Recommending Player Auctions

[Kegan 3,926]

Well what it looks like to me is the professional "gold farmers"  have arrived so yes the game will likely grow.. now if this is a good thing or a bad one only time will tell but do expect more bots and things to come too,  

[fencejumper 491]

Well what it looks like to me is the professional "gold farmers"  have arrived so yes the game will likely grow.. now if this is a good thing or a bad one only time will tell but do expect more bots and things to come too,  

 

My experience is that gold farmers usually tank the market for people selling. Great though if your buying.

[Radni 1,089]

Complaints: how do we sell for silver there? Is this forums for silver and that one for money?

[Warlander 2,730]

Wurm have "good" community, there is no need for any third party auction system - especially the one which is taking a lot of money from each transaction. In addition, most of transactions in game are small or/and silver-based.

I don't think anyone will use this site - it might be good for large transactions, but these are very rare, most of players will not create additional account to just buy or sell one thing.

[Faeldray 49]

I agree with what Gnomegates said. If this was just a site for Wurm Online auctions, I'd have no issue with it. However, since they're supporting RMTs in games that explicitly have rules against it, it looks super sketchy and I wouldn't trust them with my email address, never mind my money. I've seen friends' accounts in other games get compromised and taken over by the kind of people who sell on these sites (even one of my old game accounts was used for such activities) and it's not fun at all. I've seen people so discouraged by this that they just quit. Maybe some of the sellers on this site are "legit" (as much as they can be) but how can you tell the difference when you don't know them?

 

Even if that doesn't bother you, just Googling "playerauctions reviews" is enough for me not to want anything to do with them.

 

Partnering with PlayerAuctions allows Code Club better use of their time to code, develop, enhance, and support Wurm Online. Trust me, you don't want Rolf spending his days dealing with payment processors, handling botched trades, fixing charge back issues, etc. etc. Instead, you want us to handle the trades, customer support, and maybe throw our marketing muscle at Wurm to help it grow and flourish. Right?   

 

As for this, as far as I know, Rolf and the devs have nothing to do with trades made on the forums. He even posted a "safer account transfer" thread 2 days ago that says things like:

 

 

We have and can not take any responsibility for such a transaction.
 

However we do not offer our support or services for such activity and will not be held responsible for any remedial action or loss that occurs, as any such activity is entirely at your own risk.

If you have made a mistake and accounts have been compromised, taken over and possibly even sold further the company has no responsibility for this and can not be made accountable. What you did was give access away against our recommendations.

 

Seems to me that they're saying we buy and sell accounts/items at our own risk and there's no support if something goes wrong. So how can this be taking time away from development?

[Radni 1,089]

Wurm have "good" community, there is no need for any third party auction system - especially the one which is taking a lot of money from each transaction. In addition, most of transactions in game are small or/and silver-based.

I don't think anyone will use this site - it might be good for large transactions, but these are very rare, most of players will not create additional account to just buy or sell one thing.

Agreed

[zalifear 186]

Paranoia sets in, Why should a reputable company have to come and explain a safe service, i don't remember anyone from Pay-pal going "don't worry we are good for you" or having to come to our forum to explain their self to get in the door. it provides safe transaction yes at a fee too. For larger transaction I can see this being an options but for our day to day transactions, I doubt it.

Idk, Rolf has said he trusts this and it will be good, I guess that'll have to be the likes of it and I'll not say anymore.

[bigsteve 378]

I would of thought that CodeClub would have developed its own ingame auction/selleing system along time ago.

but hay hoe, we will have to wait and see if players want to pay the surcharge when doing transactions...

[Dently 111]

Loving this site so far, Did you know you can sell Steam Accounts? 600$ worth of games, 60 bucks US! Much wow! The guy only got banned once too, but don't worry he has tools to bypass it. Thats worth. Oh and archage Gold? Imma jump right on it, and mabey use the Archage ToS to wipe the noob blood off me when I murder them with the leet gear I bought. 

