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Sevenless

I did a math (Blacksmithing vs Weaponsmithing skill model)

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In days of past, when I played my main I got to roughly 45 weaponsmithing. At the time, comparing gains with a lvl 90 blacksmith we noticed we were both getting roughly the same values.


 


EXiquXZ.png


 


Simplistic model to simulate (and amusingly close) was to take the base gain, and every 10 levels cut it in half. Although this doesn't perfectly model wurm, it's close enough to give us a comparison point. I then took the value for 90BS I got (used 0.2 gains as a base), pushed the value to 50 WS and used it in both directions to fill out the gain charts for WS.


 


After this, take the actions per level, calculate earning 10 levels, add it to the previous ten levels total action. That gives us an estimate of actions/skill value every 10 levels. Take the total for 90BS and find it on the WS charts, and badabinga we are gold.


 


Interesting note: Leveling WS to 90 under this model is the equivalent of getting lvl 90 in 16 other skills with similar gain rates to BS.


 


Kinda useless knowledge, but Xor doubted my estimate and he got lovingly mathed in the face =D


 


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And then people wonder why I say "90 bs?, Unimpressive........Get to 50 WS and we'll start talking, 70 maybe we'll be friends, and 90.....How about dinner?"


 


 


:P


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And there lies the root cause of why WS pays so nicely, and why there are so few Master Weaponsmiths :P


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BS hours of actions to 90: 51150*10s per action/60/60 = ~142hrs


WS hours of actions to 90: 818400*10s per action/60/60 = ~2273hrs


 


I estimate that CoC roughly doubles experience gains at 100 power (aka cutting time in half). The exact hours may not be correct, but the relation between them should be. And that being said the model is surprisingly accurate for a rough guess. Assuming 5 hours a day of WS, tools that result in 50% bonus gain (ie average 50 CoC under my guessing), it would take ~300 days to get 90 WS.


 


By that math you could do BS in 19 days with 5 hours per day put in. Access to high enough quality metal might pose an issue unless you were using skiller imping tools (uncommon) or had access to a high level miner from the get go.


Edited by Sevenless

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Thank you but I will stick with my Leather Working and Cloth Tailoring...


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Wait, so this 93Wepon smithing is worth 16 90blacksmithing? good to know.....


 


Will Sell if I get a good enough offer :D


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Wait, so this 93Wepon smithing is worth 16 90blacksmithing? good to know.....

 

Will Sell if I get a good enough offer :D

 

XD yep. You basically leveled to 90 blacksmithing on 16 characters to get that level of weaponsmithing. Ignoring affinities that is.

 

Sidenote: I think Druid has a dinner invitation for you... ;)

Edited by Sevenless

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XD yep. You basically leveled to 90 blacksmithing on 16 characters to get that level of weaponsmithing. Ignoring affinities that is.

 

Sidenote: I think Druid has a dinner invitation for you... ;)

 

Nah, friends about to hit 90, and once I start playing again I'm getting mine from 73 to 92. (maybe even 95, depending)

 

however, I know my friend has been grinding for 4 months without me now, I did catch up to him, then stopped, he's been grinding all this time......and is only 86-87.  It's a PAIN.

 

Anyone with even decent WS i'd tip my hat to, 90+ ......Just insane.  Luckly, I'm stupid and insane.  B)

 

Edit: also dinner invitation only available to Redhead females near my age, Sorry.   :P

Edited by Druidnature

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thanks for sharing this knowledge ;)


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Nice comparison, i gave up at 50 lol


 


Talking about weaponsmiths, To my knowledge i believe Violet is the only female 90+ weaponsmith in wurm


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And yet after all the effort put forth to reach a high level of weaponsmithing their market is severely restricted by the fact that most of these weapons can not be mailed for sale and improving purposes. A glaring fact that seems to be ignored in its significant impact to the detriment of this skills potential worth and profit.


 


=Ayes=


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And yet after all the effort put forth to reach a high level of weaponsmithing their market is severely restricted by the fact that most of these weapons can not be mailed for sale and improving purposes. A glaring fact that seems to be ignored in its significant impact to the detriment of this skills potential worth and profit.

 

=Ayes=

 

People will travel for a good weaponsmith, but yeah it would be nice if they could be mailed.

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And yet after all the effort put forth to reach a high level of weaponsmithing their market is severely restricted by the fact that most of these weapons can not be mailed for sale and improving purposes. A glaring fact that seems to be ignored in its significant impact to the detriment of this skills potential worth and profit.

