Enclosures Gone...Perimeters Not

[Vroomfondel 1,128]

A highway by definition is 2 tiles paved and sand on either side.  That's 4 tiles, so keeping the current minimum 5 tiles is really needed, else you guys are going to block others from passing by.  But then it seems that's what some of you want to do.

[HughMongus 617]

Thank you for joining in Vroomfonel.

 

Currently a highway is two tiles or more wide

... or a 1 tile with sand on both sides.

 

The reason some two wides have sand is to make mobs more visible, especially at night, as there are mobs who can hide in the long grasses of the Autumn season.

 

Food for thought!

Cheers! Hughmongus

[Ohana 907]

Personally(as a player and multiple deed owner. I love the idea of a easement of 1 tile, then the option to buy perimeter tiles as opposed to the 5 free we have now. Or a easement of one and 4 free tiles with the option to reduce or buy more perimeter depending on what you need.

Vroom there is a monthly upkeep on perimeter that you purchase. I have a deed with perimeter of 12, my 5 free and 7 more. It is less then deed cost, but it does cost you monthly to keep a bigger perimeter.

[enoofu 206]

I don't think under 5 perimeter would work since terrain isn't flat, especially for newbies traveling with poor climbing skills, or anyone pulling a cart

[ScarfaceRo 79]

+1 for reducing minimum perimeter to one or two tiles only (yeah I loved the example with properties on both sides if a highway).

-1 for anything else giving more rights over perimeter and people wanting to treat perimeter as deed - that area is just a buffer (free perimeter) or reserved land for future expansions (paid perimeter)

[Judicator 539]

Perimeter is critical in leaving space between deeds. People would get trapped on their deed without it.

[validate 598]

i think encloser rules should stay for perimeters.  i have one huge deed with 40 perimeter.  i dont have enclosers on. but one day might. although i plan to save up the 3 gold i think i need to expand 35 more tiles instead.  but i think for those who may have larger perimeters should be allowed to use it with encloser rule. as they are the only ones who can build homes on it.  but i guess grifers could put fences all over it.  so hmm  i guess i dont care really. we who own perimeters could just build 1x20 tiles buildings as walls around it .

 

i'm ill this weekend and very tied i dont think i made any sence. off to bed. i'll try to edit my post tomorrow

[As_I_Decay 1,592]

Just to clear a few things up.

 

1.  You pay for extra perimeter, but you do not pay any monthly rent after that for those tiles.

 

Wrong. I pay 10s extra per month in upkeep for my 40 (of 45) perim tiles.

(My size 35 deed would have only run me about 10s a month in upkeep had I not purchased the additional perimeter.)

Edited April 28, 2014 by As_I_Decay

[Audrel 2,223]

Just fence the damn thing and plant potatoes. I mean, if somebody takes the time to put down a low stone wall just to steal some potatoes, hes got to be needing those potatoes way more than you do

 

50 QL stone walls off deed. Have fun getting those taters.

Edited April 28, 2014 by Audrel

[Biervampyr 97]

50 QL stone walls off deed. Have fun getting those taters.

A Wagon+crate+many rockshards+catapult and some skill=easy to get it down :-/ thats the propblem :-(

[Audrel 2,223]

A Wagon+crate+many rockshards+catapult and some skill=easy to get it down :-/ thats the propblem :-(

 

By that time you can lead a circus train past then duck into your gate leaving who there to fight it off?

[Ayes 3,715]

Just to clear a few things up.

 

1.  You pay for extra perimeter, but you do not pay any monthly rent after that for those tiles.

 

perimeter tiles can seriously manage to convince themselves that they are real deed tiles seeing as they are both cheaper, lack upkeep cost

 

I believe that these statements are incorrect, claiming that extra paid for perimeter tiles do not add to the upkeep cost. I have made several deeds with large perimeters adjusted to keep the deed upkeep at 1 silver. When placing these deeds I noted the maximum perimeter I could have to keep the monthly upkeep at 1 silver. If I expanded the perimeter beyond that range at the time of deed placement I would note that the monthly upkeep as described on the last page of the deed placement form would go above 1 silver, so I would reduce the perimeter again to check to see that the monthly upkeep would remain at 1 silver before placing these deeds with a extended perimeter.

