Tragedy at Silent Hill

[Zorrent 8]

If I may counterpoint that comment, it's been done before, and for way shoddier reasons than stopping a genuine, confirmed thief and nuisance.  Besides... really.. what rules to throw aside?  If anything CC would be FINALLY making actual rules where at very bloody least thieves are forced to try to hide their actions, not flaunt them in everyone's face because of potential... gasp... consequences.

 

I'm sorry; I inevitably wind up mentioning I'm hardly a veteran of this game. That being said, though, when it comes to glitch exploitation, I've heard plenty of reluctance to open the flood gates in assuming whether or not a glitch was knowingly exploited ( and yes, I probably need to shut up about that by now ^^; ). That unspoken portion of the rule alongside the similar issue with the policy against griefing (in that a griefer who, say, calls guards on pets or something and insists he did it for the fighting skill gain) are the rules I'm referring to. However, there was mention of a "right reserved" to ban at will without any relation to (currently stated) rules. But if you look back, there have been so many players carrying on about special treatment in this case where similar griefers had gone unpunished. Whatever the case, nosfirebird has opened himself up to being named and I'm sure he's been totally ostracized.

Edit:

 

Justice: http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/116116-the-naughty-of-1045/#entry1186923

We still need to get the word out about the hazards though. Many people don't read the forums, so spread the word in chat as well. Refer to my signature.

 

http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/116116-the-naughty-of-1045/

Well looks like they were banned now lets hope you get back some of your items too.

http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/116116-the-naughty-of-1045/

 

Well, uh... as contradictory as it sounds given the title of the thread, Merry Christmas o.o

Edited December 25, 2014 by Zorrent

[Kegan 3,926]

I doubt this will stop much of anything i am guessing it will only fuel their fire to do even more bad things on new alts with new accounts over new ips but it is the best that can be done i guess in this case. 

[Zorrent 8]

I doubt this will stop much of anything i am guessing it will only fuel their fire to do even more bad things on new alts with new accounts over new ips but it is the best that can be done i guess in this case. 

 

Oh, don't worry. There are more clever ways to use the IP of a rule-breaker's account than banning it. Additionally, Wurm has items traceable in ways unique among MMORPG's which should support investigation. That, and the language is surprisingly open (using such a subjective term as "clearly"). Looks like I was wrong- they aren't painfully literal bureaucrats. I say have a little faith.

Edited December 25, 2014 by Zorrent

[Audrel 2,223]

Thank you, Staff.

[Aeris 3,751]

We're glad to see that obvious grief won't go unpunished in the game. Thanks for banning them and thereby showing that being technically able to do something doesn't mean you should, and that it is not within the spirit of the game to steal by abusing unintended functionality. We're not the only ones they caused grief and no doubt they would've caused even more had they been allowed to keep at it. They're a group of people the game will definitely be more enjoyable without.

[Mordraug 2,542]

A good step in the right direction.

 

Consider this constructive criticism, CC:  now that the process of reviewing the case is fresh in your minds, try writing up a ruleset that's as loophole free as possible.  If done correctly, and here's the beauty, not only the players benefit but also the GM's as suddenly long discussions can be brought down to "He broke III-2, IV-7, and IX-4".

 

I'd be willing to throw some cash into Wurm again someday, and I'm the kind who ain't happy with less than 2000 tiles of deed, shiny boats and ships... those big deeds generally make one want to deed up the surrounding lands just to keep them wild...  but if I can't vanish for 2 weeks because no one but myself can truly be trusted to keep my critters alive (btw you should make more animals swim when led in water, including most tamed ones, would really boost Xanadu's market... wasn't the same without my 5-speed uni project I was sad panda despite the awesome spot i'd gotten).  

If I can't reliably buy 20 silver and citizen+pay someone to hollow out a chunk of mountain for me because it may blow up in my face and may or may not be covered by the rules.... (hint, hiring work is part of Wurm's economy, for large projects you need SOME deed permissions given to the workers). 

 

Well, that's telling the overly-employed that their excess revenue is unwanted.  People willing to splurge $50+ a month on a game they may or may not play for more than 20 hours a month just because they like the idea of  having an awesome "billionaire's lair" online... do you REALLY wanna alienate that market?  This thread shows that you guys wisely dodged that bullet today, kudoes but pleeease keep it up... MMO's that keep me interested for more than 3 months are rare and it's sad that I'm still unwilling to spend on Wurm.  

