Fix raiding when defenders OFFLINE

[mthoodyn 56]

Hi

I read a post by black_legion and how their deed got totally wrecked over and over again. I wont say its ok but its within the rules of the game. And afterall Chaos is a PVP server. But, attacking undefended deeds? Does that go in line with "PVP" ? and where's the fun in that?

The simple problem is actually that you can destroy any deed you want when no one is online to defend it. Its not good for any kingdom, be it you have 99% of the players or 1% or your a new kingdom that want to play on CHAOS. The latter meaning its very hard for new kingdoms to arise on the CHAOS server.

Hence this topic with suggestions to fix what I Think is a MAJOR FLAW with this game, attack deeds when no one is online to defend it.

Here are some suggestions to stop this flaw as I call it. This is just ideas and they could be tweaked in one way or Another to make it work on Chaos server. But the main thing remains, make it very very hard to raid deeds when there are no players online at said deed to defend it.

How should it work? Well we must come up with some formula to calculate when the extra defense is needed. It could be a percentage of the total amount of defending kingdoms players that are logged in Or % of players logged in at the village that are getting attacked.

There should also be some kind of "abuse prevention" so the defending village cant log in, log out to get the extra defense. Lets say that when the village has reached the goal of logged in players the timer will reset to 1-2 hours Before it can be Active again.

The suggestions are
* 60% faster respawning times for deed guards and Tower guards belonging to the deed.
* 50-60% extra damage output made by guards or Tower guards belonging to the deed.
* 60% less damage made to every object on the deed, houses, walls etc.
* 50% longer digging timer within the deed and its perimeters.

Please post constructive posts in this topic! Lock away your kingdom vs kingdom hatred and Think Before you post, cause afterall the tides may turn, remember that!

In the ends its my belief that this Changes would make it more fun for everyone. And it would actually make it easier for new kingdoms to establish on the server.



 

[Argustin 249]

hmm.. no. Why? Because too easy to abuse. All of the wardeeds and their mayors/residence would be left logged out. OR just dump tons of money in coffers and not worry about the deed. Reality? If you cannot defend your deed or alliance could not defend it 24/7 you should not make a deed. IF you are in a kingdom with 10 members you should not really have 10 deeds, not even 5. Best bet would be 1 deed. So a big -1 from me!

Edited April 7, 2015 by Argustin

[Redd 4,281]

Na. -1.

[Argustin 249]

Oh and would add.. That particiluar raid lasted around 2 days? We had people there all the time and 80% of the time BL had their alts logged in and dropping dirt, trying to drag catas and so on. Meaning that they chose not to defend.  That is not entirely true, they did try to defend, but they didnt manage + they were 100% aware we are there.

Edited April 7, 2015 by Argustin

[Elen 1,013]

From what I've seen most pvpers don't want pvp. PvDeed or gank seems much more wanted.

[Gaul 339]

LOL

 

If these changes occur BL will go offline as that way they have a better chance to defend a deed.

 

Again

LOL

[Uberknot 327]

This is one of the reasons many people dont  bother with PvP at all.

[Propheteer 7,139]

this, in combination with the twitter system would only hurt pvp

 

twitter already kills pvp by encouraging wardeeds

[Uberknot 327]

this, in combination with the twitter system would only hurt pvp

 

twitter already kills pvp by encouraging wardeeds

[New_Unsleep 423]

-1

[SmeJack 5,798]

-1 for pve defenses

[Lockdown 235]

No need for this on a pve server. -1

[Clatius 455]

Seems this is a standard op for online PvP. Some games try to do something about it by providing static defenses that actually work well *cough EVE cough*. I see no reason why WURM couldn't do the same. Otherwise the PvP end does boil down to the smaller groups being unable to defend against the larger groups simply because they don't have enough people to be on 24/7. It's a numbers game and the large do prey on small, and it's very easy for them. What is wrong with making it a challenge? Fear?

Edited April 7, 2015 by Clatius

[Kagrenac 812]

Seems this is a standard op for online PvP. Some games try to do something about it by providing static defenses that actually work well *cough EVE cough*. I see no reason why WURM couldn't do the same. Otherwise the PvP end does boil down to the smaller groups being unable to defend against the larger groups simply because they don't have enough people to be on 24/7. It's a numbers game and the large do prey on small, and it's very easy for them. What is wrong with making it a challenge? Fear?

Does eve have defenses that are better if you decided to leave and let your base defend itself?

 

No

 

Defenders have every single advantage in a raid, other than setting the time that the raid will happen.

You can easily defend against a much larger force.

[MamaDarkness 880]

If you are unable to defend, why would you not join with more players or another group?

[Daolin 894]

Unfortunately this is not a problem that can simply have a band-aid applied, yes power does swing over the course of time, but until recent times, those "on top" have never stooped quite so low and i'm fairly confident the "it's legal so we do what we want" attitude is genuinely leading to the death of Chaos.  With several members in the thread you referenced commenting that the goal is total domination, there is no total domination without continuing with this practice of completely obliterating deeds.

 

Everyone who plays on the server is well aware of the risks involved, however what we've seen lately with the snowballing effect, it doesn't matter if we bring 15 people to the fight or 5, we're always going to be outnumbered in the end, because the game has so many broken mechanics that favor the side who can bring the most to the party; this coupled with us being late to the party we're at a severe disadvantage. Having witnessed multiple sieges on our kingdom in the past few months, 30-40 people is more than our 15 on a good day.

