Clarification regarding some rules-Lock this with love

[Hashirama 870]

From personal experience, I had a wagon, that was NOT locked, it was ON DEED. A neighbor hitched HIS animals to it and drove it to HIS house and locked it inside. When a GM responded to my ticket I was told that I was out of luck because it was now in their house. Even though the wagon had my name on it as owner, it was not locked, thus anyone was allowed to do anything they wanted with it. Unless I was able to find a way into the house to retrieve it there was nothing the GM's could or would do.

 

I believe exactly this has happened to me, I would never have any problems if soemone took the wagon to chaos and embarked it to get its ownership, but at the moment am the owner, I should be able to retrieve it back :/ and not rely on the mood of other player to give it back to me (considering the fact that I found it)

[Gaul 339]

The Original MR wagon has returned.

 

The deed owner gave it back after some new player stole it from Konoha.

 

Just for general knowledge never take anything which has ownership of Hashirama or any HOTS item on PVE lands.

 

PVE is for fun and to relieve stress, if one wants to PVP then we have servers for that. 

 

Thanks 

Edited November 29, 2014 by Gaul

[Hashirama 870]

Responsibility is yours to lock and secure your belongings

I agree 100%, but still, according to rules, it isnt wrong to lock someone's off deed wagon is it? If not then the reason, because someone preventing an owner from taking a wagon is an act of griefing only, especially when the owner has found out his wagon and has the proof of its ownership.

I really want to know that if i keep a wagon off deed, is there a chance that someone can block view on it via a big house and let the wagon and contents decay

 

Am pretty sure lots of players keep valuables in carts and wagons, so this will help them know better if they have to keep the wagon on deed or they will get GM support when they do not. (Talking about Locked wagon hitched with horses off deed)

[Hordern 2,177]

Well I look at it this way, in the game rules, the only mention of griefing on Freedom as far as access to something goes, is in relation to houses:

 

Access

Completely blocking access to other players' structures is not acceptable, and will be considered griefing

 

As far as a wagon or large cart goes, it was unlocked thus anyone can use it. As a GM I would not tell you where your unsecured wagon had ended up, and I certainly wouldn't give it back - it's basically a boat for land, so the same rulings apply.

The only time I would consider a house around a wagon/large cart as griefing on Freedom is if the wagon/cart was locked (so no one else could use it) and left off deed and someone else built a building around it. They cannot use the wagon, so they are purely doing it to harrass the owner of the wagon/cart. An unlocked wagon/cart can be used by anyone, so technically doesn't have an owner - players are warned about this when building their first boat, and if the pop up doesn't appear with carts/wagons too, then perhaps it should.

The simple version is, if a cart/wagon/boat is unlocked, the name on it isn't an owner so much as the caretaker. They're only the owner if it's locked.

 

 

 

 

 

I always left my carts and wagons in an on deed pen for which the only access was a locked house - until I got around to making locks for them. It was tedious and always took extra time to do, but at least I knew they were safe.

[Pandalet 1,848]

Out of interest, is there any way to drag a (locked) wagon?  Like you can do with a (non-loaded, unhitched) cart, even if it's on deed?

 

It'd be nice to see the stealing carts from deeds loophole fixed - deeds should really be over-arching protection, not deed-it-and-still-lose-it, especially as the usual response to stuff getting stolen is 'deed it or lose it'.

[Capi 895]

Can't drag wagons. Only Push/Pull.

[Wizlawz 10]

[snip]

 

GMs have told us in the past that actions are "griefing" and not allowed on Freedom servers if their only purpose is to cause a person emotional distress. "Stealing (aka taking without permission)"

is ok if an item is not secured and the other person can personally benefit by taking it. In other words, their main motivation is not to upset you but to improve their own circumstances.

 

The person who took your wagon, "presumably" did so for personal benefit and "presumably" not solely to cause you emotional distress (you probably suspect otherwise if you know the individual, but cannot prove that).  On the other hand, a person who fences a wagon, or builds a house around it, is clearly having  no interest in personal use of the wagon (else they would have driven off in it)  but doing it ONLY to prevent the owner access, and to thus cause emotional distress for them.

 

[snip]

 

I hope the answer helped you even if it was not the answer you wanted to hear.

 

[snip]

 

certainly answered the questions in my head. thx for posting this.

Edited November 29, 2014 by Wizlawz

[Hashirama 870]

Thanks for clarifying it hordern, I wanted to know this from a GM, i guess my wagon will be safe off deed if its locked.

Please lock this post.

[mikeyyaya 117]

click

[Hordern 2,177]

i guess my wagon will be safe off deed if its locked.

 

Sorry to reply after the thread is locked, but every case always has a lot to look at, and while the statement is broadly true, I CAN think of a situation where it's not, and there are probably more:

 

I would rule in favor of the house builder if an area was being developed and another player then parks a locked wagon in the middle of where they were building and leaves it there in an attempt to force the builder from the land.

As always it's about intent/use and this is why our job is so flipping tough at times in a game like this