne more and more old players have gotten a nice 80+chan 40+SD priests going, more and more people are able to provide good enchants on weapons, thus the price lowers anyways, even when the casts would decay.

(on a side note, lets be happy that what people get on chaos, mostly stays on chaos, because with the half-favor titles priests can get,the  freedom market could be getting really cheap, really fast...)

 

 

If cast-decaying on weapons was kept ingame just now, then it would do nothing for the business, because the devs said it was a very rare chance of a decay hit.

And your lifetransfer going down from 88 to 87 after 200 kills, doesnt have you running to the nearest enchanter to get it up again.

So saying "keep this bug/feature-fix ingame" so it could improve the weapon-enchant business again... is a rather weak argument to choose for being opposed to this reverting.

 

 

 

In wurm there are always windows of opportunity for selling things, which vanish sudden:

• Gems: I was able to sell allot when everybody wanted to grind their priest, suddenly the market dropped to half of the value and even lower, because of all the gems being offered, for to little amount of priests needing them.
  
• Source liquid: I was able to sell allot when everybody got the new spells from valrei items, now prices have halved or more, because everybody knows a source-spring-location by now, or has a nice reserver of karma
  
• Veggies: I was able to sell allot, then the amount of veggies gotten per farm action suddenly wasnt tied to the skill anymore "byebye 9-corn instant harvests", more work/tiles for the same amount, but prices not increasing with it, so because less interesting to sell since it took allot more time and effort to get the same amount of veggies before.
  
• Rare tools/items: They used to sell for allot of silver when the rare stuff came out first, it didnt take long for them to drop 50% in price, because more and more people started making them.
  

 

Basically:

more skilled players = lower prices

more players with acces to something = lower prices of those somethings

 

Weapon enchants decaying very rarely wouldnt have done much (if anything) to stabelize/improve weapon-business, to begin with.

I wasnt really opposed to the decay on weapon enchants, but more against the general direction of these old-old-old-now-considered-features-suddenly-bugfixing (see my reply in jbergs thread). So having my enchants dropping a cast on a rare occasion, wouldnt have bothered me much personally.

[Eobersig 1,004]

...

 

How many of the people requiring enchant decay removal are also supporting the game at the rate of 60+ silver per month?

 

~Nappy

 

Psst, here's a hint: you're not supporting the game when you pay your premium with silvers, someone else is, the one that is buying the silvers, you're just a money sink.

[MisterTeddy 284]

My monthly costs are not unusual among the others who also make enchanted weapons in this game. 

 

How many of the people requiring enchant decay removal are also supporting the game at the rate of 60+ silver per month?

 

it seems like the real issue is the former statement here

 

pay 50+ silver / euros to roll dice plus deed costs - no thanks

 

what Rolf should do is lower mind stealer / life transfer favor costs so they don't require linking (p2w much?) and fix the casting mechanics so high-end priests are actually useful and reliable and mid-level priests are more than just dead weight on the wallet

[Nappy 1,369]

...

Edited June 8, 2015 by Nappy

[Vroomfondel 1,128]

Silly argument and it's time for it to stop.  The weapons for years did not lose enchants, it did nothing to stagnate the market, and it won't now.  Tools lost their enchants and nothing has changed there.  All Rolf did was revert a new change that many did not like.  And since I'm speaking as a Vynoran priest, I'm also not worried about losing income due to this.  In the beginning we were made to understand some actions had timers that varied with skill and tool ql, and the enchant would wear off over time.  Weapons and those actions that either had no timer or a set timer did not lose enchants.  This may not be logical, but it is wogical, where each item has it's own rules and the rules for other items do not apply.  So my rug keeps it's enchantment (as far as I can tell) just like my weapons do, but my tools I use every day wear down.  And it makes sense to me, most people who carry weapons will do all they can to keep a weapon and have it in the best condition, but will replace a tool as soon as it it worn down somewhat.

