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Wow! I'm shocked at the acceptance of this whole thing. "It sucks but not as bad as you first purposed so now I'm happy." Rolf's "compromise" here doesn't change the facts one iota. Olives trees are unsightly & planted in mass tend to block passage between them. Few ppl have enough of them deeded to fuel their lamps. Even fewer ppl are willing to enlarge their deeds, or give up otherwise valuable space, to add an olive grove. (Prepare to see undeeded olive groves fenced all over the maps.) Olive season is short & players have real lives to live. Forcing us to rely on something that is seasonal for light is just wrong. Lamps staying lit on deed was never a bug but rather a negotiated perk for deed owners. There are many alternate possiblities for making olive oil useful. Noobs don't come into the game with lanterns. I fail to see how being ported into a dark world - there will be no lights around the spawn areas now - is going to help keep new players in the game. You've just reduced or removed one of the most astetically pleasing aspects of the game for alot of ppl. This IS going to throw the aggro spawn rate out of balance again because Wurmians are nothing if not good at finding ways to live with the constant nerfs. Players are already penning up light giving creatures to use instead of lamps. Whether or not this new "improvement" requires a ST is still unknown but if it does the raging & leaving has only just begun. Asking for something to be more realistic in a game that has spiders the size of volkswagons, trolls, dragons, & unicorns is just plain stupid. If it's realism your are after I think you've stumbled into the wrong game so go play a sim and let the rest of us enjoy our sandbox. If you think your dark deed is bad you should really get off it for a bit and see how dark & gloomy the rest of the server looks without lamps at night. This is a sad day for alot of us for whom the visual aspects of Wurm are half the fun. It's an even sadder day for those of who realize that as long as such needless changes are shrugged off by the community there is no limit on how bad the next one will be. The best predictor of future behavior is past behavior. If that doesn't scare you then you just haven't been around here long enough.

Thanks folks. Rumour has it the dump is 'soon'. Whether that is "soon next week" or "soon ala multi-storey" (i.e. years) is anyone's guess. [EDIT] At this point, with the dump hopefully in sight, I'd like to put forward how I plan to develop this community map. In the past my motto was 'keep it simple, clean and editable' and it stood the test of time. At the time I was juggling as many as three maps and it was essential to make everything simplistic to allow for quick additions and edits. Now however I can focus on one and only one map, a smaller one too, and as such I want to push for a little more detail in what information can be displayed. So, using an offical map dump is fine for a while, but it does not lend itself to alterations with the landscape, something that happens a LOT in Wurm. My intention then is to trace the dump accurately (in a proper CAD-based cartography software) with distinction between terrain types (steppe, sand, rock, etc). This landscape will be more artistic than the current map but still easy to read. Mountains, dense forests and marsh can be represented on top of this terrain layer, again easily changed as time progresses. Which brings me to the more detailed functions. Traders, single merchants, towers and mailboxes can be displayed as before in addition to new icons for specialist player-merchants (smiths, shipwrights, horse breeders, crops); fishing spots; sermon centres; different categories of settlements (city, town, village, homestead, marketplace, festival sites; sparring arenas; obelisks (from missions); huge player pyramids; shallow reefs/bays; bridges; canals and of course highways. Obviously considerations will be made to keep the map from becoming overly cluttered, for one thing I'll be doubling the pixel-tile scale (making the map 4096 where the server is 2048). The one drawback against viewing the original dump is of course elevation: personally I've never seen it as a disadvantage due to the way angled-elevation can block the view of some areas. However, the original will always be there for cross-referencing. This will take a little time and effort but I hope everyone will enjoy the results.

