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silakka

More room to breathe for staff

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Making disclosing such information a perma-ban offense is incredibly harsh and very hard to justify. It's also likely people will just share the information in different ways, through voice communications for example, making it nearly impossible to get any evidence to make a case.

 

The mere act of putting it on public record would deter such actions a hundredfold. I dunno where you are from, but to make an example of where 'mere appearance' deters stupidity, the best item for home defense is a shotgun. Why? Because all a would-be-evildoer has to hear is that trademark *clack-clack* of a round being chambered, (and if you've ever heard one, you'll know what I mean, there is nothing else like it in the world.)  and all thoughts of what they'd been intending to do disappear as self preservation kicks in. 99% of the time, they high tail it and run without a shot being fired.

 

In other words, having severe penalties on the books, prevents all but the most ardent/determined/stupid of people from doing stupid things.

Edited by Belrindor

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If someone has to Google something to find out it's offensive, then they weren't offended by it, were they? ;)

Exactly my point Belrindor. And now I see why they didn't make Aether a CA. He sounds horrible. 

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The mere act of putting it on public record would deter such actions a hundredfold. I dunno where you are from, but to make an example of where 'mere appearance' deters stupidity, the best item for home defense is a shotgun. Why? Because all a would-be-evildoer has to hear is that trademark *clack-clack* of a round being chambered, (and if you've ever heard one, you'll know what I mean, there is nothing else like it in the world.)  and all thoughts of what they'd been intending to do disappear as self preservation kicks in. 99% of the time, they high tail it and run without a shot being fired.

 

In other words, having severe penalties on the books, prevents all but the most ardent/determined/stupid of people from doing stupid things.

 

That never works online. It'l stop a 10 year old tyrant, That's about it. 

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Why do we all even have to have this discussion. It makes reading the forum depressing sometimes. I'd like to go to the forum and see the most active topic be something fun and exciting to talk about. Not this...


 


 


Someone create a new thread please... This makes me want to play another game with less ragers. I think I've seen more ragers in Wurm than I have in League of Legends - and if you've played that game, that's where 'You mad bruh?' probably first came up...


 


Let's set an example to new people and make the forums a nice place to visit and not a place for spewing hate. Seriously.


 


Wurm is a great game, don't listen to these people if you're new! Read my next topic about the 'Cutest AI in the game!' 


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That never works online. It'l stop a 10 year old tyrant, That's about it. 

Well if players are determined to break the stated rules, and continue to act worse than a ten year old tyrant, then it's quite likely they will deserve the punishment for it, no?

 

I don't know why people think it's so hard to act civilized.

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Why do we all even have to have this discussion. It makes reading the forum depressing sometimes. I'd like to go to the forum and see the most active topic be something fun and exciting to talk about. Not this...

 

 

Someone create a new thread please... This makes me want to play another game with less ragers. I think I've seen more ragers in Wurm than I have in League of Legends - and if you've played that game, that's where 'You mad bruh?' probably first came up...

 

Let's set an example to new people and make the forums a nice place to visit and not a place for spewing hate. Seriously.

 

Wurm is a great game, don't listen to these people if you're new! Read my next topic about the 'Cutest AI in the game!' 

 

Yer enthusiasm is a good thing. Kudos.

 

However, ignoring issues will not make them go away, only fester.

 

This should be evident by the fact of the response that the OP's thread got. The thread was likely created with the best of intentions. But people were so horked off that it rapidly devolved.

 

This speaks of deeper unresolved issues. It's also a failure to listen and respond accordingly.

 

So whilst talking about how cute the pheasants are, for example, is great. It won't do a darn thing to assuage the playerbase. And the issue will just come up again... and again... and again... until something is either done and the cycle is broken, or until those people finally quit.

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Why do we all even have to have this discussion. It makes reading the forum depressing sometimes. I'd like to go to the forum and see the most active topic be something fun and exciting to talk about. Not this...

 

 

Someone create a new thread please... This makes me want to play another game with less ragers. I think I've seen more ragers in Wurm than I have in League of Legends - and if you've played that game, that's where 'You mad bruh?' probably first came up...

 

Let's set an example to new people and make the forums a nice place to visit and not a place for spewing hate. Seriously.

