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Rolf

Spell tweak feedback changes

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It could be a cotton seed thats saved, but a glimmer swords lost.Or the other way around.

Mathematically speaking, the expectation of the value of lost goods is the same regardless. You have a 50% chance to lose the glimmer sword either way.

What this does is makes it so you're likely to have some stuff saved and the enemy is likely to get some loot.

Hell, I'll argue that this change would make PvP less frustrating over all. Everything will feel more consistent

+1

Edited by Enzius
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Rolf, Did any of the bugs with the test server get fixed?


 


Single target spells not working at all.


 


The armor buff/debuff to archery working by giving a "bonus" to difficulty or penalty to it, meaning not wearing armor just makes your shots harder. (may also be the case for spells, no way to tell)


 


The whole "your armor interupts you" thing that was not mentioned at all and is incredibly annoying. It really doesn't do anything but make archery even worse, especially since you get it in chain.


 


Smite being autoresisted by players.


 


Tentacles doing 30 damage and ignoring armor.


 


Assuming the resistance fix refers to pillars, but pillars really should not do ~18 damage over their duration through plate.(~50-60 base damage)


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personally i think since priests cant craft and are faithful to their gods they should all get a res stone effect

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Thanks again Rolf for the continued work in balancing the combat system.

Big -1 to the res stone for every god. Res stones are already annoying as is and should not be something everyone gets for free. The main thing that I love about this game is that it has a full loot system. Giving all of the priests a free res stone just takes away from not only the basis of this game but also takes away from pvp. People use alts to suicide their gear from towns that are being raided. They also do suicide runs on chaos to kill other players and/or their horses and grab the bodies with gear and use the mag stone to keep all of the looted gear when they die. With in two weeks of me joining chaos I watched it happen twice. It is not only demoralizing but also takes away from the fights. Res stone should be something that a player has to invest into in order to have a small change to keep their gear, not a grantee that askes to be abused.

BTW +1 to the idea of a chance for each item

As for adding locate soul I like seeing it on all gods. As I said before it's become a requirement to pvp. Seeing how all gods are pvp oriented then might as well add it to all of them. +1

I don't mind seeing lock picking being added for all gods. Although it's strange now that some can lock pick but not bash.

There still needs to be a spell to allow fo to move trees so that the player can dig. Like make a new spell that fo can cast that allows them to pick up the tree and places it in their inventory, recast on the tree item to place it back down. Or a spell that turns the tree back into a sprout that goes into the players inventory.

Mag/Lib need to be able to place mine doors.

Edited by blayze

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Mathematically speaking, the expectation of the value of lost goods is the same regardless. You have a 50% chance to lose the glimmer sword either way.

What this does is makes it so you're likely to have some stuff saved and the enemy is likely to get some loot.

Hell, I'll argue that this change would make PvP less frustrating over all. Everything will feel more consistent

+1

And that is why I like this idea! Come on cotton seeds! Papa needs to keep you beauties!

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So now basic rule of thumb when buying resstone would be "is 50% of your inventory worth more than 5s?" rather than "is your whole inventory worth more than 5s?"

I like the idea.

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-1 to locates for all, you're removing THE ONE thing VYNORA really has goin for her!

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I think res stones should be a 50% roll on a per item basis anyway, regardless of what Mag priest can and can't do. With the current way restones work you can just buy some stones, keep all valuables on an alt, kill it a few times until its resstone works and then logout without respawning, thus allowing you to prevent any type of item (including artifacts) from being looted by enemies while your deed is being raided and you are refusing to defend it (or you are defending it but not on said alt). Changing stones to a per-item roll would not make it impossible to still do that but it would make it much, much, much more expensive and time consuming.

I don't think this is a relevant discussion for this topic however, it is more of a suggestion thing which should probably go to the suggestions forum.

For all players who think Lib has more powerful enchants than Mag: No.

