Balance Libs Saccing item with every other faith

[Hogwash 177]

we are BL, its supposed to be easier for un to generate favor. 

[Issle 793]

-1, sounds lame.

[warrior 455]

You can get 10-15 crops in one action... if you do 4-9 actions prior to that tending the crops. And the maximum amount of times you can tend a crop is 5, so good luck getting 15 crops.

It's fine as is

Edited September 21, 2014 by warrior

[Awardis 75]

Libila gets double favor from all alchemy items. This includes bladders, teeth, glands, etc. Due to the time it takes to collect large amounts of items like this on March 19th, 2014 the following change was made:

 

Alchemy item double favor gain values were increased by a factor 15

 

Last time I checked Libila priests are capable of getting their own saccables when it comes to alchemy items like bladders and glands so I don't feel like being unable to farm is a justifiable reason for onions and wemp to be so much better than any other saccable. Cordage rope used to be a popular item for favor but now it's more efficient for Libila priests to simply sacrifice the raw wemp instead of turning it into a cordage rope because that requires two skills instead of one and overall you get more favor without the risk of making a low ql cordage rope. You have an entire category of alchemy items to sac for "double" favor yet a few select crops are the only items anyone uses due to the ease of availability. At 90 farming you get a minimum of 6 crops per harvest if you don't rake the field at all. That's 6000 favor for a 10x10 farm area, or 5900 if you replant it, every couple of days with less time invested than mining and making locks or farming and then creating strings of cloth and then creating squares of cloth or the entire mess of a process of making yoyos. Crops also always come out at maximum quality, assuming you don't harvest them early, and require no tools at any point during the process besides a shovel of any quality to turn grass or mycellium to dirt. Every other saccable requires at least one tool to create and the quality varies depending on the quality of the tools involved as well as skill.

 

If a Magranon priest sacs a door lock they get twice as much(2x) favor as any other priest receives from that item.

If a Vynora priest sacs a yoyo they get twice as much(2x) favor as any other priest receives from that item.

If a Fo priest sacs a square piece of cloth they get twice as much(2x) favor as any other priest receives from that item.

If a Libila priest sacs an onion or wemp or other alchemy item they get one thousand(1000x) more favor than any other priest receives from that item.

 

A vynora priest saccing one 97.37ql onion

[15:16:35] Favor increased by 0.0100 to 35.794

 

[Gavin 971]

I think a better alternative would be to buff locks and ropes so WL has a similarly easy time to gain favor and also give Libila priests the ability to farm. I strongly believe that with all the changes to priests since the religion fix it's unecesarrily hard now even using crazy priest accounts.

[MrGARY 12,421]

I'm just here to point out that the argument that BL priests need an alt is silly.

 

Vyn needs yoyos.  This requires:  Hatchet, spindle, rake, carving knife.  You can't grind cloth tailoring, carpentry, or toy making as a priest to make these, so you have to grind it before priesting, or use an alt.

Fo needs squares of cloth.  This requires:  rake, spindle, loom.  You can't grind cloth tailoring as a priest to make these, so you have to grind it before priesting or use an alt.

Mag needs door locks.  This requires:  forge, pickaxe, small anvil.  You can grind this as a priest, so have fun.

 

Everyone can't do everything themselves.  Whether it's having a friend make you good tools, or buying them, you still can't make them and maintain them yourself.  You also can't make the stuff yourself without the skill

 

Is farming stuff too easy?  Then either give Lib door locks, or make door locks, squares, and yoyos easier (might require strings too to be easier) to make so you can get a higher consistent average.

Edited September 21, 2014 by MrGARY

[Hogwash 177]

balance doesn't mean give everyone equal access to everything. when you join BL or WL specifically you are dealt different hands, but play the same game (for WL the game is territory control, for BL the game is survival. eachgiven tools to make both easier for good  reason/this creates rivals and roles for the players). youre given different tools but none of them are supposed to be so powerful that nothing can negate its effects. you're all looking at small microscopic aspects of pvp and wurm and asking for immediate counters or balance, take a step back and look at the big picture and you'll see there is a need for differences between kingdoms and their surrounding mythologies and diminishing them harms the game. This is still a role playing game, with roles to fulfil. when we overextend our roles or merging abilities the balance of the entire game is thrown off. a lot of recent changes have been made which do exactly this, give players abilities outside of their intended roles which is dictated by the game lore and is designed to allow the players to immerse themselves in the game world through their character. ignoring this and wanting everything stomps all over the intentions of chaos and makes it really hard to find a balance when you ignore the origins or baseline. equal balance makes different roles impossible,.