[Raamkozijn 201]

I doubt this will stop much of anything i am guessing it will only fuel their fire to do even more bad things on new alts with new accounts over new ips but it is the best that can be done i guess in this case. 

 

Even if it doesn't stop the actions, by game rules it is now punishable. It's more difficult to do it. The pathetic baboons that still feel like doing such things will still do it. Nothing will stop them completely. But, with enough barriers/discouraging it might at least make some of them reconsider their actions.

It might fuel the fuel the fire for a few people, but overall it should do much more good than harm.

Just accepting thieves and giving them free reign certainly won't make it less harmful!

 

Furthermore, by having this now set in the rules, those bitter QQers regarding item recovery, that try their very best to prevent it from happening in any future cases because they didn't get it in the past, will now have a leg less to stand on with rules now actually covering what has happened here and what may have happened to said QQers and other peope in the past (for whom I feel sorry of course, it sucks losing your items; QQing and hinder new rule making as much as they can out of spite for past actions, however, is just pitiful.)

 

 

Thank you, staff, for listening to the community and its concerns. Much obliged.

Edited December 25, 2014 by Raamkozijn

[Nikab 110]

Justice has been served, glad to hear the good news, way to go Wurm Staff. 

[Docterchese 1,570]

I think that the GM team are on the nice list this year. They took time out to do this over the busy christmas period

[saraie 141]

Fantastic news.  But lets not stop there.

 

Lets work on the discrepancies that exist between house writs, and village permissions, and add in appropriate measures within the code to further curtail this abuse.

More detailed permissions for deed holders, perhaps with less clustering of certain permissions together...with a link to such detailed information provided as soon as a person drops a deed.

 

While it will be difficult to cover every possible scenario, the knowledge that abusing the system will be dealt with swiftly, and strictly, along with new development work on the mechanics themselves, may go a long way in keeping this community, and the experiences we all enjoy, heading in the right direction.

[Becket 843]

Imo the GM Staff was going to send a message to the Wurm community one way or the other depending on how this was handled.

This is the proper message. Thank You

[whykillme 1,621]

yay

[Fooligun 591]

While its a shame the staff don't get a holiday over Christmas, I'm glad they were given a swift and uncompromising punishment

[Windeee 36]

Thank-you  Wurm.

[Heboric 808]

Imo the GM Staff was going to send a message to the Wurm community one way or the other depending on how this was handled.

This is the proper message. Thank You

 

This.

 

Hopefully it establishes the core principle that you may not PvP on a PvE server.

 

Thank you Enki and Staff, and I wish you all a happy holiday time further.

Edited December 26, 2014 by Heboric

[Ayes 3,715]

http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/116116-the-naughty-of-1045/?view=getnewpost

 

This response sets a good precedent to work from and shows that the GM's are willing to put in the extra time to protect the game and players from unscrupulous individuals such as these. With the free wheeling sales of items and characters endorsed by the game's creator comes the draw to these types who will take advantage of players in any ways available to steal items from them that can be converted to outside cash through various means. 

 

Although these types of scoundrels can again re-enter the game through the purchase of new characters, after they are repeatedly banned in the future, along with sales of stolen items blocked, the potential for profit will be negated and these vultures will seek their prey elsewhere outside of our beloved lands.

 

Nice work by the protectors of Wurm's concept of enjoyment and fair play! I commend your steps in this direction. Now combined with more player vigilance in making these types of situations known, the GM's will be able to keep the true intent of player actions protected and the game an enjoyable experience for all.

 

Happy Trails

=Ayes=

[Raamkozijn 201]

I normally don't care much for "likes" and such, but would you look at the count of http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/116116-the-naughty-of-1045/. 97 and counting, and that within 24 hours! I'd say that shows the community's support of this decision!

[Dairuka 888]

I normally don't care much for "likes" and such, but would you look at the count of http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/116116-the-naughty-of-1045/. 97 and counting, and that within 24 hours! I'd say that shows the community's support of this decision!

 

I will "like" your post, and you're going to like it.

 

Ninjaedit: The post from nosfirebird below me seems pretty mad, doesn't it? The bluster about how hes gotten away with murder seems like false bravado. He even made alts to upvote his post, before spamming the forums with nude pictures to get that alt banned after he got called out on it, so it can't be lead back to him.