 

Our recruitment isn't what's at fault which many troll posts will suggest, its once we get recruits and they get involved, they then come up against this broken war machine that is "MR" and they either end up quitting or going back to PvE, not because they died, not because they got looted or raided, but because of what happens during the raids, and on the skirmishes forum afterwards, and what they see is just a broken server that the dev's seem very disinterested in resolving.

 

I just wish for once people would put their petty propaganda crap to once side and discuss the very real problem here which is chaos is dying, the death is not the fault of MR i'll admit, afterall they have the freedom due to the game mechanics to chase people out of the server/game and there are no rules against it.  They are not really at fault, the game is for not limiting PMK's to stop the snowball effect.

[Daolin 894]

If you are unable to defend, why would you not join with more players or another group?

 

When the options are limited to:

 

A) MR - Become part of the snowball, fun for some I guess.

JK  - Have a little more security but ultimately not really because (I might be wrong) their numbers appear to have dropped quite a bit and their activity alongside it

C) BL/Ebonaura - Neither have any chance to front the numbers 24/7 as we've seen over the past few days raid, we did mount a defence attempt but when you factor in scale/drake/artifacts ONTOP of the overwhelming numbers, then there's no real chance. The only chance anyone has is to muster similar numbers and be able to be online at all hours/potentially for days if you want to actually defend against a zerg, which right now is impossible if you don't have enough online at the start to try put up a fight.

D) Bring a group from freedom, beg the current ontop kingdom to give you breathing space then when they get bored and disregard this, you find yourselves in a similar option

E) Don't play on Chaos, this is probably the best option now for anyone not interested in option A.

 

Those are the only real options and personally, even if I was welcome in MR, I don't see how joining a group that controls 80%+ of the server is any fun and I would not enjoy playing as the group that runs around crushing anything just because it's possible and there is no real defence against the numerical advantage.

Edited April 7, 2015 by Daolin

[Hailene 362]

(Note, I'm not a pvper)

 

Maybe have the bonuses kick in if no one has been on for like...3 hours? 4?  That should give the attacker plenty of time to murder his way through most deeds, right?  Assuming there were defenders at some point in the battle.

 

It'd also add an interesting meta--try to wait for all the defenders to log and attack (giving a smaller window of opportunity for the attackers before the defensive bonuses kick in) or attack while they have few defenders and risk having those members raise the alarm.

Edited April 7, 2015 by Hailene

[LorenaMontana 3,008]

Easy fix: join epic

Problem solved

[Miniroll 544]

(Note, I'm not a pvper)

 

Maybe have the bonuses kick in if no one has been on for like...3 hours? 4?  That should give the attacker plenty of time to murder his way through most deeds, right?  Assuming there were defenders at some point in the battle.

 

It'd also add an interesting meta--try to wait for all the defenders to log and attack (giving a smaller window of opportunity for the attackers before the defensive bonuses kick in) or attack while they have few defenders and risk having those members raise the alarm.

No, this isnt LiF.

I don't want to give enemies a 24 hour notice before raiding a deed.

The element of surprise is the best.

[MrGARY 12,421]

While I don't like seeing deeds destroyed to nothing (and yes, I've done it before)  I'm going to have to -1 this

 

Either way, if a kingdom wants your crap gone, nothing is going to stop them especially if they have the manpower

[madnezz 555]

-1 

 

Chaos is not dieing, there is pvp whenever we want it.  Just because you don't control the terms of the pvp does not mean it is not happening.

 

From the sounds of your suggestions you want to play on a kingdom vs kingdom server that persists 24 hours a day and is played by people from around the world in every timezone but the kingdoms' territories would be set in stone, deeds are indestructible, and you wouldn't have to be online to defend.  

 

How about instead of making suggestions to make up for your social deficiencies and lack of pvp success you admit you failed in your attempt to play on chaos and either move on to something else or try harder to play within the current rules and mechanics?

Edited April 7, 2015 by madnezz

[Emoo 4,357]

-1

 

You shouldn't be able to "defend" a deed by simply not showing up. IS actually and incentive to NOT have any kind of PvP at all. 

[aamanus 1,488]

Seems kind of redundant.

 

Group rolls up to defend deed, enemy hasn't got enough defenders, so log out.  Now there's noone repairing walls, so it's just as easy to attack.

 

Or, you log in one person to get intel, and boom, there goes your defense bonus.

[aamanus 1,488]

Seems this is a standard op for online PvP. Some games try to do something about it by providing static defenses that actually work well *cough EVE cough*. I see no reason why WURM couldn't do the same. Otherwise the PvP end does boil down to the smaller groups being unable to defend against the larger groups simply because they don't have enough people to be on 24/7. It's a numbers game and the large do prey on small, and it's very easy for them. What is wrong with making it a challenge? Fear?

 

I think you'll find that if PoS defenses on EvE respawned (or rather, repaired automatically and very quickly), there would be a lot of complaining.  Especially since those defenses are the SAME when defenders are online and offline.

 

Slowing down raiding actions a bit while people are offline could work, but with guards respawning every 5 minutes, and you not able to do a number of actions required to raid until they are dead, it most definately wouldn't work.  Especially at a deed with 50 guards, which are near on invisible, and tend to all focus on one person.  

 

I'm all open to changing mechanics to make things more interesting, or balancing out aspects, but removing the player element from a game (and very much making it a pay-to-win situation), as well as encouraging people to log off entirely and avoid PvP, is pretty much retarded.