Edited September 21, 2014 by Hogwash

[MrGARY 12,421]

and wanting everything stomps all over the intentions of chaos

 

This affects Epic too, where BL actually knows what spells are.  Thanks

[Hogwash 177]

once again focusing on the smallest aspect of something to make a sideshow and ignoring the real problems just to take a quick jab. you're not helping. what i meant to say when i said chaos was "wurm pvp" 

Edited September 21, 2014 by Hogwash

[BrQQQ 2,854]

Lib not being able to farm their own items isn't really an excuse to have each veggie give a really high amount of favor. I think either the item should change to something makes more sense, or it should just about halve the favor gain from it.

People can easily get thousands of crops within a reasonable time and effort for you.

Most of the priests have painful downsides to their saccing items, not just Lib. Only Mag generally has a pretty easy time getting their iron and making the locks.

[Oreo 5,793]

All BL's reaction

 

> MUH CROPS

 

but srsly, 6-7 90ql crops = full favor bar, kinda ridiculous

there are better things to do than farming, but im no cop

dont ask me what

Edited September 21, 2014 by Oreo

[Nicrolis 980]

I can mine an average of 75ql ore with an 80ql pick. With woa and such i can do about 5k ore in a day. With locksmithing at 50 I had about a 93% chance with a 85ql small anvil. In a perfect world thats around 8k locks from all the ore... I did 1k locks in about half a day.

 

I make locks for mag priests over on deli, Odynn in particular, and they come out pretty high average ql. Recently I have had a mag priest reinforcing walls for me. 800 locks did ~89 walls. that 6230(-how ever much was gained from afk) favor made by just 800 locks. Average favor per lock for that is 3.89375, or 7.7875 favor for mags.

 

I did all of this in 2 days, crops dont usually grow that fast. Just imagine if i was 90 in mining, and 90 in locksmithing.

 

Edit: all of the locks were UNDER 71ql from the ore i used.

Edited September 21, 2014 by Nicrolis

[Zekezor 3,188]

All BL's reaction

 

> MUH CROPS

 

but srsly, 6-7 90ql crops = full favor bar, kinda ridiculous

there are better things to do than farming, but im no cop

dont ask me what

I need 10 for a full bar... :|

95+ql...

 

And from experience of other priests I can say the following:

Yoyo = biggest PITA

Square piece of cloth = ezy pzy mode

Locks = ezy pzy mode

Alchemy crops = ezy pzy mode extreme edition... but completely unobtainable without trading.

 

 

Lets put it this way.

 

Would everyone be in favor if mag all of a sudden sacced weapons at great gains?

Fo saccing cloth armour?

Vyn saccing... oh i dont know... Jewelry?

 

Or would you guys CRY OUT IN THE MASSES over not being able to sac things that you are able to make at all?

Edited September 21, 2014 by Zekezor

[Judicator 539]

Mag, Fo and Lib are very easy to get favor on honestly. The one who get screwed really is Vynora. Yoyo's are the most complicated to make at high ql, comparatively.

Edited September 21, 2014 by Judicator

[Nicrolis 980]

Mag, Fo and Lib are very easy to get favor on honestly. The one who get screwed really is Vynora. Yoyo's are the most complicated to make at high ql, comparatively.

I agree here. if anything vyn needs a boost.

[amberain80 290]

Mag, Fo and Lib are very easy to get favor on honestly. The one who get screwed really is Vynora. Yoyo's are the most complicated to make at high ql, comparatively.

Yes, and no. Because everybody else has this thing where, the locks or squares or whatever ropes that you are making come out at totally varied quality. even with high skill. One of the big issues with farming as a source for saccing mats is that no matter what you do every single crop comes out top ql. So even though locks might be easy to do yo have to make way way more to get the same amount of favor out of them. 

The other issue with onions that i can see is this. One lock weighs .6kg, so if you carry 10 locks you are already at 6kgs in your inventory. If you carry a backpack full (100) now you have an extra 60kgs of stuff, most ppl try to be as light as possible when going for pvp or whatever. But lib... one onion weighs .05 if i remember so to get to the same 100 onions weighs 5kgs instead of 60. and to get to 60kgs you can carry over 1000 onions. which is part of why it is so easy for lib priests to carry some hot ore drop an altar and have tons and tons of saccing mats on them to stay and cast whatever they want in a raid or pvp situation. We have all seen it happen.