I'll look at this from the Freedom point of view, which means looting and desctrution are out since those aren't on those aren't a factor on those servers are most of the players on those servers don't consider them to be fun, this just leaves creation and maintenance. So I'm not going totally abstract here and will only talk about maintenance, creation, fun and chore. Realism can *censored* itself. Those two indeed need to be properly balanced, after all if maintenance gets the upper hand then people won't have a lot of time left to spend on creation. If maintenance isn't represented strongly enough then creation gets the overhand and people can create so much stuff that the entire server fills up with junk/buildings/etc. Decay is a big part of maintenance that keeps that down, upkeep of deeds is another such limiter that prevents the creation of many deeds. Clearly the people on the Freedom server like creation more than maintenance, the latter is after all mostly just a chore while the former is considered to be fun. So it is only logical that most people would dislike a change that increases time required to be spend on maintenance while not offering anything else. That is the problem with this update, it adds new forms of maintenance but doesn't offer anything new and interesting on the creation side of things to balance it. The majority didn't feel that creation/maintenance were unbalanced in that area. Time wise such updates mean that the players have to spend more time on maintenance and have less left over for creation, since maintenance is overall seen as chore and creation as fun this means the amount of fun is being reduced. For example take minecraft, torches there shouldn't burn forever from a realism point of view, at one point they were considering making them decay but it seems they decided not to. That was of course the right decision, since it would just have added maintenance and nothing else. It's to bad that while Notch did make the right decision in that area by leaving infinite light in his game instead of adding pointless maintenance, Rolf did not. So my personal feelings about this update is that they don't offer anything on the creation side while only increasing maintenance, the net effect is less time available for fun, making the game overall a less fun experience. I'd group it together with all the pointless nerfs to taming (from a Freedom point of view again, nice useless skill now, isn't it?) and the cave bugs that destroyed caves and creatures that bash walls (trying to add destruction back into a community that rejected it when raiding was added to the home servers..). Rolf has already been trying to reduce the effect by making olive oil easier to make, reducing maintenance again, but it's still more than it was before the change. The suggestions like boiling tar to make a new fuel would for example add something new on the creation side, especially if it could also be used for other things, so that would be a good step. Making olive oil useful in cooking recipes would have been even better but nothing was done on those areas at all. Just more pointless maintenance with nothing new on the creation side I'd say the update itself wasn't properly thought trough, it feels rushed, incomplete and doesn't do the game itself any honor.

Rolf, you have ruined my life. How can I possibly be expected to select Cut Grass instead of Harvest? This is unnaceptable and the sight of these reeds burns my eyes out. I expect this to be reverted tomorrow, no matter what anyone else thinks. I'm done with this game.

cough No, it should be reverted back to the way it was. (158 votes [77.45%]) cough

Where is Zcul? He's the most talented coder on staff thus far. Can't we just give the game to him? We need like 6 Zculs for this thing to run properly.

The CMP enters a new era. Please read the entire post before submitting information. Last Updated: 4th February 2013 High-res edition: http://noizeviolatio...wurm/CelebH.png or http://tinyurl.com/94dxfme Low-res edition: http://noizeviolatio...wurm/CelebL.png or http://tinyurl.com/8qjvqyu GMAP edition: http://tinyurl.com/ccb9dnd (this url will change with each update and updated less often) And now the complicated bits. Submissions Submissions should be made on this thread or with a private message. Deed submissions must include; Deed name Deed location Deed size/upkeep (do not include perimeter sizes) Alliance name, members and preferred colour (if applicable). Requests for special trade icons, traders, mailboxes, merchants or other icons as detailed below. Terrain submissions should be posted with a diagram. Clay and Tar resources can be submitted as a grid location. Do not submit names for lakes, seas, mountains, islands, that bump by your house, that OMFG awesome bit you once saw while you were hunting... The Grid The map grid is 64*64 squares. Each square represents 32*32 game tiles. The grid's x-axis is numbered 01-64. The grid's y-axis is listed A through to BL. Co-ordinates should be given as XY. e.g. 13AF or 03BB etc. Deeds Deeds are given in four sizes as follows; Homestead: 121 to 440 deed tiles Village: 441 to 1224 deed tiles OR between 1s and 2.449s upkeep (not counting guards) Town: 1225 to 2600 deed tiles OR between 2.45s and 5.2s upkeep (not counting guards) City: Over 2601 deed tiles OR above 5.2s upkeep (not counting guards) Any deed may request for its icon to be represented as a Market, Festival or Sermon site. Deeds requesting to be Markets should have at least 3 filled merchants stalls present. If the deed area is walled off it may request to be represented as a Fortified Village, Walled Town or Walled City. If the deed is named as a castle, citadel or fortress, in-game, then it may request to be represented as a castle icon. Deeds may request one specialist merchant icon. e.g. Leatherworker. Deeds may request mailbox, merchant or trader icons. Alliances Deeds can be shown to belong to an alliance using a colour-code system. Alliances can request a colour for their alliance. Allocation will depend on existing alliances within their area. In some cases where a alliance members are in close proximity to one another, the alliance can choose to have the alliance name on the map instead of individual deed names. Highways and Tunnels Only roads which qualify as Highways under the game rules may be submitted for the map. Cave canals may be submitted. Walkway tunnels that fall under the protection of Highways under the game rules may be submitted. Miscellaneous Deeds requesting to be Markets should have at least 3 filled merchants stalls present. Towers can be submitted by grid location. Towers may not be added if their position overlaps badly with an existing deed. All non-deed symbols/icons may be moved/removed as deeds have priority. Only a small selection of 'trades' or 'crafts' will be available as specialised merchant icons. Please do not repeatedly request more. Excessive squabbling will not convince me to add/amend anything. In fact, it might earn you a turd icon where your deed should be. Removals If you do not wish your deed to be shown, or wish to have it removed from the map, please contact me directly via PM.

