Sign in to follow this  
Tekari

Does enchanting work the way it should?

Recommended Posts

Enchanting works exactly the way it's supposed to. Until Rolf has a sandwich and decided it doesn't work the way it's supposed to. :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

About an hour ago:


 


Priest stats



93 Faith


60 Channeling (on Epic, curved to 84 effective)


44 Soul depth



 


Results casting venom on a 62ql small axe



1. 15


2. frown


3. 38


4. frown


5. 41


6. 90



 


I know that linking increases difficulty. That's not the point. The point is that a priest with effectively 84 channeling and 44 soul depth struggled to get even a respectable cast. That's six casts at 120 favor each (720 total) just to get something that was even usable. Now consider that I also need to cast nimbleness on it just to make it a useful weapon. Circle of cunning is optional for function, but I'm doing it. I'm glad demise spells don't have power values assigned to the effectiveness.


 


Say what you want about venom as a spell; life transfer is the same in terms of favor usage and difficulty.


 


Assume it takes 6 casts to get a respectable (70+)cast with the same stats on the Vynora priest. That's 480 favor on nimbleness and another 300 on circle of cunning. That totals 1,500 favor to enchant one weapon. This is just what would be done to enchant a basic LT weapon (minus demise cast). This is a basic part of a loadout regardless of PvE or PvP. Ever wonder why people don't like dying and losing gear? This isn't the only piece of it.


 


To anyone who says to "raise my skills": Obviously, higher skills are better, but a skill should not need to be above 90 with a stat raised to 50 or higher just to be even remotely viable. Even those stats would achieve the results listed here more than anything useful. This is a problem.


 


Basic PvP Gear for those who need more convincing:



> Longbow


> Shortbow


> Defensive weapon


> Offensive weapon


> Armor (9 pieces)


> Leather barding


> Chain barding


> 4 horse shoes, 1 saddle (90ql 90 WoA)


> 4 horse shoes, 1 saddle (optional, 70ql 70 WoA minimum)


 


And these are just the enchanted pieces - all casts 70+



Edited by SotG_is_OP

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

6 casts is nothing.  I would love to be able to know every 6 casts were going to be 90.  You would spend way more time to imp a weapon/tool up to a nice quality.  While that is a bit of favor.  That too takes no time to make.  I sat yesterday morning and stocked up over 10k favor in one run.  


  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Honestly, I think the most of the "high skills doesn't do much" is a clever illusion based on how slowly you've been raising channeling.


 


The difference in casts from using a 85channeler/50SD is so noticably different to casting with a <50channeler/25SD. Try it; really, it's a nice affirmation that your skills have paid off. But don't try it with anything valuable, they like to shatter.


  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What about if the chance to shatter was either removed or significantly reduced for priests over a certain high channeling/SD level?


 


That way priests who have earned their skill have the luxury of being able to try as many times as they like to improve an enchant, burning tons of favor that they had to acquire saccing or vessel'd gems etc. They might be there casting for hours on end, but atleast the fear of shattering isn't a problem and they can just face the difficulty to improve.


 


You could make it 80 channeling or 50 or 60 SD, whatever seems appropriate.


  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ill probably do a run on un-imped weapons (as I believe this actually makes it easier to get high enchants)  sometime next week or so and post the results. It's very very random.


Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I logged some of my latest results while enchanting:


 


coc casted on 13 x 18ql oak grooming brushs with the priestess mentioned in the first post (86chan, 52 sd)


 


1) 56


2) 40 - 69


3) 40 - frown - dispel - 33 - 49


4) 56


5) 61 - dispel - 47


6) 12 - 68 - dispel - 50


7) 57


8) 60


9) 00 - 58


10) 61 - frown - dispel - 38 - 47 - frown - dispel - 55 - dispel - fail without damage - 63


11) 14 - 38 - 44 - frown - 54 - dispel - 09 - 54


12) shatter (don't know the casts i made before that happened)


13) 76


 


= 35 logged casts with 1 being 70+


Edited by Turiel

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So please my dear Devs, tell me: Is this working as it should?

LOL... You should know by now that that kind of question is akin to asking a dev for all of his personal data, game account and who Killed JFK all in one question. If there's one thing that we know devs don't like sharing is how things are supposed to work... Some say because they really don't know, others have other opinions.

 

Now if you ask me, as a player, i'd say, no... Not really, because honestly as the game is right now, a low level priest is nearly as likely to get a 104 cast as the best priest in the game. The game is so RNG that everything is possible. But this is just one out of a hundred things that are made unreliable for the thin prospect of protecting an "economy" which is pretty much based around giving money to the "older players".

 

Which brings us to the old question of why do devs keep trying to protect "older players" at the cost of increasing the game's population and overall quality?

 

 

Honestly, I think the most of the "high skills doesn't do much" is a clever illusion based on how slowly you've been raising channeling.