Rotting touch - damages your weapon faster, increases wep damage by 20%(100power), adds an infection effect (infections are weak and useless)

Flaming aura - adds 30% damage (100power) in a separate wound (and you want to inflict as many wounds as possible due to healing AoE's), no further wep penalties

Bloodthirst - adds 30% to weapon damage (at 9999 power), but getting 9999 power requires like 300+ kills with said weapon. I have never ever seen a weapon go above 1.2k (without grinding on alts) before the owner lost it.

Web armor - have never really tested this myself, but slows whoever hits you down a lot, and from what I heard it might slow their swing timer. Don't quote me on this though.

Aura of shared pain - Reflects like 30% damage back to your enemy at 100 power, which slows them down a bit due to hurting status.

Now, to me it is obvious FA is way better than RT or bloodthirst for your weapon (assuming you are going for a PvP weapon) considering you need only half the amount of hits to counter an AoE healing spell(do people even use spells on chaos? protip: they change fights). WA vs AoSP is negotiable and depends on the situation imo, but on average I'd say AosP because you will inflict a decent amount of small wounds to your enemies which, yet again, counters AoE healing spells.

The issue here is not Lib having more powerful enchants than Mag like someone claimed, it is Mag's enchants being redundant because Vynora has the same ones (FA=FB) and more + has a better set of offensive spells making Magranon effectively redundant.

The direction I would like priests to go in is Lib priests being some predator type, which WL priests can counter provided they work together (increasing the need for diversity on the WL side). Stuff like a Mag buff that would counter x drain health casts for up to y minutes, maybe a damage link for Mag which they can cast on an ally and as long as they are within x tiles all damage that ally receives gets split between the Mag and said ally (would complement tank / healer combinations). Make Fo's Ward have zombies unlead, stop combat, and run x amount of tiles away from the center of the ward cast, just to name a few (obviously not balanced) examples.

Changes like these are way more effort in comparison to the "simple" balance tweaks that Rolf is trying out now, and I consider it unlikely that he will actually add new spells. Still though, without changing behaviour of at least a few spells the current spell set is not diverse enough to have proper balance between gods without having all spells turn out roughly the same because "if that god deals 2DPS with a spell then ours should too".

Why did I even type all this oh god pointless discussions everywhere

just fix it so that res stones don't work with artifacts lol,  your trying to drag this whole topic off track.   Honestly, my own opion is that if someone is killed with an artifact, it drops, res stone or no.    I don't understand why your using that exploit with getting the artifacts to safety as a piggyback for a discussion that died a long time ago.  I for one wouldn't want half-drake sets, or only part of a set or armor, etc and that was discussed over and over again way back when the loot discussions came around. If loot roll per item should work, it should drop in sets, like Shield+Weapons, or Armor sets, misc items, etc.    Also, If I recall there were issues with the testing being done at the time. Not sure if that has been solved yet.   

 

Also, the main advantage to BL isn't enchants but offensive spells, and RT does do wonders, and was very popular until people started using LT weapons on a large scale.  It does worry me though that BL's available weapon enchants are not effective at countering LT, though that is just theoretical.  The reality is on Chaos the Blacklighter kingdoms have ready access to supplies from freedom, and we almost always saw LT weapons in their hands, I'm actually using one of the LT swords we looted from the BL a while back.  

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-1 to locates for all, you're removing THE ONE thing VYNORA really has goin for her!

cause having 2 pillars+an aoe with a stun chance and good buff spells totally makes all priests having locate make vyn useless.

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just fix it so that res stones don't work with artifacts lol,  your trying to drag this whole topic off track.   Honestly, my own opion is that if someone is killed with an artifact, it drops, res stone or no.    I don't understand why your using that exploit with getting the artifacts to safety as a piggyback for a discussion that died a long time ago.  I for one wouldn't want half-drake sets, or only part of a set or armor, etc and that was discussed over and over again way back when the loot discussions came around. If loot roll per item should work, it should drop in sets, like Shield+Weapons, or Armor sets, misc items, etc.    Also, If I recall there were issues with the testing being done at the time. Not sure if that has been solved yet.   