 

However, all of the recently deleted whining threads in the past 12 hours about how his alts "got banned unfairly" under forum names with less than 10 posts leads me to believe he got pegged hard. Really hard. I wonder how much he lost in the bannings. I hope it was a lot. These lies in a pathetic attempt to raise his notoriety makes it seem like it's all he has left. Kind of reminds me of Boston's fall from grace.

 

Considering nosfirebird is a known liar, and considering he only came out to brag after he got banned - I'm betting he just got owned and won't admit it to save face. It's kind of sad, really. Maybe it's time he sought psychiatric help for that inferiority complex.

 

Kudos to CodeClubAB on a job well done. Hearing cheaters cry is the best Christmas present you could have ever given us.

Edited December 26, 2014 by Dairuka

[nosfirebird 193]

hi

Edited December 26, 2014 by nosfirebird

[Chrisyou 46]

Happy to have read the resulting outcome. 

[Tpikol 1,057]

this is a good step if it means that from now on all thieves like this ones will be punished,but if only especial cases are punished nothing will change.

 

if you have to wait for a pattern to happen before banning people that means they already got enough out of it to be worth doing again.

[Miretta 1,415]

this is a good step if it means that from now on all thieves like this ones will be punished,but if only especial cases are punished nothing will change.

 

if you have to wait for a pattern to happen before banning people that means they already got enough out of it to be worth doing again.

thats why there is a rulechange

[Tpikol 1,057]

thats why there is a rulechange

what rule change? the only thing i see thats a change in how the apply that rules for this case and this case only.

[Cista 428]

As much as it tickles us to see scammers taste some bitter medicine, the post from Enki is way too fuzzy and thus leaves us in an unsatisfactory limbo.

 

Members of the self-appointed lynch mob seem to be forgetting two things:

1) Thieving is a natural part of the gameplay that the devs are offering us on Freedom. "Blatant stealing and theft "(Enki) like this and this traditionally only get a pat on the back from Enki & Co.

2) The setting that allowed the heist is still there. Now it even has a warning on it that tells you that your things can get stolen.

 

Now, in a normal game, this warning would mean that if your things get stolen through this mechanic, you will not get them back and the thief will not get punished, just like in parallel cases a person that you yourself put on your house writ will not get punished if he steals from you. However, I am worried that Wurm is not really a normal game, and to me the verdict just raises more questions than it answers.

 

For example, can mayors like the OP now continue to leave this permission ticked so that villagers can work on their own houses, well knowing that if someone takes advantage of the mechanic with the innocently sounding name "Destroy Buildings"(!), they can complain to the GMs and simply have said villager banned from the game?

I would think not, because since the permission now comes with that warning, everything points to it being the responsibility of the mayor to get their settings right.

 

Which in turn indicates that it was only these "few specific individuals" that devs wanted to ban, while leaving the definition of what in fact constitutes "blatant stealing and theft " that is within the normal gameplay and what "blatant stealing and theft" is a bannable offense, completely blowing in the wind. 

 

So the recommendation seems to be, next time you have been met with "blatant stealing and theft ", gather a large enough lynch mob and things will happen! This is fine I guess for a tiny game that wants to focus on the faithful members, but a deadly policy for a game that wishes to grow. Clear rules and clear rulings are always preferrable.

Edited December 26, 2014 by Cista

[As_I_Decay 1,592]

1) Thieving is a natural part of the gameplay that the devs are offering us on Freedom. 

Thievery (as a skill) is blatantly nerfed on the PVE lands. Considering I can't turn lawful off and just start grabbing other people's stuff on their deed, it's not a "natural" part of all of Freedom gameplay.... just the PVP server.

As for GMs policing one situation differently and not others, that's a different topic belonging in a different thread. In comparison to a real life topic, should the cops get the rapist before they attack more people? Sure, they should have taken care of it after the first situation, but I am not going to claim that because 4 others were violated prior and nothing was done, the cops shouldn't nail the offender on the 5th offense because the 4 prior might feel some sort of injustice on their behalf.  

I hope Rolf+team went a step further this time with the ban in that it wasn't just a character + IP ban, and that he is refusing to take payments from the credit card/cardholders info. I actually want to see him stop taking payments from the people that are here only to destroy what he's built.

 

Edited December 26, 2014 by As_I_Decay