Edited June 6, 2015 by Vroomfondel

[Gumbo 1,563]

"Removed enchant decay on weapons due to extreme rarity but overwhelming impopularity."

 

I would like to ask where this overwhelming unpopularity is. I looked at the "poll" in the suggestions thread. It was 116 vs 34. That's 150 total votes. Any or all of which could be anyone, seeing as game accts. and forum accts. are not connected. These could be votes from people who signed up and quit years ago and even people that have never even played the game before. This could also mean any of the "voting brigade" alt groups could have voted as well. The poll pretty much means squat, but lets evaluate the numbers anyway.

That's 150 total votes. Checking the player count graph, at the moment it says there are 5275 players. So 2.8% of the total player base voted. Percentage of people who voted to have the weapon chant decay removed was a whopping 2.2% of the total player base. How the hell is that "Overwhelming" ?  This change is looking more and more like a farce. It wasn't made by the player base, not in my eyes. I certainly hope the Devs and Rolf are going to rethink this because anyone with a rational mind can see there was no "overwhelming" vote against it.

 

 

Edit - http://jenn001.game.wurmonline.com/mrtg/paying.html

Edited June 6, 2015 by Gumbo

[Battlepaw 585]

"Removed enchant decay on weapons due to extreme rarity but overwhelming impopularity."

 

I would like to ask where this overwhelming unpopularity is. I looked at the "poll" in the suggestions thread. It was 116 vs 34. That's 150 total votes. Any or all of which could be anyone, seeing as game accts. and forum accts. are not connected. These could be votes from people who signed up and quit years ago and even people that have never even played the game before. This could also mean any of the "voting brigade" alt groups could have voted as well. The poll pretty much means squat, but lets evaluate the numbers anyway.

That's 150 total votes. Checking the player count graph, at the moment it says there are 5275 players. So 2.8% of the total player base voted. Percentage of people who voted to have the weapon chant decay removed was a whopping 2.2% of the total player base. How the hell is that "Overwhelming" ?  This change is looking more and more like a farce. It wasn't made by the player base, not in my eyes. I certainly hope the Devs and Rolf are going to rethink this because anyone with a rational mind can see there was no "overwhelming" vote against it.

 

 

Edit - http://jenn001.game.wurmonline.com/mrtg/paying.html

 

Do you understand what a Poll is?   It's a small cutaway of the population, no matter how you look at it, even in national polls, etc it's allways that way.   You can't win an argument by trying the assume everyone will see it your way when the snapshot taken was clearly in a massive majority.     

 

The only one void of all rationality is yourself, in every attack off putting anything resembling logic your argument completely evaporates.   The only way you've been defending it was trying to come up with a moral argument rather than a factual one, a moral one that ignores everyone's wishes and puts your own selfish opions first.    So go ahead, ignore the polls, ignore the players, ignore the prices, and the market, ignore everyone who has broken your arguments and pretty much exposed you for what you are.   

 

I'm sure the Devs will listen to you, well long enough to get a chuckle out of your temper tantrum.    

[Gumbo 1,563]

@Battlepaws
You've had many of your posts in this thread removed because they violated the Forum rules. You came here and trolled, insulted, and took actions to derail the thread as best you could. After such, I stopped reading your posts. Why should I or anyone else bother to read anything more you've posted, only to potentially subject themselves to your devious and unwanted tactics. Let that be a lesson to you. If you wish to participate in a discussion on something, do so in a civil and respectable manor and you'll likely get responses. If someone walked up to me on the street and started a conversation by being insulting, I'd keep walking and ignore the person. Guess what? People can do that here too. I didn't stop responding to you because you feel you made a good point, I stopped responding to you because of your toxic attitude, an attitude that in turn invalidated all of your opinions. I suggest everyone take this approach towards people like you.

[Audrel 2,223]

"Removed enchant decay on weapons due to extreme rarity but overwhelming impopularity."