 

Conclusion from experience: There is indeed an upkeep cost associated with expanded perimeter tiles extending beyond a certain range in conjunction with the size of the deed tiles area. Example off the top of my head is a 5x5 (11x11) deed with 8 tile (total 13 tile) perimeter equals 1 silver upkeep. Extending perimeter beyond this range at time of placement will increase the deed upkeep to over the magical mystical 1 silver per month rate.

 

Edit: Checked a current deed and it is 11x11 (minimum deed tiles) with 16 total perimeter tiles. Over this perimeter would have increased monthly upkeep as I was checking for maximum perimeter to keep upkeep at 1 silver.

 

=Ayes=

Edited April 28, 2014 by Ayes

[Aeris 3,751]

Okay, to rephrase my statement so that it conveys what I meant: Lacks the upkeep cost that Deeded tiles have. Perimeters tiles have a separate upkeep cost which is much much cheaper than that of deeded tiles.

[Amber 337]

There IS a monthly fee for any perimeter tiles beyond the 5 "free" ones required by the game. I believe that the deed mechanic places the 5 tiles first and then places any extra perimeter tiles outside of those, where the tile count is higher, but it would be nice if some math wiz could confirm that for us. 

 

Put simply if someone is paying for extra perimeter tiles to ensure that they have the option to expand their deed, or just because they want a nice big buffer from any neighbors, they ARE paying a fee for those tiles and I think that should entitle them to some protection of their investment. If they want to plant trees there to block the view or terraform them in anticipation of expanding onto them then I don't think anyone else should have the right to alter those tiles and devalue them. The money spent to place them and keep them should buy us something. 

 

Also, I keep seeing people talking about the 10 tiles between deeds being needed to ensure passage between deeds. All I can say is that if you need a 10 tile wide path to get from point A to point B you need to learn to steer. A 1 tile wide mandatory perimeter tile between deeds allows passage and solves the problem of a "shared"  tile border. Anything above that spacing should be at the discretion of the deed owner. 

[KanePT 699]

Devils advocate: If I decide to expand my perimeter, lets keep it simple and say I type in "6". Now that I pay for a portion of that "free" perimeter, how much and which tiles of that perimeter are under my ownership? If we still follow "deed it or lose it" philosophy anything I pay for should be mine. So even after the pages upon pages of suggestions on this topic the perimeter still holds no value even if I pay for it?

 

Back on topic, I think "yes" to building on perimeter. Even if I don't own it the perimeter is still an entity that would only exist with the presence of my paid for deed.

If you type in "6" you'll have 11 perimeter tiles. If you type in 1, you have 6. And you'll pay for the extra 1, not part of the 5.

As for which tiles you pay, i'd assume its the innermost tiles that get purchased first, since the outermost (which are mandatory) are more expensive, since more tiles.

 

I do believe that the perimeter situation needs to be changed a bit.

I'd say rename the free perimeter to "buffer" or something akin to that, and make it FFA with the current settings (no houses, but everything else goes). Also i think 5 tiles might be excessive, could be reduced to 3 (more than enough to buffer between two deeds and allow for road access).

Then the payed ones retain the current name, and have extra protections (no build of any kind, and no bash except for deed holders or simmilar). That way we keep the current function of allowing for corridors between deeds and allowing for players to actually get something out of their money.

[Kediec 280]

Speaking as a player :-

 

The problem with reducing the auto set perimeter to 1 or 2 is that KoS mechanics are triggered in the first 2 perimeter tiles closest to a deed. Having only 3 tiles of perimeter as default would make it much harder for players to bypass deeds they are KoS on.