 

/sarcasam

 

 

Of the 3 items being sold atm, only one has a reputable name I know from the wurm fourms, so If I decided I needed a 13$ Wagon I'd go to him. The downside? You really see the monetary value and greed that takes hold in wurm. Its not apparent when you are on the forums and people wast 1s or 1e. But when its listed as straight currency.......... yea, that brings a bad feeling to my stomach

[janekpolaczek 76]

 Still i havent money (acc Janekpolaczek "solded") "transaction" was in january via paypal...So i havent money and acc

 

 

Player auctions is good idea

Edited October 22, 2014 by janekpolaczek

[Wurmhole 3,650]

 

 

Thank you so much for the welcome. People may judge me for saying this... but I am a Mac user. That being said, you can't know my joy when I realized that Wurm is indeed compatible with Mac. 

 

So, YES... I will be in-game soon. I actually started the client download when I left the office today at my work computer, and I will be letter it download on my personal computer tonight when I sleep.

 

I honestly haven't been this excited for a game in a long time. Sandbox games are fantastic for so many reasons (in the future, I may share some internal data on sandbox games, and how they related to secondary markets, very interesting stuff). I have played EVE for years, so I look forward to getting involved in a Sandbox set in a fantasy type world. 

 

Any noobie tips you can offer? 

 

Welcome to Wurm!  Pace yourself.  Be prepared for a rough learning curve at the start, but know that it is so worth it to keep at it. Play as if you were really there and the characters around you are real people. My first day, I wandered across a farm and thought "hey, it lets me harvest, sweet!"  A few days later, I made some friends and then learned my lucky harvest probably really upset some poor farmer who now had no food to feed his family.

 

Ask questions all day long and we are all happy to answer.  We all learned the same way.

[Uberknot 327]

I am not going to pay more to trade. So whos getting this kick back fee? paypal, that site, wurm?

 

I just dont get it really I have rarely heard of people having a problem trading before.  I know I have never had a problem.

 

I think an in game auction house system would have been a much better way to go and it would have actually improved the game overall.

Edited October 22, 2014 by Uberknot

[Eobersig 1,004]

Actually, VirtualTrades is one community who has worked with us in the past. We don't own them, and they don't work for us. ...

 

Here on the Wurm forum it's practically working against you.

 

He's a brand-new account, made for this occasion, making too much noise, has zero experience with the game and it's players, has zero experience with the sort of trades made here. That's not the sort of PR you would like to have.

[Bittereinder 265]

I will probably not be using this. Who would want to pay 10% extra on a 500 EUR transaction?

Why don't you make an in-game auction Rolf? Where every player across all of freedom can bid and the item is automatically sent to your post box after winning the auction... That would make things easy for everyone!

Edited October 22, 2014 by Bittereinder

[PlayerAuctions 14]

An interesting alternative to make available for player sales of characters, silver/gold coins and higher priced items all for RL currency in exchange. Since personally I don't believe in selling these items for RL currency or am I interested in purchasing them (outside of coins from the Wurm Shop), I will have no use for this service.

 

As Gnomegates posted, one of the first things that caught my eye is that they are WoW gold sellers. Having played that game for many years and knowing well WoW's policy against this, as well as the despised reputation of those who do so, that immediate taint was associated with their website. Then I saw some note of +5% for "Powerleveling Order Surcharge" and I am a bit further concerned. This site might offer "Powerleveling" of Wurm character accounts then?

 

Still, I suppose that for those who wish to make a profit from playing the game of Wurm Online, since the main objective will be that, other concerns are subordinated to that end result.

 

Good luck with your latest endorsed association here Rolf. Perhaps just another sky is falling post from me and all will work out well in the end. This may have the ability to draw more players to the game, increasing income to further sustain and expand its possibilities, so in that respect there may be some end benefit beyond the play for profit motivations. As in all things new, only time will tell.