 

Wurm is a great game, don't listen to these people if you're new! Read my next topic about the 'Cutest AI in the game!' 

 

If topics like these are closed kammerz, It will build up, And it will make wurm online the new rage haven for haters everywhere. A Community doesn't improve by good moderation of "Bad discuss topics". A Community improves by how well connected we are to one another & how well we know one another, Good and the bad. 

 

Well if players are determined to break the stated rules, and continue to act worse than a ten year old tyrant, then it's quite likely they will deserve the punishment for it, no?

 

I don't know why people think it's so hard to act civilized.

 

Like you just said, If the player is determined to break the rule, Hes or she will break it regardless if its strict or not. So theirs really no point in changing it or not here. 

 

Well its hard to be civil for a lot of people(Myself included) when everything we wish to say, Has to be within specific set of guidelines. Like theirs plenty of things id like to say here but cannot due to FUD & other things. It really does build up quite a bit of frustration inside when your not able to speak your mind(If your that kind of person anyways).

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Yer enthusiasm is a good thing. Kudos.

 

However, ignoring issues will not make them go away, only fester.

 

This should be evident by the fact of the response that the OP's thread got. The thread was likely created with the best of intentions. But people were so horked off that it rapidly devolved.

 

This speaks of deeper unresolved issues. It's also a failure to listen and respond accordingly.

 

So whilst talking about how cute the pheasants are, for example, is great. It won't do a darn thing to assuage the playerbase. And the issue will just come up again... and again... and again... until something is either done and the cycle is broken, or until those people finally quit.

 

I doubt new people are leaving because of CA's CM's and GM's...

 

The new people are leaving because of game mechanics or it's just not a style of game most people enjoy which involves a lot of patience and grinding.

 

And all those that are talking about their experiences with the staff are actually more active on Wurm than most that are not complaining - meaning that it is not an 'issue' per say. It is a rant and a place to vent frustration. IMO

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Volunteer staff are here to assist with game mechanics and ensure a safe environment in game and on the forums.  People's sense of fun differ and at times one's sense of fun is at the expense of another.  Few like to be told they are wrong and receive correction.  most respond well yet there are some that don't and become angry and lash out.   This is human nature.


 


I'd caution people not to ascribe too much value to a small minority being very vocal to suggest something more wider spread in using words like the  playerbase is disenchanted.


 


just as in this post, only a few highly vocal players out of the vast forum membership have posted.


 


It's always good to have a debate, as long as the debate is of ideas and concepts and not personal debate and attack of people in ad hominem fashion.  I myself like freedom of expression yet it has responsibilities as well.


 


although likely well intentioned, a post of this nature usually devolves quickly. why, well for as much as some want to attack staff as over zealous , look what happens when you leave discussion to the player base without any guidelines. It becomes lord of the flies and those that are going after staff with the notion they over persecute, in turn become even harsher persecutors themselves.


 


we are all players as well, giving our time freely to assist over and above our normal game play time.  Wurm online is a rather small community with a loyal playerbase.  Iit is also known for being far less toxic than other games for a variety of factors.  Moderation actions, when they happen,  are merely to maintain that safe environment so it does not devolve into a toxic troll fest.  Lets continue to exemplify what it means to be a wurmian by being a positive community and assisting our fellow wurmian skill and enjoy adventures across the lanscapes of wurm servers.


Edited by Bloodscythe
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OR you know, They can do what their already doing... Volunteer work.. Problem solved?!

No, not problem solved. Corruption allegations always follow when the support staff is volunteer, or have you not been paying attention to what the other players are saying?

 

I'm not saying it's justified. Most of the time, it's not. I'm just saying it happens.

Edited by Belrindor

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No, not problem solved. Corruption allegations always follow when the support staff is volunteer, or have you not been paying attention to what the other players are saying?

 

A contract, paid staff, or volunteers doesn't stop people from saying their corrupt or similar. Look at xbox support staff, Nuff said. 

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I'd caution people to ascribe too much value to a small minority being very vocal to suggest something more wider spread in using words like the  playerbase is disenchanted.