 

I don't see a problem with the perimeters staying as they are. They never were meant as deed tiles, and it has always been stated they are wilderness.

[Ayes 3,715]

I don't see a problem with the perimeters staying as they are. They never were meant as deed tiles, and it has always been stated they are wilderness.

 

The problem which has been pointed out is that 5 tile mandatory perimeters are excessive wasted space that termed as "wilderness" means that any player can do as they wish with them messing up work which the attached deed tile owner has completed upon them.

 

For passage 1 tile perimiters are more than enough space. Those that feel cramped can then purchase more perimeter but that will be allowed to be messed with by anyone in the future, which will reduce its attractiveness and in turn the purchase of it unless restrictions are placed upon it by deed mechanics to prevent others from doing so.

 

As far as Kos being triggered, STemplars won't attack others unless they step onto a deed tile, just the warning will be given. Even if this were not the case it could be adjusted to do so; thus, this point made has no value to add to keeping the perimeter at 5 tiles.

 

=Ayes=

[Marshlander 188]

For passage 1 tile perimiters are more than enough space.

1 Tile is certainly not enough. Consider this: many people put fences right to the edge of their deed and terraform right up to their perimeter. This often makes the 1 tile perimeter a treacherous slope against a fence or away from it. It's a typical deathtrap for newbies running from mobs (they fall - take falling damage and are stuck against a fence with low stamina).

 

And that is what you consider a good tile for passage?

[Audrel 2,223]

Speaking as a player :-

 

The problem with reducing the auto set perimeter to 1 or 2 is that KoS mechanics are triggered in the first 2 perimeter tiles closest to a deed. Having only 3 tiles of perimeter as default would make it much harder for players to bypass deeds they are KoS on.

 

I don't see a problem with the perimeters staying as they are. They never were meant as deed tiles, and it has always been stated they are wilderness.

 

Backspace and erase: Who cares what I think. The usual people will tell me to deed it or lose it (which I did but stupid me left 10 tiles of perimeter between two deeds). Here's to hoping that undefined griefing is still going to be dealt with even with no definition of what that is.

[Kediec 280]

 

 

For passage 1 tile perimiters are more than enough space.

 

Speaking as a player :-

Quite obviously this isn't more than enough space due to the simple fact that KoS mechanics activate on the first 2 tiles on perimeter. Just this simple mechanic means you need a minimum or 3 tiles for a basic passage.

[san_tropez 394]

A Wagon+crate+many rockshards+catapult and some skill=easy to get it down :-/ thats the propblem :-(

Anybody who goes through that just to steal potatoes prolly has nothing better to do with his life than snatch virtual crops. The secret about securing your stuff has never been about the amount of walls you could put up, but making yourself less of a target than your neighbor

[Hussars 511]

Speaking as a player :-

Quite obviously this isn't more than enough space due to the simple fact that KoS mechanics activate on the first 2 tiles on perimeter. Just this simple mechanic means you need a minimum or 3 tiles for a basic passage.

Isn't that just the warning, and the counter doesn't start until you hit deeded tiles?

[Amber 337]

Speaking as a player :-

Quite obviously this isn't more than enough space due to the simple fact that KoS mechanics activate on the first 2 tiles on perimeter. Just this simple mechanic means you need a minimum or 3 tiles for a basic passage.

Perhaps if we stopped worrying about ways to allow players who've been placed on KoS free access to travel around easily and get into more mischief KoS would be more of a deterrent than the joke it currently is. 

[Almeriaan 27]

Hi,

 

If they remove the perimeters, what about the fences?

 

My neigbour and i share a fence. Then if he dont like the fence i put in, he can remove it and build his own. But that i dont like and put his fence down to build my own.

 

So i think its better to have some free space between deeds. I think that you can buy perimeter should be removed and you get just the 5 tiles of free perimeter to have the free space between you and your neigbour.

[Willis 18]

Perimeter = can't be deeded ?

If so. Why people having problems with this?

All is whining more land for free is all i can see.