Meet The Pyro Finally released!

I have a GTX560Ti and an Eaton 2000VA rack mount ups which can display watts load. I started/stoped the client several times and the change in load was 112w each time.

Is this where you are pulling your numbers from? http://www.anandtech...e-250-market/16 The additional consumption from idle to full load is 196W (Furmark). You have two of them, so total additional power draw is 392W. Your cards can generate about 70 iron per hour each, for a total of 140 iron / hour. 140 iron = 0.014 EUR = 0.0174 USD/hr This means it is profitable if you pay $0.044 per kilowatt hour or less. Your card is not optimal for the computation we are performing, so you may wish to purchase coins from Rolf directly if you don't have cheap electricity. EDIT: Using Vorg's power consumption data, the break even point for the GTX560Ti is $0.078 per kilowatt hour. Let's take the HD 6970 as another example: Additional power draw from full load - 199W It can generate 300+ iron per hour 300 iron= 0.03 EUR = 0.0373 USD For a HD 6970, if you pay less than $0.18 you are paying less through our service than directly purchasing coins. AMD graphics cards tend to be much more efficient for the computations we perform. Here's a whitepaper we at CoinLab wrote about Bitcoin in January: http://coinlab.com/p...coin-primer.pdf. In short, the computation you are doing is trying random numbers millions of times a second in a very unpredictable equation. When the result (ranges from 0 - 4 billion) is small enough (ex. less than 100), it is broadcast to the Bitcoin network and it creates new bitcoins. The threshold of what is small enough adjusts to the power of the network over time, so bitcoins are generated at a fairly constant rate. Bitcoin uses this difficult computation because it is an "honest indicator" of work - you cannot fake it, the only way to get the answer is to actually perform the computation. This prevents people from being able to make "counterfeit" bitcoins.

Done with this game. First those cheesemaking nerfs and now this? Ive had enough

Change or no change I can't really comment on, above my paygrade... but in dealing with what currently is with regard to community driven projects like canals and tunnels, might it be a good idea to keep a barrel of tar (or whatever fuel winds may bring) at each entrance? Those using the tunnel who have the time and inclination could contribute to its upkeep by lighting/filling lights as they travel through. The gesture would presumably be good for a few days. Also, regarding rather unfortunate and unscrupulous business practices of destruction for the sake of monopoly... while I understand not the most convenient solution, might it be feasible to arrange for bulk import of olive oil from other continents to flood and depreciate the market rendering all the time spent destroying completely useless and unprofitable? There must be others willing to forgo short term financial gain for long term principle. Hope these ideas won't be construed as an attempt to appease unwanted changes or suggesting a permanent solution... merely an attempt at temporary adaptation for the betterment of what appears to be considerable hardship and ire.