 

Happy Trails

=Ayes=

 

I believe what you meant to say was that there are "people who sell wow gold" on the site. In truth, PA is based on a consumer to consumer (c2c) business model. Unlike gold farming sites (business to consumer, or b2c), which use bots and hacks, in-game spam, and other unsavory things which harm our virtual worlds, PlayerAuctions is meant as a counter to that industry by empowering player to player trading. 

 

We aren't the "shady botters" which has given virtual trade a bad name. Rather, we mean to empower the players by connecting gamers to other gamers to secure their trades. 

 

Players have far more rights than they realize when it comes to secondary markets. Couple this with the fact that gamers will trade in other games regardless of the taboo or EULA, we are left with two options:

 

PlayerAuctions can shut down those markets (where users are legally able to engage in) and therefore leave huge communities to fend for themselves. Or, we can step in, and clean up those marketplaces by removing scammers from the mix. 

 

 

 

I agree with what Gnomegates said. If this was just a site for Wurm Online auctions, I'd have no issue with it. However, since they're supporting RMTs in games that explicitly have rules against it, it looks super sketchy and I wouldn't trust them with my email address, never mind my money. I've seen friends' accounts in other games get compromised and taken over by the kind of people who sell on these sites (even one of my old game accounts was used for such activities) and it's not fun at all. I've seen people so discouraged by this that they just quit. Maybe some of the sellers on this site are "legit" (as much as they can be) but how can you tell the difference when you don't know them?

 

Even if that doesn't bother you, just Googling "playerauctions reviews" is enough for me not to want anything to do with them.

 

 

As for this, as far as I know, Rolf and the devs have nothing to do with trades made on the forums. He even posted a "safer account transfer" thread 2 days ago that says things like:

 

 

Seems to me that they're saying we buy and sell accounts/items at our own risk and there's no support if something goes wrong. So how can this be taking time away from development?

 

A business will never have a solid track record.Even we are fallible and prone to human error. But since I took over the business about a year ago, showcasing our "true" performance has been a focus (because everyone knows that a disgruntled consumer would be far more vocal than a consumer who had no issues). But more than that, legendary service is the goal. 

 

Aside from the speckle of complaints here or there, let's take into account 3 things:

 

1) PlayerAuctions has been around for 15 years. With the number of complaints around the web, in comparison to the total volume we have transacted since 2000, then it is easy to realize those vocal are a minority of human error or special circumstance (or bad consumers trying to take advantage)

 

2) Of all the businesses in virtual trades, and RMT, how many of them actually reach out to consumers who were not happy. How many actually engage with their audience? Try googling "communications@playerauctions.com". That's been me throughout the years. 

 

I know there is a lot of hesitation here it seems, but within these next few days, I'd hope to determine that I'm actually welcome here, and that it is appreciated that you guys have someone here to engage with. 

 

3) In reality, we actually do have a solid reputation. I'll let other businesses and users speak for themselves:

• Accredited by the Business Consumer Alliance with one of their highest ratings "A" + a 5 star rating from users
  • http://www.businessconsumeralliance.org/Report/Playerauctionscom-100079280
• Over 500 organic reviews by real users with a 4.5 star rating on Trustlink
  • https://www.trustlink.org/Reviews/Playerauctionscom-205979729
• Over 200 organic reviews with 4.3 stars on Sitejabber
  • ​http://www.sitejabber.com/reviews/www.playerauctions.com

 

At the end of the day, PA is totally optional. If you'd like to give us a try, we'll make sure your trades are safe, and do what we can to support Wurm. And if you decide in the end not too, then I at least I hope I'll be welcome as a fellwo gamer, and that you'd invite me on a tour of your settlement 

 

 

 

Paranoia sets in, Why should a reputable company have to come and explain a safe service, i don't remember anyone from Pay-pal going "don't worry we are good for you" or having to come to our forum to explain their self to get in the door. it provides safe transaction yes at a fee too. For larger transaction I can see this being an options but for our day to day transactions, I doubt it.

Idk, Rolf has said he trusts this and it will be good, I guess that'll have to be the likes of it and I'll not say anymore.

