Nappy

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Everything posted by Nappy

  1. The distinction is usually between creation of a new item and improvement of an existing item. Priests are usually able to create new but not improve old (not withstanding special server mods or other recent changes to this)
  2. Full Steam Ahead

    It's not hard to enforce it. Already been done. Link steam_id to the player_id in the Wurm database and then make it so only one id works. So even if you create five characters you can make it so only the first one works period. The edge case you mention is the tricky one because of the way family accounts work in steam. Still ways to handle it, just a lot trickier.
  3. WO will likely be behind WU. There are a lot of modders in WU and with less risk of WO meddling in the form of an update the WU modders should likely have much more freedom to do things. Frankly it will be interesting to see if WO is even around in 5 years. WO population is continuing to go down quickly, steam WO is now the focus and even WO hardware reliability appears to be coming into question. Several long term WU servers appear to have better uptime/reliability performance then even "paid service" WO. It's true that it would have been nice to have the distant tree line rendering, likely the only thing I really wish we were getting.
  4. That was my hope. Glad to have confirmation.
  5. Ago's modloader updated independently of WU in the past. What happens if a new feature is needed for the modloader now that it's integrated with WU? Since WU is no longer being updated are we now effectively stuck with the current version of the modloader as well? I haven't seen this discussed anywhere so I would appreciate comments around it.
  6. Full Steam Ahead

    We should likely consider how the Steam launch will likely go. A few assumptions can be made (and if they are wrong assumptions then likely things will be somewhat different then predicted). Assumptions: 1) Game is very similar in feature sets and settings to current WO 2) Premium and Deed costs remain similar to current WO 3) Grinding and action speeds remain similar to current WO (specifically Freedom speeds) 4) Multiple characters are required for the "full" experience of being able to do everything possible in the game 5) Using WU servers, especially 1x grind/action, as an example activity curve How it will likely go: Day 1 - New server, land rush, lots of new players, explorers every where as the perfect place for a new home is sought Day 8 - Server population is continuing to grow as word of the new server gets out and friends join from other servers/games Day 15 - Grind is starting to wear on people especially those who have been playing since server launch Day 22 - Server population is mainly holding steady/small decrease depending on age demographics of server population. Older population with real-life responsibilities are starting to hear that they are neglecting family etc Day 28 - Server population is starting to reduce as grind fatigue sets in. Many people leave once they have their initial deed created/started. Many will never return This continues. By Day 60 (roughly two months) players have left largely with a small core group hanging in there. The problem with Wurm is the challenging part is in the beginning from when you first join until you have the safety of your first deed/home. For many people the "game" part is then replaced by the "grind" part. More adventure/things to do/ excitement is needed to go beyond this stage. I think this is also why the whole "roll out a new server" strategy that WO used works so well and yet later servers are left to largely die as they get older. Possible success criteria: 1) Day 180 - Server population, concurrent usage, 500+ 24 x 7 2) Day 360 - Server population, concurrent usage, 1000+. 24 x 7
  7. My thanks to those who have answered this thread so far. I've enjoyed reading the various answers and a bit surprised to see it softening my harder edges around this topic. Thank-you for sharing!
  8. In the last few weeks I've seen even more chats about quitting Wurm Online. Lots of players selling out including many long timers. Out of pure curiosity on my part, if you've decided to stay what's the reason for it? Perhaps this feed back can help the dev team be more careful about what features they yank without discussion or notice.
  9. Very nice deed to look at (in the pictures you provided). Nicely done!
  10. Would bdew's excellent Custom Actions mod help you with what you are trying to do?
  11. In WU there are also mods that some people use to generate trade. So merchants that buy your products, others that make things for you to purchase.
  12. Switched my Shares

    What's that old quote? I think it goes like this..... "Fool me once shame on you. Fool me twice shame on me". How many times over the years had CC broken promises? What makes anyone believe they won't break yet another one again? The thing about this whole thing is that there are ways to still have a WU revenue stream. Consider selling DLC, sure it's a broken promise too but at least there is a path forward especially if you explain how things have changed. The problem with the broken promise is that when it was originally offered that all updates would go to WU (and first) it was suggested that better revenue positive choices were out there instead of just one price and updates forever. The same customers who are the recipients of the broken promise pointed it out. Humble bundle offered WU for $1 at one point that I recall. Was that a legitimate and approved arrangement? I ask because I have a Humble Bundle subscription and I don't want to support a company that is doing illegal things. If it was a legal bundle then I must question who the wise guy was who decided a $1 bundle offering was a good idea?
  13. Switched my Shares