The whole Lamp/Olive change is simply madness, and for the first time since I joined, I am questioning if its all worth it. Quite simply Rolf screwed this up, there is no other way of putting it. I'd wish he'd admit he got it wrong, and change it back, he'd earn a lot more respect that way (we all make mistakes).

would like to see what you think about my ideas about that above and btw im not sure if lamps is really a "small" problem....for most people it's just decoration and you could easily just put your gamma up, if it's about seeing inside caves and such, but still they were used at large projects that are a problem and kinda useless now, cause your own lantern isnt lightening a while tunnel passage... and I personally think it's not those lamps people are raging about, but the sudden and completely not needed and without any forward information change thats made by rolf, like so many times before and people maybe just fear, that he will do this even more. and I honestly think, that this "sudden changes without real explanation just to make the game harder and alot more grind" would be truly a reason to quit, cause you can't say if next week, your skills are starting decaying, after you have worked so long and hard for it....or walls are falling down, because he suddenly changed the deed mechanics. I'm not saying he will do this, but there is no reason for us or them to believe otherwise...cause he have proven alot of times, what he has been capable off and therefore (even if some people says that games are senseless anyway) it would make every effort you put into the game senseless.....cause maybe next week, it's gone or nerfed at a rate, that you can't really use it anymore, except you spend alot MORE time into it....(in our case, making lamps, collecting olive oil or tar and planting them is already an effort) so I may ask you, is it really about lamps?

Too bad we cant use all the heat this topic has generated to light our deeds hehe And, +1 Xandra

Ok, ive seen several posts from you along these lines ... Please enlighten us (if you'll pardon the pun), how exactly does the change to lamps make sense and who exactly benefits from it?

From yesterday my oil lamp and laters are useless. Full filled they lights only 15-20 minutes. 70ql lamp/latern filled with 50ql tar, not some low ql ones. Even 50ql mag Light token in inventory stay longer. I galloped blindly through tunel, bumping from side to side, something attacked me and I didn't even saw what was that. I was delivering and in time pressure so I did not want risk fight with unknown enemy. 20 tiles later I met poor Wurmian, who was trapped there, by the same beast. Later, on my way back I saw there another death noob body and bear, which I killed easily. If I knew it was only bear, I could hit him 5-6 times and save that poor Wurmian. I call that DARK AGE of Wurm. grats Rolf EDIT: Next day after server maintenance, my oil lamp was still lighting 5 hours after filling. Thanks, my lamp is usable again

I don't care for having to 'refine' tar to use it in lamps. I can use tar as it is and get it at a high quality to use it on my boats based on digging ability. I'd rather not have to raise yet another skill in order to have something usable for boat building, lamp lighting and whatever else the tar process was supposed to do that is already in place. I dislike the oil having to be in a barrel for the lamps to be lit. I pay for deeds and as part of that upkeep the 'guards' have always kept my houses up, my walls intact and my lamps lit. I wanted that to continue. I understand that some folks thought this was a 'bug' for some unknown reason. I'm wondering if they will think my walls being kept up and my houses being kept in tip top shape is also a bug. Guess that is for another update though. See you then.

I thought the initial lamp nerf made no sense, and I still stand by that. There was no good reason for these unneeded changes to lamps to be made when there are real issues that have a far greater impact on gameplay that still need to be addressed. However, I am happy with the new changes to the amount of oil that will be made from one olive, and that lamps will now burn 4 times longer. Sure, I'll still have to hand-fuel them periodically, but I can deal with that. Part of life is learning to compromise and adapting to those compromises - we rarely ever get exactly what we want, in life, on the job, or in any sort of dealings with people. If I recall correctly, several people suggested that lamps burn longer and/or that olive oil amounts be increased, and he's done exactly that.

Who wants to scrape information together from various sources to play a game anyway? Updates and changes should go directly to the startup news in the client and in addition to the forum, but NOT scattered all over the internet.