 

This is a case of "damned if you do, damned if you don't" haha. 

 

Before registering an account on Wurm, I actually took some time to decide if I should join and introduce ourselves here or not. I've been involved with gaming communities for years. I'm a gamer myself, and I fully aware of people's suspicious of "new guys" or outsiders. I've even been part of the "nay say group" back in the day when I passionately wrote about all that was wrong about Star Trek Online.

 

My gamer community experience tells me:

Option #1 It's shady if I create an official account, come here and engage with users, and try to explain the service.

Option #2 It's shady if I don't create an official account, and PA remains completely silent after the announcement. 

 

I eventually concluded, it would be "less" shady, if I went with Option #2 and came here to make introductions.  And I'm glad I did, because there actually have been a few people who have been polite, and very welcoming. 

[saraie 141]

I believe what you meant to say was that there are "people who sell wow gold" on the site. In truth, PA is based on a consumer to consumer (c2c) business model. Unlike gold farming sites (business to consumer, or b2c), which use bots and hacks, in-game spam, and other unsavory things which harm our virtual worlds, PlayerAuctions is meant as a counter to that industry by empowering player to player trading. 

 

 

"Oh no officer...I didnt manufacture this cocaine...someone in columbia did...I'm just trying to make selling cocaine safer for everyone."

 

You can dress it up all you like...you facilitate the trading of in game currency across many platforms where it is against the TOS. To expect us to believe that you are a champion against botting, or hacking, is an insult to our intellect.

You dont care where the currency comes from, or how it was gained..as long as you get your cut.

 

The fact that you are even here posting, and along with your friend, invoking Rolfs name throughout our forums..leaves a bad taste in my mouth, and not just about the playerauctions site.

Edited October 22, 2014 by saraie

[PlayerAuctions 14]

Here on the Wurm forum it's practically working against you.

 

He's a brand-new account, made for this occasion, making too much noise, has zero experience with the game and it's players, has zero experience with the sort of trades made here. That's not the sort of PR you would like to have.

 

I agree, though in his defense, as an owner of a community site that specializes in digital asset exchange, he was himself pretty excited of hearing about Wurm, though I think he may have in the end felt that the feeling was a bit too "combative". 

 

I chalk this up as my fault, since I likely should have kept the collaboration to myself. I simply knew that part of his user base was looking for a new "gaming home" and I thought Wurm would be a perfect fit for them, so I mentioned it, which made him fairly excited. 

 

I hope this shed light on it, and that in the future he'll be welcome back, as well as the many gamers he may bring with him. 

 

jake

[Uberknot 327]

I agree, though in his defense, as an owner of a community site that specializes in digital asset exchange, he was himself pretty excited of hearing about Wurm, though I think he may have in the end felt that the feeling was a bit too "combative". 

 

I chalk this up as my fault, since I likely should have kept the collaboration to myself. I simply knew that part of his user base was looking for a new "gaming home" and I thought Wurm would be a perfect fit for them, so I mentioned it, which made him fairly excited. 

 

I hope this shed light on it, and that in the future he'll be welcome back, as well as the many gamers he may bring with him. 

 

jake

 

 

Well good luck it seems like its more about taking a cut in the action to me.  If you find some players that need your service so be it.

[validate 598]

when I got the email I thought it was a fake as it has  Rolf's name on it.  it's real

 

just to let everyone know   I love players auctions

 

I paid 800$ us for a final fantasy 11  high end account.  it was stolen back by owner 6 months later.  I emailed players auctions and they looked into it. I got 800$ store credit,  cant money back. but at least I got the 800$ value back to use.  I bought eve online account and isk  and I think everquest plat.  

 

anyways they give safety. as you have to be the owner and have all the info for the accounts.  and they test the info before you buy, and give protection for both buyer and seller. as no paypal cancel sale thing I for get how folks screwed over folks.  took back payments with creditcards and being virtual items you had no case.  but players auctions has the loop hole to prevent that I guess I forget how.