 

The difference in casts from using a 85channeler/50SD is so noticably different to casting with a <50channeler/25SD. Try it; really, it's a nice affirmation that your skills have paid off. But don't try it with anything valuable, they like to shatter.

Yeah, there's a difference... Pretty much before 30-40 chan you'll shatter even ql 70 stuff very often, true. But that's pretty much the difference, its the amount of catastrophic failures that changes...

Wanna know what else has that difference? EVERY CRAFT from over 3 years ago, would likely shatter on fail, now they don't. That's exactly the same thing, the only difference is that the devs decided to change that, and its not the result of a skill progression.

So why not do something about casting? I'm not saying remove Shattering, i'0m saying make it reliable, make casts impable, maybe? There's a ton of options there to make priests worth it, and not just some other broken thing Rolf added for extra money.

Edited by KanePT
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My latest round of casting on my Primary Vyn priest. No link attached.

 

Casted on 31 80ql iron horse shoes, no enchants at start

 

channeling 94.358, increased 0.036 by end of casting session with sleep bonus on

soul depth 76.30

alignment 100

faith 100

 

w## represents a cast on an unenchanted item

w## => w## represents an imp

 

1) w83
2) w58
3) w58 => frown
4) w58 => frown
5) w79
6) w10
7) w39
8) w84
9) w44
10) w35
11) w57
12) w38
13) w8
14) w27
15) w84
16) w84
17) w67
18) w12
19) w13
20) w5
21) w50
22) w56
23) w43
24) w39
25) w16
26) w46
27) w29
28) w9
29) w41
30) w22
31) w9
32) w8 => w30
33) w30 => w34
34) w34 => w39
35) w39 => w67
36) w67 => w72
37) w72 => frown
38) w10 => w70
39) w12 => w65
38) w72 => frown
39) w72 => frown
40) w5 => w36
41) w36 => w71
42) w71 => frown
43) w71 => w94
44) w9 => w77
45) w9 => w65
46) w65 => frown
47) w65 => frown
48) w65 => frown
49) w13 => w78
50) w16 => w25
51) w25 => w92
52) w22 => w68
53) w27 => w62
54) w29 => w70
55) w39 => frown
56) w39 => frown
57) w39 => w84
58) w43 => frown
59) w43 => frown
60) w43 => w66
61) w66 => w89
62) w39 => deep worrying sound
63) w39 => frown
64) w39 => w61
65) w61 => frown
66) w41 => frown
67) w41 => frown
68) w41 => frown
69) w41 => frown

 

Final distribution:

 

30 - 39 2
40 - 49 4
50 - 59 4
60 - 69 7
70 - 79 6
80 - 89 6
90 - 99 2
100+ 0

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Like I said before. If we knew the power of the casts from "frown" we could better investigate what's going on.


 


[16:37:47] You frown as your 34 power cast fails to improve the power.


Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

6 casts is nothing.  I would love to be able to know every 6 casts were going to be 90.  You would spend way more time to imp a weapon/tool up to a nice quality.  While that is a bit of favor.  That too takes no time to make.  I sat yesterday morning and stocked up over 10k favor in one run.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Enchanting is perfectly fine, my main is a priest and I have no problems at all with enchanting.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sry Lorena but if you take a look at Turiels and Nappys casts they posted noone can tell me that's fine. That's crap.


  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would be interested in seeing enchanting made easier ONLY on PVP servers (epic cluster, challenge and chaos) to promote people to set up a location to enchant and provide a benefit to encourage players to visit such servers. The added effect would be to improve the ease of players replacing gear in a timely manner and promote PVP further.

As long as Freedom servers would receive additional skillgain % and free affinity every month... Sure, why not?

Now seriously - easier enchanting on PvP servers would increase ratio of PvP players compared to PvE players... Because some people/alts on PvE would stop playing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Now seriously - easier enchanting on PvP servers would increase ratio of PvP players compared to PvE players... Because some people/alts on PvE would stop playing.

 

They'd stop playing because of a change that makes it easier for priests on PvP to cast, not effecting PvE at all?

 

I'd call anyone who quit over that an immature baby. It wouldn't effect their playing and difficulty in any way at all, only PvP.

 

I thought PvE didn't want easier casting, PvP players do. So you're saying PvP players shouldn't have it because PvE players don't want them to?

 

That's literally like one baby throwing all their toys out of their crib because the baby in the crib next to them has a pacifier and they don't.

Edited by Madt
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The problem (at least with Chaos) is that easier enchants from Chaos would flood Freedom servers, prices of enchants would drop and therefore it would be much less profitable and fun to be priest on Freedom.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The problem (at least with Chaos) is that easier enchants from Chaos would flood Freedom servers, prices of enchants would drop and therefore it would be much less profitable and fun to be priest on Freedom.