    (snip) On 9/23/2019 at 1:23 PM, Samool said: How is that different from content features? Both exclusive content and exclusive client features are additions to the game that are meant to make Wurm Online more appealing compared to WU. It's not a secret that we benefit more from WO being successful than WU right now, as in the end WO is the game that pays our contracts and keeps it all running. This decision really was taken weeks before the new owners situation (as Retrograde mentioned), they are hands off. (end snip) Hmm, if that last sentence is correct and if I am interpreting it correctly then the decision to break a promise made to WU players happened BEFORE the change in ownership which is very, very different from it being a decision caused by merger etc. The whole thing just leaves a bad taste in my mouth and many others it seems. I hate when people say one thing and do another, not a trust building type thing at all.
  14. WO Steam Discussion

    Quite honestly I've been reading this thread from the beginning. I still fail to see what the "big selling point" is going to be for the new version on steam. What's the value proposition that will get people to buy the new game? So far I have read a lot of potential downside: - Crash of remaining WO population - Cutting loose WU/loss of player trust/bad steam reviews on launch - Breaking commitments made to players on both sides (no more updates for WU, no more new servers will be added for WO) So if even one of these things is likely, what's the upside that makes the risk outlined above worth it?
  15. WO Steam Discussion

    I couldn't agree with you more if I tried. WU is where things are tried and experimented upon. WO is rigid in comparison.
  16. WO Steam Discussion

    I agree with you about WU servers that are 1x + compared to WO especially if they have some QOL mods running. For WU running at 1x or less like 0.5x I have to admit that WO seems like easy mode then!
  17. WO Steam Discussion

    This makes me wonder if they have considered the ramifications of this decision at product launch if even 0.1% of those 300,000 abandoned WU owners decide to point out the broken promises? Many, many other games have experienced this type of thing when launching a new product on steam after making a decision to abandon an old one. Usually this doesn't go well for the developers.
  18. One suggestion - You might consider a section on what to change/add/do if you want to run multiple wurm servers on the same machine (for example server 1 is a production server, server 2 is for testing and server 3 is for dev work on mods - this is how I typically set mine up).
  19. With all this talk about WO paying for development with minimal contribution from WU. I wonder how much WO made from prems since WU came out? How much was made from WU sales since it came out? Numbers don't have to be perfect, just rough guesses, percentages etc.
  20. Full Steam Ahead

    I've worked in software development for years and many of those were working on very complex product suites. If the branching strategy is well thought out then they could likely separate the unique stuff for each platform and have a common stuff for everything that goes to all. Technology can often be used as a way of trying to hide the business directive behind a decision. Besides it's not like we get complete transparency here anyway.
  21. Full Steam Ahead

    It's always a mistake to try to generalize a vast group of people. Some WU servers have survival mods, start with only a crude knife, crude shovel and a hatchet while others are perma-death meaning if you die you completely start over. There are servers with no compasses, vampires and much harder mobs to kill. Some servers have 1x or even slower speeds. There are also faster grind servers that do more with content to make the game less about watching a number and more about having fun. WU in many ways has advanced far beyond WO. WU servers have experimented with trying new things. Unfortunately WO prefers to keep making foolish mistakes rather then reaching out to these people and finding out how things worked out. I have yet to see a single compelling reason for the new steam product that will make people want to play it. Perhaps the compelling reason will come as product details become more known. If it turns out it's just Wurm on steam then I suspect you are going to get another shock. ~Nappy
  22. Full Steam Ahead

    What? Why? (and we aren't on Steam here so why would steam terms of service apply to this conversation?
  23. Full Steam Ahead

