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Radni

Patch notes..?

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Changes to mechanics need to be listed, I can get keeping " changed code XYZ to enable us to sniff out local hackers" but changes like " weapon X miss rate increased" and "hellhounds made stronger" need to be listed. I haven't seen much in the way of patch notes lately, prior to anything regarding challenge.

Not only would it make Rolf and code club actually look professional, but it would help put rumors about X being changed to rest if what was changed would be listed.

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ur totally right, we noticed archery turrets have changed but theres no patch notes, very slack


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+1


 


We need some detail. Things like "XXXX was tweaked" are almost as bad as no patch notes at all. How was it tweaked? Roughly how much? 


 


Using an actual example: "The central spawn rates have been tweaked since it was a bit too much in some cases"


What does "central spawn" mean? Is it the resource spawns or mob spawns? It could reasonably have been interpreted to mean either of these because the former was a new feature and likely to be broken, while the latter can interfere with PvP, which is supposed to be frequent in the central area (HotA). To go out on a limb, it also could have been unique respawns, tree respawns, or even a very poor report on player spawns in central areas that could be problematic for whatever reason (we have seen suggestions regarding player respawns before, just a thought). What was tweaked here and by how much?


 


These are the things we are looking for, not "XXXX was fixed" when often the patch notes' definition of "fix" is the players' definition of "break even further".


 


EDIT: See my signature. That little bit of information from Rolf is a step in the right direction and is greatly appreciated.


Edited by SotG_is_OP
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"The mystery is half the fun" - Devs

Edited by Outlaw
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Oh my god is counting in threes that hard?

Rare = 3%

Supreme = 6%

Fantastic = 9%

Edited by Redd
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"The mystery is half the fun"

 

Please be sarcasm.

 

@ Red Ya don't say? I'm thanking Rolf for that information, which was unavailable before he told us. I'm asking for more of that.

Edited by SotG_is_OP

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Oh my god is counting in threes that hard?

Rare = 3%

Supreme = 6%

Fantastic = 9%

The issue lies with the word "additional" not the numbers. If an armor provides 50% protection currently, does being rare make it 53% protection or rather 51.5%? (50 + 3% of 50).

At higher levels of protection, say 80% protection, simply adding 9 to the percentage for a fantastic becomes ridiculous. The difference between 80 and 89% protection actually works out to almost halfing the damage you would have taken should the item not be fantastic. Whereas 9% less damage taken would equate to around 82% protection rather than 89.

That's the kind of ambiguity the devs need to get rid of.

Edited by Outlaw
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Please be sarcasm.

Fixed now, hadn't copy/pasted the full thing by mistake. Obvious sarcasm :P

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Based on the way everything else works (multiplicative stacking, not additive) and the frequent statement that rare armor has no noticeable effect, I would say the former.


 


0.5 * 0.97 = 0.485


 


1.0 - 0.485 = 0.515


                  = 51.5%


 


By the way, 50% is the exact damage reduction value of 100ql studded leather (non-rare), so that's what I'll call this reduction in the following (brief) analysis.


 


Assuming 30 base damage before reduction and the above damage multiplier for rare 100ql studded leather is correct:


 


Against naked: 30.0 * 1.0 = 30.0


Against 100ql studded leather: 30.0 * 0.5 = 15.0


Against 100ql rare studded leather: 30.0 * 0.485 = 14.55


 


This corresponds with player reports when you consider that the RNG allows for a relatively large window in which a base damage value can fall. Even when reduced, this window is large and also has a very wide overlap between rare and non-rare armor. Therefore, the actual damage reduction bonus is nearly or completely impossible to detect.


 


EDIT: @ Outlaw I figured it was. After all, it's relatively easy to convey sarcasm through text, even without using an outdated chat command function. /sarcasm


Edited by SotG_is_OP
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Would still be nice to get actual clarification. In personal cases people aren't going to notice even the rise by +3% making it 53% protection I don't think.

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You could call me a mathlete, but I still enjoy running numbers like this. I do it for most of the games I play to get a competitive edge and to see what is broken. Obviously, the numbers don't tell the whole story and all of the information needs to be looked at as a whole, but it gives a good starting point for improvements to the game or to play style.


 


I think I'll make another thread for it somewhere once I get enough information. Someone else might find it interesting, although the current information I have limits my output. It might be interesting to put out surveys to study things that require a bit more information than the developers have made available while keeping the results openly accessible to all.


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I disagree with the whole "give us exact mechanics" Last thing this game needs is to turn into math online where every mechanic is analysed and theres only one true way to do something else youre missing out on x% whatever.


 


Mystery allows us to have our own opinions and lets superstition work, something that I feel is more fun than number crunching.


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+1 give us exact mechanics documentation.

It's the only way to save money on bits and bytes ending the GL argument: SD is OP...SD is useless.

Thank you.

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radnijoe

Atleast I'm not a corn! A literal piece of talking corn!

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I disagree with the whole "give us exact mechanics" Last thing this game needs is to turn into math online where every mechanic is analysed and theres only one true way to do something else youre missing out on x% whatever.

 

Mystery allows us to have our own opinions and lets superstition work, something that I feel is more fun than number crunching.

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I disagree with the whole "give us exact mechanics" Last thing this game needs is to turn into math online where every mechanic is analysed and theres only one true way to do something else youre missing out on x% whatever.

 

Mystery allows us to have our own opinions and lets superstition work, something that I feel is more fun than number crunching.

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I've been thinking about informed purchases as well. I really feel that Wurm's economy makes this kind of disclosure necessary. Would you be willing to pay two or three times more for a rare if you knew it did next to nothing?


 


85ql regular steel plate:


 


68.5375% damage reduction


0.314625 damage multiplier


 


85ql rare steel plate:


 


69.306775% damage reduction


0.30693225 damage multiplier


 


This means that a hit that was reduced to exactly 10.0000 damage by 85ql steel plate will be reduced to about 9.7555 (to the nearest ten thousandth) damage by 85ql rare steel plate. The reduction of .2445 damage is well within the range of damage values that could have been produced by the RNG against regular (non-rare) 85ql steel plate. It also falls in line with the common statement that "rare armor has no effect on the player and only reduces damage to the armor itself". This is likely because the bonus was there but was not noticeable. Regardless, the RNG range for a hit of this magnitude is not wide enough for the difference in damage to increase or decrease very much.


 


Knowing this, how much would you be willing to pay for a rare piece of armor? Keep in mind that the 3% bonus has a smaller effect on weaker armors and will be even less noticeable. 


 


How I got these numbers (disclosure for those who question the sources):



Damage reduction values for regular armor found here:


http://armynator.de/wurm/armorcalc.php?type=13&QL=85


 


Rare bonus was calculated by multiplying the damage multiplier of regular steel plate by a multiplier that represents the 3% bonus (1 - 0.03 = 0.97). The value of the multiplier needs to be decreased to magnify an increase in damage reduction.


 


0.97 * .314625 = 0.30693225 [damage multiplier]


 


I then assumed a 10 damage hit against steel plate and used a proportion to calculate the damage against a rare piece of the same armor type and ql.


 


10/0.314625 = x/0.30693225


 


This isn't the best way to demonstrate a proportion (or any form of math), but I'm limited by the capabilities of this forum. Paper and pencil is much better.



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