 

I don't work for them and hanv't used them in 7 yrs  but the 10 or so times I did . it was good. and if Rolf is supportive of them. we're safe.

 

can sell accounts.  silver and gold. and items.  maybe no need for items as we pay on delivery.  but the gold coins I hear some paying for and not getting or was a dup thing.  new players can buld rep this way too

 

does have escrow type of thing.  you pay they hold cash until you get all info and log ingame, you then click you have account they then pay the seller.  ,then have the log in info at first to so they can test if you have issues and so they can make sure the buyer doesn't just steal the account.  they can investigate and use a fraud law  too I think I read once.

 

small fee for all that security though.  but worth it for high payments.  would not use for under 75$us   or ya I think everything is us$  too.

Edited October 22, 2014 by validate

[Coastis 321]

I believe what you meant to say was that there are "people who sell wow gold" on the site. In truth, PA is based on a consumer to consumer (c2c) business model. Unlike gold farming sites (business to consumer, or b2c), which use bots and hacks, in-game spam, and other unsavory things which harm our virtual worlds, PlayerAuctions is meant as a counter to that industry by empowering player to player trading. 

 

We aren't the "shady botters" which has given virtual trade a bad name. Rather, we mean to empower the players by connecting gamers to other gamers to secure their trades. 

 

Players have far more rights than they realize when it comes to secondary markets. Couple this with the fact that gamers will trade in other games regardless of the taboo or EULA, we are left with two options:

 

PlayerAuctions can shut down those markets (where users are legally able to engage in) and therefore leave huge communities to fend for themselves. Or, we can step in, and clean up those marketplaces by removing scammers from the mix. 

 

 

Interesting attempt to position yourselves as hero and saviour of the internet, truth is however that your site encourages users to break the terms and conditions of many popular MMO's, an act that could result in the permanent loss of their account. Not only that but for the value of deals we're talking about you require people to send a copy of their driving license and utility bills to you guys, to what amounts to a random online website. Yet you don't define yourself as shady?

 

This whole situation is rotten to the core and personally i wouldn't touch you guys with a 100ft pole.

[PlayerAuctions 14]

"Oh no officer...I didnt manufacture this cocaine...someone in columbia did...I'm just trying to make selling cocaine safer for everyone."

 

You can dress it up all you like...you facilitate the trading of in game currency across many platforms where it is against the TOS. To expect us to believe that you are a champion against botting, or hacking, is an insult to our intellect.

You dont care where the currency comes from, or how it was gained..as long as you get your cut.

 

The fact that you are even here posting, and along with your friend, invoking Rolfs name throughout our forums..leaves a bad taste in my mouth, and not just about the playerauctions site.

 

I do not believe it is an insult to anyone's intellect, since I believe most people would recognize and understand, that we are in a better position to speak on these matters than most.  But we are of course, an "outsider" and it is naturally easier to assume the worst, rather than outright trust (it is a natural reaction). 

 

Many years ago, another business within our governance was in the b2c space. An acquisition was made of a Korean RMT company called Itemmania, which operated on a c2c business model. Over a short period of time, the Korean c2c business grew and outstripped the b2c business.

 

For two reasons:

1) c2c had more user benefits than b2c. 

2) Game publishers in Korea had taken RMT to court in the country at the highest levels. The courts ruled in favor of gamers, thus voiding the game developer's TOS and EULA's.

 

The b2c company was sold, and investment was poured into PA to follow the same Korean model. One of the reasons why PA is still in existence is due to that precedent in the Korean court. US/EU game publishers wouldn't risk the same trial outcome which Nexxon brought to Korean game publishers. 

 

You see, forbidding secondary trading for users who expend their own time and energy to make these virtual assets come into existence, is unenforceable as against public policy. 

 

Where some people may say that PA is shady because we support game markets where publishers unfairly impose rules on it's users as the "moral high ground" , we have the perspective that supporting these markets as empowering gamers to exercise their right to engage in secondary market activity as the "moral high ground". 

