Balance res Stones and the free res stone effect

[Klaa 4,872]

Everyone else puts in the effort to get 70 faith, so you can hardly bring that into the equation.

 

Everyone can easily have 40 favor stored in a gem, gem's which can be obtained through mining, no need to purchase them and any cost you put on that is your own choice.

 

Res Stones can ONLY be purchased, they cannot be obtained by any other ingame means unless you are a mag priest.

I can because thats the cost, upkeep, and trade off of the ability in terms of both money and time. A res stone just costs a player a mere 5s from any trader including public traders at every starter deed. Even less sometimes from other players.

EDIT: Heck I even sell the things off and on.

Edited August 11, 2014 by Klaa

[Battlepaw 585]

This isn't about our population size or BL at all, this is about having balance in combat.

 

I'm trying to discuss with you as best as I can, I know the thread has degenerated quite a bit and we're all snapping at each other but I did make some fairly reasonable suggestions earlier in the thread.

 

It's degenerated because this isn't a request Daolin, its a demand.   If you were making a reasonable suggestion, you would have argued both sides of the argument, and put up alternatives, Much less put up a rather cryptic poll in a public area that would have many passers by looking it it like "Hey I'm not a priest... and I want a free res stone".   That completely invalidates the whole poll to begin with. 

[Daolin 894]

I can because thats the cost, upkeep, and trade off of the ability in terms of both money and time. A res stone just costs a player a mere 5s from any trader including public traders at every starter deed. Even less sometimes from other players.

EDIT: Heck I even sell the things off and on.

[Kagrenac 812]

Added poll which should clear up any confusion of the intentions of the original post.

[Klaa 4,872]

70 Faith: If all priests have the ability then all priests will be putting in the same effort.

Gems: You can mine them, Fo/Vyn should get the mining ability to make this fair, but there is no cost in this that requires money as they are obtainable ingame for all (Fo/Vyn need to be able to mine or have another way to source gems)

Time: Everyone puts time into their priest characters, this cost would be paid by everyone, again everyone has the option to put the time in or not, but only Mag priests get the benefit of a res stone for it.

It only costing 5s for a res stone:  This is per death, 5s for every single death.  10 Blacklight players die, it's cost them 50 silver, if 10 Mag priests die and none have bought a res stone to stack the bonus, they get the same chance as a normal res stone to keep their gear and the total cost is 0 in actual currency.

 

I understand kingdom bias will prevent a completely productive conversation on this, but the us vs them thing is not necessary, the feature needs looked at for the sake of balance and that is why this was suggested.  

 

If the dev's agree then they will take action, if they do not then they will not.

Edited August 11, 2014 by Klaa

[Daolin 894]

Five paltry silver that nobody should need to pay, if one doesn't need to pay for it, none should.

[Danny 52]

Exactly, there's additional cost and time for the Mag priest ability. You're even including the mining skill, which I had neglected to. Thanks... Also Libila can Mine too.

Other players agree as well at least not in word but by action, thats why they buy the res stones instead of training up such a priest. Otherwise we'd be up to our eyebrows in Mag priests. One of the main flags for something being overpowered is when everyone and their dog is doing it.

Not even Mol Rehan, the most Mag-centric kingdom to the point where Rolf eventually hard-coded Mag to favor them is that awash in Mag priests.

Five paltry silver.

[Klaa 4,872]

What part of "everyone pays for it" do you not get? The only difference is the price in both money and time spent.

The only way it would be free is if someone GAVE you the character or stone, and even then it cost the person who skilled it up.

 

Personally the stone is already cheaper. Rolf could probably quadruple the price and people would still pay (never, ever, ever tell him this).

[Daolin 894]

What part of "everyone pays for it" do you not get? The only difference is the price in both money and time spent.

[khatanka 317]

All priest has good and bad parts. Its not good to say, thats or that or that is OP. Then we can make a priest for all, but need we that?

 

Stop crying and play your part of the game or change kingdom and have fun!

 

[BrQQQ 2,854]

With that logic, can I, as Fo priest, complain that I don't get an ability similar to buying res stones for free? How is it fair that Lib and Mag can collapse caves for free, but other priests have to pay 5s per tile to get the same thing done?

You could say 'convert Mag', but that's like saying "lose several months of progress", and I think we already determined that converting to get something isn't always the most convenient thing.

I think that the answer is pretty simple. When I went Fo, I chose for Fo benefits and sacrificed Mag, Vyn and Lib's benefits. If I really wanted the free res stone and the ability to collapse walls, I should've chosen Magranon instead. I can't get the good parts of Fo and the good parts of Magranon together.