 

=Ayes=

 

Honestly I don't understand the mailing system in this game. The restrictions seem wonky (probably just coding artifacts honestly). Furthermore the theoretical influence it has on the economy seems detrimental in my mind, but removal would make the game so much more of a pain in the ass that that's at least as detrimental too!

 

*shakes head* Glad I ain't tasked with changing/fixing that.

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142hours vs 2272hours


Must tell this to everyone who even thinks of getting ws even a little up ;)


 


The numbers seem very accurate, well done with the math.

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is this chart assuming sleepbonus always used?, 50% used? etc?


Is this chart assuming no coc on tools? avg coc50?, all tools coc100?


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is this chart assuming sleepbonus always used?, 50% used? etc?

Is this chart assuming no coc on tools? avg coc50?, all tools coc100?

 

The only thing that is intended to be accurate is the relationship between WS and BS. The ~50 = 90 part and the 90 in WS = x16 90s in BS.*

 

But if you wanted to get technical this would be no CoC, no SB. However, since I didn't attempt to emulate the actions which don't give skill which I'd estimate at 50% overall, I think the net result would be doubling the time to respect skill ticks and then cutting it in half to represent enchants/SB XD Give or take a touch for rounding errors.

 

I could make it more accurate with some effort potentially, but I would have to suss out the skillgain formula properly. What I did was mock up an asymptotic gain system that will act similar to Wurms, set the skill gain values at 50 WS equal to 90 BS and calculated the actions required to reach each level.

 

Issues a proper model would need: It's not corrected for average use. There's too much rounding for accuracy. None of the guesstimates are based off real numbers, they are rounded "close enough" values. It does not include the 0 skill tick actions wurm has either.

Edited by Sevenless

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Yeah this is why I am cutting off WS at 70


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This also stands true for lower levels?

Like 50WS = 16 * 50BS

 

Yup, the ratio between the two is static.

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Yeah this is why I am cutting off WS at 70

Go 80, every regular player stop say 50/70. 80 makes your special!

(And you get a giant cookie!)

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wow nice chart. Good work and thanks for taking the time to figure this out. I have recently started to look at grinding skills like BS, CS, PS, SS, and i was also thinking about starting some WS, but after seeing this i might hold off on that since it seems i would have way to much on my plate.


 


I had a theory though in which is the reason why i am trying to skill up all the sub skills in armor smithing. Maybe you can also help me out take a look at this theory to see if it is possible to work in this fashion. I was thinking that if you possibly work on every sub skill under a main skill you it would in turn gain your main skill higher then if you were to just only skill up one of the sub skills... Sorry for being confusing but ill try get to the point. Im wondering if you were to activity work on all the sub skills at the same time skilling them up almost the same amount each, having a higher main skill might possibly help with getting skill gains in the longer term when reaching 70+ in the sub skills. Perhaps im looking at this all wrong, but after reading some information about main skills offering greater success and accuracy, i decided to try it out... At the very least it cant hurt my skill gains i dont think?


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wow nice chart. Good work and thanks for taking the time to figure this out. I have recently started to look at grinding skills like BS, CS, PS, SS, and i was also thinking about starting some WS, but after seeing this i might hold off on that since it seems i would have way to much on my plate.

I had a theory though in which is the reason why i am trying to skill up all the sub skills in armor smithing. Maybe you can also help me out take a look at this theory to see if it is possible to work in this fashion. I was thinking that if you possibly work on every sub skill under a main skill you it would in turn gain your main skill higher then if you were to just only skill up one of the sub skills... Sorry for being confusing but ill try get to the point. Im wondering if you were to activity work on all the sub skills at the same time skilling them up almost the same amount each, having a higher main skill might possibly help with getting skill gains in the longer term when reaching 70+ in the sub skills. Perhaps im looking at this all wrong, but after reading some information about main skills offering greater success and accuracy, i decided to try it out... At the very least it cant hurt my skill gains i dont think?

Incorrect here, main skill slightly helps you to do the sub skills, making it slightly easier, so actually REDUCING the exp gained in sub skills.

So it actually does the opposite, you want to get as close to the 50% difficulty mark as you can.

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Getting every smithing subskill except blacksmithing from 5ish to 20+ took me from from 42 to 44 overall smithing. Getting blacksmithing from 50 to 70 took me from 35 smithing to 42.


Same with carp - getting every subskill except fine carp from 1 to 20ish took a friend from 56 to 60. Getting fine carp from 40 to 50+ got him to 66.


So yeah, it looks like the higher the subskill, the more its skillgain affects overall skill. A bit counterintuitive IMO, but it does favour specializing... a tiny bit... in that one way.


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