 

It boils down to if you agree with game publishers, that gamers have no right to their in-game assets, or if you believe that such imposition is both unfair and unenforceable. We believe the former. 

[Niki 2,278]

I'd be afraid to use your website personally looks like a gold farmer site to me not an auction house. Lets say I sell my blue party hat in runescape (example) whats stopping me from getting banned? Terms of service in runescape is really against real market trades. That's just one mmo you have quite a large listing here.

[Uberknot 327]

I think the biggest thing you are going to be dealing with is a small tight knit group of players who have been  trading and playing this game for a long time.  You will be seen as the outsider coming in trying to change things and grab a piece of the action going on.  We rarely see problems here in Wurm and many of us have sold items,accounts,etc.. to the tune of 100,300,500,1000+ eu's with no problems at all.  I would say any problems like what you are protecting against with your service are the exception to the norm here and might be something a new player would use if they don't trust anyone or a player who doesnt know anyone.

 

 So yeah there might be some benefit to certain types of players or for spur of the moment type sales, But for the most part I do not see many people using this type of service at all. The thing that really bugs me is the fact that this service  charges quite a bit to use so unless its a very high transaction it seems more of a hassle than anything else.  The effect might be a small increase seen in prices for those who use this service, but people will use trusted sellers in Wurm for less more than likely.

 

I do wish they would have added an in game Auction House for items that players could bid on with in game silvers to keep that side of the deal still in game.  The Forums are clumsy at times and a better system in game  would help the players and make the game better.  Adding an outside auction service that charges a fee to trade is not what most of the players had in mind at all. Perhaps for account sales it might be something to consider for those players who absolutely cannot trust anyone else.

[PlayerAuctions 14]

Interesting attempt to position yourselves as hero and saviour of the internet, truth is however that your site encourages users to break the terms and conditions of many popular MMO's, an act that could result in the permanent loss of their account. Not only that but for the value of deals we're talking about you require people to send a copy of their driving license and utility bills to you guys, to what amounts to a random online website. Yet you don't define yourself as shady?

 

This whole situation is rotten to the core and personally i wouldn't touch you guys with a 100ft pole.

 

Hi Coastis,

 

Our site does not encourage users to break terms and contractual obligations quite the contrary actually. It is a matter of real, and legal implications which, if you are interested I can share personally with you, not to argue of course, but if you are genuinely interested in the legal aspects which keep us in business, then I'd be happy to share.

 

As for the verification we require; it is inevitable. 

 

For one, not only do we want to protect the marketplace against fraudsters, but we also have to take due diligence to protect ourselves since at the end of the day, if fraud does occur, it is us who absorbs and deals with it.

 

Secondly, because our business has an escrow component to it, we need to comply with certain federal laws for businesses which are involved in the flow of funds. What with Bitcoin drawing more attention to virtual currencies, and regulators begin to ramp up regulation on it, we see fit to be in compliance before any issues arise in the future. 

 

SO, when I say it's inevitable, I mean so because... if we're going to protect users and absorb all fraud, then it would be fairly silly of us not to take proper measures to protect ourselves, and second... if regulation does tighten in the future, it'd be better for us to be safe in compliance than sorry and shut down. 

 

That being said, we are exploring new verification models, but still evaluating them presently (if that matters at all to you). If you are a fan of risk management and have suggestions, please PM me.

 

And anyway, if we were taking personally identifiable documents from users and abusing them... I think we'd have been shut down by now. Thank goodness we don't, we're celebrating our 15 year anniversary next year. 

[Postes 5,282]

there's really no security that can be offered via this website compared to just a direct payment sent forward to another person via the paypal website.  ebay doesn't allow virtual goods to be sold because of the several loopholes it causes, and in the end even if you use this website, you can still easily be scammed by ignoring the website, and going right to paypal.  

 

the website might be a good middleman, but it in no how offers security assuming of course this site uses paypal which 99% sure it does 

Edited October 22, 2014 by Postes