    Well the neat thing about messing around with not giving updates to a game that's already on steam is that many of the same people who play that game will likely feel compelled to "warn" people about being abandoned etc. I can't think of a better way to kill a product launch before it even starts. Lots of examples of other companies making this mistake when launching a second product on Steam. Most later admit that it had a giant impact on the success of their new product. Please reconsider before you shoot yourself in the foot. ~Nappy
  24. The thing is that I wasn't referring to that. I was referring to an overall general feeling that you hear people express time and time again. It's not an easy thing to combat, it might not even be a fair thing to have to deal with, it is however one of the realities out there on Steam. Wurm Online moderation is not always seen as a shining example of how best to work with an online community. Any public relations or marketing around a new product launch is likely going to have to address this in a meaningful way otherwise the launch itself will likely be somewhat challenged by people who no longer have the high level of trust in Wurm Online that others do. ~Nappy
  25. I've been trying to think about how the steam WO could be successful especially in light of both WU and existing WO, the concerns around unjust moderation and of course the changes around what content made it to WU compared to what was promised. A few observations apply to both WU and WO: - New server rushes are very popular - The time from first login to building your deed tends to be where the Wurm appeal is strongest for many - The feeling of living on the edge of life versus doing chores in complete safety tends to also line up with the second point - Usually once people build their deed then their participation starts falling, slowly at first and then building up steam overtime until they've moved on to the next new server - Not everyone can afford the massive amount of time needed for 1x WO or 1x WU so many look for a logical ending point, often when a deed or building is built to some arbitrary level One advantage WU has over WO is the ability to find a server that is different, it's not the same experience everywhere you go. Custom mods, custom maps, even custom themes exist and can be experienced relatively easily by everyone who wants to do so One disadvantage of WU is the ease at which "cheater mods" can be written and used with no real control over them. This makes things like PVP next to impossible. WO has the advantage of being perceived as having the most likely chance of a server being there for the long haul. In reality it's a business and like all businesses the decision to turn it off can happen at any time. Things like back-ups etc aren't really any secure on WO then on WU. I've had high usage servers running with 30 minute backups while I think I read that WO runs at 3 hour intervals. Really depends on the admin decisions more then anything. WU has the advantage of being able to pick whatever level of server hardware you want. Again, I've run on server hardware that was much better then whatever WO is using. Advice for making this successful on steam? 1) Give people multiple experiences to choose from. Don't make every server the same in terms of grind, map, feature set etc. Experiment with a no-deed server, a snow server, a hunting server, extreme survival server, a roaming pvp server and a pvp deed destroying server. Go for 1x, 5x , 10x to capture those with limited time. Introduce different concepts to let people enjoy Wurm in different ways 2) Capitalize on the "new server" syndrome. Make a server time or event boxed. When something key happens the server ends or perhaps after x amount of time. Maybe the island sinks under a massive volcanic eruption and everyone has to flee from the approaching lava after building a ship so they can run to a new server that in some ways is another new experience when they arrive 3) Put some clear rules around moderation and follow them. Be transparent, be honest. No-one wants to feel like they can be banned for whatever reason someone comes up with out of the blue. There are a lot of people on steam who left WO and the most common thing they cite is the "fear of unreasonable/unfair banning". It doesn't matter if it's completely true or not. The problem is you are entering an environment that is under less WURM control then this forum and if enough people think this way (and they do) then it's a real problem. (BTW - To be clear I am blaming the poor policies on what has happened rather then saying any particular staff are a problem. In my few encounters with actual moderators or GM I have nothing but good things to say. When people have absolute freedom to do whatever they want then they often do). 4) Keep your promises. You will be going up against anyone who cares to review on steam. If you say you are going to do something then do it. Otherwise when you introduce this shiny new game the doubters are going to start calling out what happened before, the broken promises etc. 5) While the focus is often on giving people a better endgame, one clear winner might be to figure out how to keep the grind reasonable while extending the portion of the game that happens between when someone is brand new and when they get a new deed. Some WU servers have experimented with very, very minimal starting gear which dramatically extended the initial parts of the game. A second product launch on the same platform where you have an existing product is hard especially if you don't have a clear and distinct advantage for the new product over the old one. In light of my comments above it's unlikely to be enough to say "Managed by Wurm staff" as the difference, it will have to be something way more significant then that. Personally I wish you well with what you are attempting to do. ~Nappy