 

I don't think it'd be that bad, most priests on Chaos are too busy supplying their people with enchants. For every enchanted item that goes to freedom is one less for a player in that priest's kingdom on Chaos.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can we stop turning this into a PvP vs. PvE war? This is a global problem.


  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can we stop turning this into a PvP vs. PvE war? This is a global problem.

Agreed. I think making it a little more linear and removing quite so much RNG has nothing to do with pvp vs pve. Not wanting it to become easier just more consistent with the skills.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Enchanting is fine, high casts should be difficult to obtain and high channelling skill (and other variables) should only increase the chance. Similar things could be said about mining; Even with high mining skill and a high quality pickaxe you'll still be getting the occasional low quality ores along with having less and less ores within the vein.


 


The only problem I can see right now is the high favor cost of some spells and the "difficulty" of getting a good cast, and also the favor items of the (White Light) priests. Perhaps if the sacrificial item is more readily available (like alchemy items/crops similar to what Libila has) then it would offset some of the complaints people have about casting. It won't make it easier to get high casts, it'll just make you be able to cast more while consuming less resources.


  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think casting is mainly fine but some clarifications could be in order so we don't spend time skilling up things that have no effect. Also, I have a feeling something is wrong with the lower "level" enchants like aosp and fb, those are no simpler to get high casts with than coc, woa etc. 


 


Also, there have been a long row of nerfs to casting during the years. When I started some years ago I got 100+ casts several times in just a few month at about 40-50 channelling, today (with a lot higher skills) I never get a 95+ cast, not ever. It is years since last time. This has diminishes the feeling of achievement  for me, I have actually gotten worse for every year... But I guess this could be bad luck, I started my priest at the wrong time. If you start one today it might be totally different and perfectly fine. 


Edited by Torgrim

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Enchanting is fine, high casts should be difficult to obtain and high channelling skill (and other variables) should only increase the chance. Similar things could be said about mining; Even with high mining skill and a high quality pickaxe you'll still be getting the occasional low quality ores along with having less and less ores within the vein.

 

We don't want it easier, we want if more fair.

 

Someone who put the time into getting channeling to 80 or 90 or even higher should have a significantly higher chance to do high casts than someone with 50+ or 60 channeling.

 

Honestly if you ask me it shouldn't even be possible for someone who just got his/her channeling to 51 to do a 90+ cast. If it was this way I bet we'd have a healthy economy again in no time.

 

At least when it comes to enchanted stuff.

 

But we don't wanna be greedy here... a really noticable difference would be good for a start.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We don't want it easier, we want if more fair.

 

Someone who put the time into getting channeling to 80 or 90 or even higher should have a significantly higher chance to do high casts than someone with 50+ or 60 channeling.

 

Honestly if you ask me it shouldn't even be possible for someone who just got his/her channeling to 51 to do a 90+ cast. If it was this way I bet we'd have a healthy economy again in no time.

 

At least when it comes to enchanted stuff.

 

But we don't wanna be greedy here... a really noticable difference would be good for a start.

 

Well, I never said anything about making it easier. Rolf RNG is never fair, there's plenty of examples where lower skill players can get lucky over higher skilled one (eg, lockpicking).

 

If you have a limitless amount of favor items like me then all the problems I see here doesn't really matter much since pumping out enchants is as easy as sacrificing 7 corns.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

High end priest here and my own opinion is the current system is far too random with far too poor a payout for the effort invested.


 


The first thing wrong is how did we end up saying low end 30 channelling priests can get 90+ casts? For the love of god why? If I make a 30 skill weapon smith I don't expect to have a chance of a 90ql weapon, if I make a 30 skill fine carpenter I don't expect to have a chance of a 90ql rope tool so why do priests get to be able to have max casts on all spells they have access to? 


 


The second thing which frankly I abhor is the attempt to safeguard market place cast value. This should be totally free floating, if there are a lot of priests capable of doing high casts, deal with it. The economy is healthier when it is able to find its own balance points, not when someone is trying to artificially pin "value" at certain levels.The market should not be a factor in deciding how to achieve a better casting balance for priests.


 


So as not to be totally negative, a way to have high end priests have better value is to  look at spell stacking. At lower channelling levels a priest should only be able to place one enchant on an item, as they get stronger two enchants should be an option, then three and so on. It also gives priests a visible progression option to aim for.

  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The first thing wrong is how did we end up saying low end 30 channelling priests can get 90+ casts? For the love of god why? If I make a 30 skill weapon smith I don't expect to have a chance of a 90ql weapon, if I make a 30 skill fine carpenter I don't expect to have a chance of a 90ql rope tool so why do priests get to be able to have max casts on all spells they have access to.

This is exactly the way I see it. As a 60 channeling priest I think I should be able to consistently get casts around 50-60. Can still have a bit of rng that is affected by soul depth, and other skills though.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this