In the same way, you chose for a BL PMK and sacrificed the WL advantages. That's why this "You guys get something that we can't get for free" argument isn't very good.

[Daolin 894]

With that logic, can I, as Fo priest, complain that I don't get an ability similar to buying res stones for free? How is it fair that Lib and Mag can collapse caves for free, but other priests have to pay 5s per tile to get the same thing done?

You could say 'convert Mag', but that's like saying "lose several months of progress", and I think we already determined that converting to get something isn't always the most convenient thing.

I think that the answer is pretty simple. When I went Fo, I chose for Fo benefits and sacrificed Mag, Vyn and Lib's benefits. If I really wanted the free res stone and the ability to collapse walls, I should've chosen Magranon instead. I can't get the good parts of Fo and the good parts of Magranon together.

In the same way, you chose for a BL PMK and sacrificed the WL advantages. That's why this "You guys get something that we can't get for free" argument isn't very good.

[khatanka 317]

So all priests should get the ability or it should be removed.

[Klaa 4,872]

Still I argue priest abilities are not free, players still end up paying. Furthermore if all I wanted was the chance to keep gear, Id buy a res stone instead of creating a mag priest... everytime. In fact I dont own a mag priest atm; though, I have used them in the past.

 

At any rate, aye Fo and Vynora can do many useful things that Mag and even Libila cannot, even if they are not pvp-centric Personally Im running a Fo priest atm; although, if some god became more thievery-specialized/useful I may look at that.

 

However, even players on pvp servers are not all about the pvp itself, Fo and Vyn still have a place. Even if they are not frontline fighters persay.

 

Wurm is more about the logistics, because there will always be losses to recoup.

[Daolin 894]

I understand your point of view, really I do - the whole system does need a rework.

 

I don't think we're gonna agree either way on the res effect/stone issue, i'm of the mind set that it needs changed and you disagree as you feel it is balanced.  

 

Thank you for the input, it gives both sides a chance to voice their sides on the issue and hopefully the devs will look through the posts and make their own decisions, hopefully ultimately ending in a complete rework of the priest system.

[demondan 1,865]

Little by little, BL priests are becoming more OP.

Also mag res is not 50%.

Edited August 11, 2014 by demondan

[Daolin 894]

Also mag res is not 50%.

[RomaN 890]

Pretty sure most mag priests on Chaos still use a res stone especially if they're wearing drake/scale.

The extra res bonus for mag priests is just one of the perks available to that religion to balance out their advantages/disadvantages.

-1

[demondan 1,865]

You are taking away a unique feature from the Magranon priest tree. Do you have no shame ?

[hemrzz 1,278]

I am a mag priest......

 

and i dont think i leave the deed without having equipped "Purchased" a res stone.. i think most people who pvp even if mag or not will purchase the res stone...

 

there is no money saving really for WLers.

 

just last week one of our mags dropped full drake and moon metals gear..... Mag bonus and Res stone. soooooooooo

[Daolin 894]

I am a mag priest......

 

and i dont think i leave the deed without having equipped "Purchased" a res stone.. i think most people who pvp even if mag or not will purchase the res stone...

 

there is no money saving really for WLers.

 

just last week one of our mags dropped full drake and moon metals gear..... Mag bonus and Res stone. soooooooooo

 

Well of course you do, anyone in their right mind would equip a res stone when they already have a free one active, double the chance to keep your items on death.

 

The point is even if you didn't buy a res stone, you would have the same chance to keep your items as someone non-mag with one active.

Edited August 12, 2014 by Daolin

[Radni 1,089]

This is stupid, why are we arguing over an idea that will never happen?

Continue to buff Libila an already pvp OP priest compared to the others.

If BL was smart they'd not bring light on Libila and her OP battle spells, because eventually WL will be buffed, an until then Libila won't get changed.

-1

[Danny 52]

I am a mag priest......

 

and i dont think i leave the deed without having equipped "Purchased" a res stone.. i think most people who pvp even if mag or not will purchase the res stone...

 

there is no money saving really for WLers.

 

just last week one of our mags dropped full drake and moon metals gear..... Mag bonus and Res stone. soooooooooo

This is exactly the problem we are explaining, you talk as though this shouldn't have happened, as though its unfair.

[Hogwash 177]

the "perceived imbalance" will be addressed, i have faith.

[Battlepaw 585]

Well of course you do, anyone in their right mind would equip a res stone when they already have a free one active, double the chance to keep your items on death.

 

The point is even if you didn't buy a res stone, you would have the same chance to keep your items as someone non-mag with one active.