Still have to hire a guard just to fill lamps (i have no other uses for one). Still would have to clear my schedule just to be able to play on olive season. Still doesn't fix the lighting bugs. Seriously screwing up the playability of a game so much, for the sake of having MORE OLIVE USAGE? Its illogical at best. There's been so many more logical suggestions to have more olive usage, and seriously whats with this sudden fixation with olives? There's a ton of crap in-game that has no freaking use (spoons, plyers) others only have one specific use (camelia, oleander, and all other HC materials) so why the freaks do you have to break the game for the sake of OLIVES? Mediterranean sympathy? If you still insist on this nonsense, please add the tar refinement process, and make this like building decay on deeds (ie not forcing people to double their deed upkeeps just to get light), For me you ruined one of the best visual features of wurm. The way wurm can be made to look at night was one of the greatest things about the game for me.

This doesn't change anything. You are just making things worse by sticking to a stupid change and trying to appease the freedomers by small adjustments. 1) You are still forcing people (in a supposed sandbox game!) to keep olive trees, harvest olives, spend time to grind a skill, make olive oil, fill a barrel, keep guards (still unsure if thats really true) if they want any lights on their deed. 2) Recent nerfs have reduced deeds to something rather pointless. I can't find a single reason why I would want a deed if I ever decide to come back to Wurm. I was away for 2 weeks and when I logged back in to check all my horses were gone and a few palisades surrounding my deed plus fences behind these were gone. Probably bashed down by a troll. I would need around 3 spirit templars for them to be able to handle a troll before he bashed down my fences. I hate the sight of olive trees, and refuse to light my lamps with olive oil. There is no way I am refilling hundreds of lamps on my deed every week just because you had a bad sandwich for lunch. So the only reason for owning a deed now is to prevent griefing because thats perfectly within the rules and to prevent decay on structures. I can make those 80ql so they will last a few years before I even need to think about repairing them. 3) Bring back skill decay.

Hi, lol - it works as it always worked, since ages: Slavedriver: I'll cut your scums rations by 50% now! Slaves: Oh no, please, don't do this, we'd starve! Maybe you can cut it for 70% only, and add some more whippings instead? Slavedriver: Well, accepted - 60% rations now, whipping doubled. Slaves: You're so good to us! *kissing feet* Seems I'm too old. I don't understand this madness anymore. Have fun. Or not.

Hi, So we can assume a scenario like this? Rolf: Grrmmbblle, they still all are playing on the PvE servers, and nobody cares about the sheer beauty of Wurms PvP combat log analyzing and skill & gear number comparing? I'll teach you! Rolf: *Horse nerf 1, backwards movement nerfed to 1/3* Players: disband, disband, disband Rolf: You dare to antagonize my wisdom? Eat this! Rolf: *Horse nerf 2, they get attacked now* Rolf: This will teach you treacherous Freedomers! You better go Pvp finally, else ... Players: disband, disband, disband, disband Rolf: I don't get it, how stupid you are? U!must!PvP! Is this so hard to understand? Well, I have quite more at hand! Rolf: *Bang! Lights go out!* Players: disband, disband, disband, disband, disband Rolf: Hehe, this should have done the trick, they'll finally PvP now ... Rolf: Oh [censored], these [censored] [censored] have gone? Who'll pay my bills now? Oh [censored] [censored], only 20 Pk'ers left on Chaos, and they are threatening to leave, too, because of no more newbies to gank! Who'll pay for my pizza now? Oh [censored]! And then the lights went out. Have fun! PS: This is usually called "satire". It's not meant this seriously, it lives from exaggerating the facts. But if it's good, it contains quite some truth.

I'd prefer it if I didn't have to come to forum or a blog and read lots of stuff to find out about the latest nerfs. Please give us simple, short and to the point descriptions of changes in the launcher.

Strongly against that . We already pay 10s to buy the contract which i feel is more than enough along with the fee taken from each sale . I have a merchant on my own deed . Sometimes i don't get to log in for over a month at a time , let alone have the time to constantly restock it when it runs low / out of items . The fact that a merchant i own and is on land i pay might go empty for a bit shouldn't matter to anyone else ( which is one of the reasons i'm against auto disbanding merchants ) . Besides , browsing an empty one is no different to looking at a full one and finding it has nothing on it you are interested in . I can understand some frustration when checking merchants at say FM that are empty , but why not just add an " Empty " tag to the name when that happens , rather than try to punish those who dont' have much play time . So my counter suggestion is " Give merchants an Empty tag to the name when it has nothing left to sell .