 

Also, the main advantage to BL isn't enchants but offensive spells, and RT does do wonders, and was very popular until people started using LT weapons on a large scale.  It does worry me though that BL's available weapon enchants are not effective at countering LT, though that is just theoretical.  The reality is on Chaos the Blacklighter kingdoms have ready access to supplies from freedom, and we almost always saw LT weapons in their hands, I'm actually using one of the LT swords we looted from the BL a while back.  

 

He hasn't drug the topic off track, he was replying to the people that were, also...  RT is terrible, stop fooling yourself if you aren't proactive enough in PvP or testing to know the difference between weapon enchants.

 

You pretty much just said "RT does wonders, but LT is better in every way. In fact, BL enchants were so good that they were used until people realized it was bad. I picked up an LT sword off a BLer a while ago and im using it now"

 

Thats like saying "oh yeah cigarettes used to be super healthy for you until it wasnt"

 

Are you broken mate?

 

 

 

 

 

Reminds me of RT doing wonders despite FA/FB doing more damage and countering heals.

Edited by Propheteer
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Why do all the BL gud want lib to have everything the other faiths have? What's even the point of having different priests?

The point of the different priests is so that there is a wide VARIETY, yes variety of spells. If Rolf makes every priest more or less the same because some fraction of the player base wants easy mode he may as well just juggernaut one priest and remove the others.

Please Rolf DO NOT listen to these guys and their constant whining about them not having everything whilst having their own unique abilities.

What r u talking about? All of BL? I cant give a about the mag res stone effect and other stuff and am actually happy with what we have in BL.

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Chaos Bl, my bad. The epic ones actually know what they're doing lol.


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Redd don't confuse BL on chaos with BL on epic. we are completely unrelated.


edit: and ofc ya post seconds prior to mine lol.


Edited by Zekezor
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BL = black legion. Black light really shouldn't be used with the advent of pmks etc, since apparently it's confusing :P

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good changes around the board but Fo will be the best priest soon since they don't Have to use armour meaning no archery or spell debuf.


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Forest giant strength and hell strength is really never used so I propose the following.

Change forest giants strength (fo) and hell strength (lib) to the following formula and take off the 40 body strength cap on the person being casting on.

Added bonus = ((100-body strength)÷25)^2

As of now the spell is never used due to the 40 body strength cap and short duration. This change would still provide a great bonus for newer players and something small for the older ones.

20 body strength = +10.2 (30.2 total)

30 body strength = +7.8 (37.8 total)

40 body strength = +5.8 (45.8 total)

50 body strength = +4 (54 total)

60 body strength = +2.5 (62.5 total)

70 body strength = +1.4 (71.4 total)

Option two would be

Added bonus = ((100-body strength)÷20)^2

20 body strength = +16 (36 total)

30 body strength = +12.25 (42.25 total)

40 body strength = +9 (49 total)

50 body strength = +6.2 (56.2 total)

60 body strength = +4 (64 total)

70 body strength = +2.2 (72.2 total)

Change the spell duration timer from a max of 3 mins to a max of 20 mins. (20 mins at 100 cast power, difficulty of the spell will make the average lower)

Change both timers to 10 seconds.

Change the cooldown from 30 seconds to 60 seconds. (Prevents spam casting)

Change the difficulty to 45 or 55.

Edited by blayze
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He hasn't drug the topic off track, he was replying to the people that were, also...  RT is terrible, stop fooling yourself if you aren't proactive enough in PvP or testing to know the difference between weapon enchants.

 

You pretty much just said "RT does wonders, but LT is better in every way. In fact, BL enchants were so good that they were used until people realized it was bad. I picked up an LT sword off a BLer a while ago and im using it now"

 

Thats like saying "oh yeah cigarettes used to be super healthy for you until it wasnt"

 

Are you broken mate?

 

 

 

 

 

Reminds me of RT doing wonders despite FA/FB doing more damage and countering heals.

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1.4 body strength?  3 to 20 min? who on earth would cast that? lol


even with a 1h timer im not sure its worth it...


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1.4 body strength? 3 to 20 min? who on earth would cast that? lol

even with a 1h timer im not sure its worth it...