[Kagrenac 812]

The other issue with onions that i can see is this. One lock weighs .6kg, so if you carry 10 locks you are already at 6kgs in your inventory. If you carry a backpack full (100) now you have an extra 60kgs of stuff, most ppl try to be as light as possible when going for pvp or whatever. But lib... one onion weighs .05 if i remember so to get to the same 100 onions weighs 5kgs instead of 60. and to get to 60kgs you can carry over 1000 onions. which is part of why it is so easy for lib priests to carry some hot ore drop an altar and have tons and tons of saccing mats on them to stay and cast whatever they want in a raid or pvp situation. We have all seen it happen.

Except weight really doesn't matter at all if you are bringing stuff to sac in a raid, and things called gems exist.

(only time I have really heard of/seen saccing in a raid was the whole nilfheim thing, which used door locks)

[Zekezor 3,188]

which is part of why it is so easy for lib priests to carry some hot ore drop an altar and have tons and tons of saccing mats on them to stay and cast whatever they want in a raid or pvp situation. We have all seen it happen.

 

Yea we just "randomly" brought an altar and randomly placed it during a raid, BL had no preparation at all.

 

OH WAIT

 

 

When your enemy brings 60k dirt, 2 knarrs and 3 karavells.... Your least concern is the weight of the saccing materials.

Edited September 21, 2014 by Zekezor

[Judicator 539]

Yea weight of saccing materials matters no nobody.

[amberain80 290]

weird, i saw them do it out front of nathans deed and it made a difference there. So yeah, it does matter, when you will never run out of favor and we will because of weight.

[KanePT 699]

I'm just here to point out that the argument that BL priests need an alt is silly.

 

Vyn needs yoyos.  This requires:  Hatchet, spindle, rake, carving knife.  You can't grind cloth tailoring, carpentry, or toy making as a priest to make these, so you have to grind it before priesting, or use an alt.

Fo needs squares of cloth.  This requires:  rake, spindle, loom.  You can't grind cloth tailoring as a priest to make these, so you have to grind it before priesting or use an alt.

Mag needs door locks.  This requires:  forge, pickaxe, small anvil.  You can grind this as a priest, so have fun.

 

Everyone can't do everything themselves.  Whether it's having a friend make you good tools, or buying them, you still can't make them and maintain them yourself.  You also can't make the stuff yourself without the skill

 

Is farming stuff too easy?  Then either give Lib door locks, or make door locks, squares, and yoyos easier (might require strings too to be easier) to make so you can get a higher consistent average.

You CAN grind those as a priest, problem is you can only grind those through basic stuff (making strings and square pieces for tailor, making shafts/planks for carp, making yoyos for toymaking). Of course these actions give almost no skill at all, so yeah it takes twice as long as with a normal char that can imp items.

But yeah mag is by far the easiest one in that list.

 

I need 10 for a full bar... :|

95+ql...

 

And from experience of other priests I can say the following:

Yoyo = biggest PITA

Square piece of cloth = ezy pzy mode

Locks = ezy pzy mode

Alchemy crops = ezy pzy mode extreme edition... but completely unobtainable without trading.

 

 

Lets put it this way.

 

Would everyone be in favor if mag all of a sudden sacced weapons at great gains?

Fo saccing cloth armour?

Vyn saccing... oh i dont know... Jewelry?

 

Or would you guys CRY OUT IN THE MASSES over not being able to sac things that you are able to make at all?

Actually some people sacc jewlery. Since they have high prices you can sacc something like a gold statuette and gain a whalop of favor. I'm all in if they double favor from those, i'm guessing 1 ql 20 statuette would put me at full favor.

 

Mag, Fo and Lib are very easy to get favor on honestly. The one who get screwed really is Vynora. Yoyo's are the most complicated to make at high ql, comparatively.

That's why i use cordage or sometimes locks.

Edited September 21, 2014 by KanePT

[Hogwash 177]

leave the favor items alone, and increas value to statuettes of gods? theres an idea

Edited September 21, 2014 by Hogwash

[Kagrenac 812]

weird, i saw them do it out front of nathans deed and it made a difference there. So yeah, it does matter, when you will never run out of favor and we will because of weight.

Because weight matters when you have boats.

[Enzius 485]

weird, i saw them do it out front of nathans deed and it made a difference there. So yeah, it does matter, when you will never run out of favor and we will because of weight.

Edited September 22, 2014 by Enzius

[Propheteer 7,139]

ive come to the conclusion that 9/10 people in this thread have no idea what they are talking about