 

*Then*

 

although likely well intentioned, a post of this nature usually devolves quickly. why, well for as much as some want to attack staff as over zealous , look what happens when you leave discussion to the player base without any guidelines.

 

 

Urm... :P

 

Yea, I agree. :) Careful with use of the term playerbase there. ;)

 

In case ye didn't catch it (the surely unintentional hypocrisy in your post) ye noted to not use the term playerbase to describe a 'small minority', and then you use the term playerbase to describe that same small minority acting like unruly children. Unless you truly feel that most of the players are unruly children, and I don't think that's so.

 

Also, what I have found is one needs to be extremely careful at dismissing the 'vocal minority'. For every one that posts, there are many more who do not out of fear of reprisal. I cannot even tell you how many people are disgruntled with things, but say nothing out of fear. That kind of environment is never healthy.

 

If you think for one millisecond that it's just a few troublemakers stirring the pot, and that's the only problems, then you are being blinded.

 

There are troublemakers, and I'm not defending them.

What I am saying, however is LOOK DEEPER.

Edited by Belrindor

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Anyone chosen for a position of authority needs to be chosen for more than their knowledge of the game. Friendly and ALWAYS respectful to others in game and on forums should absolutely be required. If you let one thug or shady person join the staff, you tarnish the image of all staff. Staff members must be held to a higher standard. They are not just players anymore. They represent the game now.

When high standards are required to join, better interactions with players are made and abuse of power goes down, improving customer satisfaction and increasing players impression of the game/staff.

All that said, I think I have only had one time where I had a gm that was not helpful and to be honest, it was probably by the book and they did what what was required. In every other situation, GMs, forum mods and CA have been superb.

The one staff member I actually know well ingame is the most trustworthy anyone can possibly be, as well as always taking time to help, even when not in "staff mode".

I suspect the biggest issues are pvp related. To enjoy pvp, you need the right personality. Is that the right personality for a staff member? It must be hard to flip that switch from killing, destroying and looting, to courteous, helpful and empathetic. Maybe it isn't as hard as I imagine, but then again, almost every "abuse of power" rant on forums is about pvp.

I could be completely wrong, but that is my impression.

Edited by Wurmhole
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Anyone chosen for a position of authority needs to be chosen for more than their knowledge of the game. Friendly and ALWAYS respectful to others in game and on forums should absolutely be required. If you let one thug or shady person join the staff, you tarnish the image of all staff. Staff members must be held to a higher standard. They are not just players anymore. They represent the game now.

When high standards are required to join, better interactions with players are made and abuse of power goes down, improving customer satisfaction and increasing players impression of the game/staff.

 

THIS. In spades. Well said.

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The biggest problem with all these well thought out, rational, logical solutions is that they are all based on the idea that a solution is needed. If staff doesnt believe there is a problem then all the good solutions in the world wont matter. Does staff believe there are issues with the way they handle things? From the posts I see here...nope..... doesnt look like it to me.


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The biggest problem with all these well thought out, rational, logical solutions is that they are all based on the idea that a solution is needed. If staff doesnt believe there is a problem then all the good solutions in the world wont matter. Does staff believe there are issues with the way they handle things? From the posts I see here...nope..... doesnt look like it to me.

Of course they don't, they're consolidating their own power by only allowing their friends or those people sub enough to be controlled into the team. 

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Nay! Stiffer punishments!


 


Bring back the rack!


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Nay! Stiffer punishments!

 

Bring back the rack!

We had racks? I'd PVP for that reason alone! :)

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How about... everyone man up and stop acting like the world is ending over every little inconvenience they don't approve of?  Anyone?


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For a while, I was just "disguised" as a CM, with a secret GM account. It went well for a while, but it didn't take too long for someone (....posteh) to figure out that Kratos was me. When there are so few players, some people definitely have intentions to figure out who is who.

 

Part of it has to do with the fact that it's such a small community. 

Basically, communication skills are the give-away. When you see/read/"hear" the same <5k people for years and years, you don't necessarily need to see their name to figure out who they are. GG sticks out like a sore thumb, not just because of his forum avatar, but the way he carries his conversation. Same can be said about Tonygreen. Everyone knew who he was each week he made a forum alt. 

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