Edited by blayze

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Allright,

 

we've made the following changes to the test server based on the feedback from the previous thread:

 

You can lead horses while mounted/on a vehicle again just like before. However, if you are attacked by a player while leading more than 1 horse you will receive a hefty (-10) penalty to Combat Rating.

All priests can now do lockpicking.

All priests can now do taming but only corrupt animals as Libila and non-corrupt for the other deities.

All priests can now cast locate player.

A bug where resistance was too high initially was fixed.

 

Good luck testing!

 

Rolf

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You can lead horses while mounted/on a vehicle again just like before. However, if you are attacked by a player while leading more than 1 horse you will receive a hefty (-10) penalty to Combat Rating.

All priests can now do lockpicking.

All priests can now do taming but only corrupt animals as Libila and non-corrupt for the other deities.

All priests can now cast locate player.

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Maybe you should add nolocate to all priests as well.


I really don't like the locate spells on all priests. I actually don't like the spell at all, it should be removed entirely.


If anything it should've just been added onto Lib priests.

Edited by Kswords

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I'd think maybe just Mag and Lib for lockpicking.  Does this mean followers will no longer get the massive 5 alignment penalty whenever rng feels like it?

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I think res stones should be a 50% roll on a per item basis anyway, regardless of what Mag priest can and can't do. With the current way restones work you can just buy some stones, keep all valuables on an alt, kill it a few times until its resstone works and then logout without respawning, thus allowing you to prevent any type of item (including artifacts) from being looted by enemies while your deed is being raided and you are refusing to defend it (or you are defending it but not on said alt). Changing stones to a per-item roll would not make it impossible to still do that but it would make it much, much, much more expensive and time consuming.

I don't think this is a relevant discussion for this topic however, it is more of a suggestion thing which should probably go to the suggestions forum.

For all players who think Lib has more powerful enchants than Mag: No.

Rotting touch - damages your weapon faster, increases wep damage by 20%(100power), adds an infection effect (infections are weak and useless)

Flaming aura - adds 30% damage (100power) in a separate wound (and you want to inflict as many wounds as possible due to healing AoE's), no further wep penalties

Bloodthirst - adds 30% to weapon damage (at 9999 power), but getting 9999 power requires like 300+ kills with said weapon. I have never ever seen a weapon go above 1.2k (without grinding on alts) before the owner lost it.

Web armor - have never really tested this myself, but slows whoever hits you down a lot, and from what I heard it might slow their swing timer. Don't quote me on this though.

Aura of shared pain - Reflects like 30% damage back to your enemy at 100 power, which slows them down a bit due to hurting status.

Now, to me it is obvious FA is way better than RT or bloodthirst for your weapon (assuming you are going for a PvP weapon) considering you need only half the amount of hits to counter an AoE healing spell(do people even use spells on chaos? protip: they change fights). WA vs AoSP is negotiable and depends on the situation imo, but on average I'd say AosP because you will inflict a decent amount of small wounds to your enemies which, yet again, counters AoE healing spells.

The issue here is not Lib having more powerful enchants than Mag like someone claimed, it is Mag's enchants being redundant because Vynora has the same ones (FA=FB) and more + has a better set of offensive spells making Magranon effectively redundant.

The direction I would like priests to go in is Lib priests being some predator type, which WL priests can counter provided they work together (increasing the need for diversity on the WL side). Stuff like a Mag buff that would counter x drain health casts for up to y minutes, maybe a damage link for Mag which they can cast on an ally and as long as they are within x tiles all damage that ally receives gets split between the Mag and said ally (would complement tank / healer combinations). Make Fo's Ward have zombies unlead, stop combat, and run x amount of tiles away from the center of the ward cast, just to name a few (obviously not balanced) examples.

Changes like these are way more effort in comparison to the "simple" balance tweaks that Rolf is trying out now, and I consider it unlikely that he will actually add new spells. Still though, without changing behaviour of at least a few spells the current spell set is not diverse enough to have proper balance between gods without having all spells turn out roughly the same because "if that god deals 2DPS with a spell then ours should too".

Why did I even type all this oh god pointless discussions everywhere

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That must be why i see so many pvpers using FA on their swords. NOT....

You barely ever see it tbh.

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