 

I would like to ask where this overwhelming unpopularity is. I looked at the "poll" in the suggestions thread. It was 116 vs 34. That's 150 total votes. Any or all of which could be anyone, seeing as game accts. and forum accts. are not connected. These could be votes from people who signed up and quit years ago and even people that have never even played the game before. This could also mean any of the "voting brigade" alt groups could have voted as well. The poll pretty much means squat, but lets evaluate the numbers anyway.

That's 150 total votes. Checking the player count graph, at the moment it says there are 5275 players. So 2.8% of the total player base voted. Percentage of people who voted to have the weapon chant decay removed was a whopping 2.2% of the total player base. How the hell is that "Overwhelming" ?  This change is looking more and more like a farce. It wasn't made by the player base, not in my eyes. I certainly hope the Devs and Rolf are going to rethink this because anyone with a rational mind can see there was no "overwhelming" vote against it.

 

 

Edit - http://jenn001.game.wurmonline.com/mrtg/paying.html

 

Not a jab at you, Gumbo. Just some information. :-)

 

That is simply because only about 5% of players in games actually use the forums where the poll is hosted, in this case 2.8%. Had they put a poll in-game to the paying community (which I think maybe they should have done), there would be a much larger sample. 2.8% voted and 2.2% voted to remove it. That's a 78.6% vote to repeal among the voting population. It is overwhelming, even if the sample size is a fraction of the population. 

 

You can never use a forum as a basis for a majority in anything, games or real world areas. The number of people who use them, just as they would meetings at city hall, are tiny compared to the community it is based in. Hell, even when it comes to voting in a national election in countries where voting is not mandatory, you have a rather small turnout compared to the eligible population. For instance, only ~57% of eligible registered votes in the United States voted in the last presidential election. It's a far cry from the 2.8% seen here but it does underline why polls never really give you a true picture. They only reflect the opinions of those interested in the forum they are held in.

Edited June 7, 2015 by Audrel

[Gumbo 1,563]

Agreed Audrel

[Audrel 2,223]

I think they really should have polled in-game, Gumbo. It was a big thing, both when it was put in and when it was taken out. 

 

EDIT: PS, thank you for taking care of my friend's enchant!

Edited June 7, 2015 by Audrel

[Dinkleberry 54]

+1 to in-game voting on this - make the wording crystal clear. "Do you want enchant decay on all weapons yes or no" - leave it for 2 weeks - majority vote wins.

[Gumbo 1,563]

+1 to in-game voting on this - make the wording crystal clear. "Do you want enchant decay on all weapons yes or no" - leave it for 2 weeks - majority vote wins.

 

And do the same thing with tool enchants as well, IMO.

[Tsetse 87]

To be fair I think almost everyone would vote no on a decay vote, but that doesn't make it right if the decay was somehow balanced preferably by a recharge mechanic. And it´s not about greedy merchants it´s about economy which is an important part of Wurm. Some people enjoy sailing across Xanadu to sell 5 silver worth of bricks because it gives them a trade experience, not because they´re greedy merchants. Some people enjoy using their priest to improve and enchant things for the same reason.

[Zazz 325]

as a high level smith this was a good thing to get reverted. just as there should be no skill decay it should not have any enchant decays. not on tools either imho.

[Markcrow 107]

Since bringing back the decay would force the average player to spend out many more silver for enchants that they wouldn't have to otherwise, I vote for boycotting anyone's shops and sales that vote for this decay being restored. I, for one, will not give those people one single iron. And that is how to vote in a market situation, with your wallet.

[Alyeska 2,621]

As a person that does enchants, I have to disagree, hate seeing all that work and effort go to waste on decays, it's bad enough having to reimp casts on every tool in the game.. then even though I have 90+ channeling the risks of shatters and pissing off customers.. no thank you.

 

Exactly!

I'm glad to see this gone even though I am part of the market and could potentially profit a lot off returning customers; nothing sucks more than having a nice enchanted weapon and losing those casts.