Not only this. We should pay few coins for every kill templars did. Nooooo, Rolf do not push game this way, if you do not plan massive reduction of population in Wurm. You all swearing about olive oil and I understand why. I will not refill lamps, because I dislike when features magicaly turns to "bugs". Most of my places will turn to dark. It can be used in advertising, how nice dark places Wurm has Few days ago I did about hundred screenshots, mostly in evening and morning time. 10 of them was good lighted by tons of my lamps. Rest was useless for common public, because too dark. Only veteran Wurminas can see what was there. Even more dark will be now, great. I have different solution. I will use lamps to feed personal trader. Jewelry or lamps, who cares. Everywhere I need light I can build fenced tile with Hell horse and enchanted grass. Horses do not need to fill with oil every 3-5 days And only drawback is that stupid fire sound. It can be used on deed same as off deed. Bad thing, I can't place enchanted grass and fences in mines (personally I think it is bug, hehe )

Just to clarify a few points of which any are welcome to correct me if I am wrong. First, these auto-filling olive oil barrels will only function for street lamps planted on deeds. The main "benifit" of them is that you can store large quantities of oilve oil within them which the deed guard (Spirit Templar) will "magically" (?) use to refill all street lamps planted on deed tiles which will be depleted at the standard set rate (3-5 days proposed) per each street lamp planted on deed. So even with this auto-filling oilve oil barrel on deed it will still use the standard amount of oil per street lamp, meaning the more street lamps you have planted on deed, the more oilve oil you will use up by using this "convienent" auto-filling oil barrel system. Rolf has never made it clear if a deed guard (Spirit Templar) will be required to enable this auto-filling oil barrel system to function or if his using the term "guards" is just a symbolic reference to the functioning of deed mechanisms; so as of this point I have no clear insight as to what will be required in this respect. Also, under this new proposed system to make oilve oil more "benificial" to players, tar will still be able to be used to manually fill street lamps both on and off deed, which will cause the street lamps to run out of fuel at the standard rate. Of course the use of tar in its current state could be changed at any time for our "benifit", as Rolf stated in his post that it was never intended to be used for fueling lamps anyway. Oracle has suggested that tar should have to be refined in some way in order to be used to fuel lamps, which would of course require further work and perhaps skill/failures on our part to refine it to a useable state. Yet to be instituted or determined but as I see it this is the next threat to the more convienent and less time consuming fueling of our street lamps and carry lanterns. *shudders* Beyond all this, under this new system of street lamps running out of fuel on this greatly accelerated basis, there is no way available to fuel off deed street lamps other than by individually monitoring each one at their different dispersed locations and refilling them each by hand with either oilve oil (or tar for now). I think not many players will be bothering with refilling lamps by hand at off deed locations under this "benificial" oilve oil system. Upon reflecting further on this concept of an accelerated rate of all street lamps running out of fuel to enhance the use of oilve oil as the intended fuel for street lamps, both the logic and benificial effects of this change elude me, as the glaring negatives stated by previous posts would light up the night skys far beyond the snuffing out of the last lonely street lamp peering out into the darkness. Time will tell but for now, only The Shadow knows..... =Ayes=

So instead of taking into account any of the feedback you received as far as enchanted grass and disease, you went ahead and ignored all of it. Good show.

Put it in a container that you rarely, if ever, open. Check it every two months or so, and you'll see big changes. Never open the chest. Much like a certain cat, the gnome can be thought of as both decayed and non-decayed at the same time.

The 'want' is called 'fun'. When I walk out of the house and interact with people I don't wear a bag over my head Being able to put a face to a nickname allows a friendlier community feel. If you don't like pictures you're welcome to avoid this thread. No more comments along this line will be welcome here, and I'll be hawkishly removing those that don't fit. Post pictures or positive comments, I don't want to see some of the negativity that was in the last thread Thanks!