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RedBaron_Johan

Join in testing the new Fighting Tweaks.

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  • Off-deed mine doors will now work like other doors and should stay open to enemies 2 minutes after being passed while fighting.

 

 

 Best change ever. Yes please.

 

(for Epic I don't care about Freedom ;-) )

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Well the only thing i seen that might be a hindrance for some of the newer players on the PvE servers is the.. "Tower guards were made slower". I am not real sure what you mean by slower but if you are talking response time getting to the target then this might not be good for the PvE servers. We don't want them nurfed to the point that they are not helping players stay alive like they should. 

Paraphrasing Xor, Kegan if you`re too weak for PvE, go play guitar or something else. Wurm PvE isn`t for someone like you and so on :P:D

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*stuff* remember that the stats are about chance to avoid damage *stuff*

 

 

Plate glance against Slash (cut) is 25? What teh hell?!

read a little...

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Paraphrasing Xor, Kegan if you`re too weak for PvE, go play guitar or something else. Wurm PvE isn`t for someone like you and so on :P:D

I am not to weak for anything but for the new players that depend on the guard towers this might not be good so wanted to make sure the developers took that in to consideration. ( i can solo champion trolls i am fine) 

Edited by Kegan
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Paraphrasing Xor, Kegan if you`re too weak for PvE, go play guitar or something else. Wurm PvE isn`t for someone like you and so on :P:D

Not sure how that has anything to do with me :P

 

If people will not ever venture out of their deeds for fear of PVP without being able to run and escape in a mine, they weren't doing anything to help PVP either. You guys are complaining because an attacking force does not have the option to run and hide to be safe from defenders who come out to fight and defend their place. There is no winning with the PVP community in this game. Mine-hopping was crap, and everyone knows it. It is removed and the ones who take advantage of it most are going to complain about it now so they can continue to exploit it. If you want to raid someone, or enjoy some PVP action, then do so with SOME ACTUAL RISK!

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The stances seem a lot different now and i think all will be used instead of just normal.


 


Wold like more info on the mine door update.


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  • Off-deed mine doors will now work like other doors and should stay open to enemies 2 minutes after being passed while fighting.

 


that's pretty much crushed any chances of low numbers chaos pvp


 


I can see this maybe being good for epic, but I really don't see it working out on chaos (in my opinion)


 


mine doors aren't exactly a problem, they're actually a reason why we get pvp


 




 


 



This will only make twice less actual pvp.


I myself was going to fix some safemines to derp around hostile lands in near future. Wont happen with that change..


 


[Disapproved on Chaos]


Edited by DonAngelo
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I am not to weak for anything but for the new players that depend on the guard towers this might not be good so wanted to make sure the developers took that in to consideration. ( i can solo champion trolls i am fine) 

Wanted to be sarcastic but couldn`t find the proper smiley. Sorrrrrryyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy Kegan, will you hug me, I`m crying so badly now. :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :(

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This will only make twice less actual pvp.

I myself was going to fix some safemines to derp around hostile lands in near future. That wont happen with that change..

 

[Disapproved on Chaos]

I'm yet to actively take part in PvP (still grinding my skills) but surely the idea of pvp isn't to run and hide in a mine...

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I'm yet to actively take part in PvP (still grinding my skills) but surely the idea of pvp isn't to run and hide in a mine...

 

Hence you dont understand the issue here.

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Hence you dont understand the issue here.

Isn't PvP all about player vs player, risk vs reward?

If you raid, there should be risk involved... Least thats what I always thought when I started wurm...

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alot of people think mine hopping = pvp


but no, mine hopping = dumb


set a mine hop up correctly with a good ql door and its nearly impossible to get inside, unless its in the outside kingdoms influence, then they can drop a deed and mine through reinforcements and bash harder 


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plate vs slash seems low, chain vs slash seems too high, otherwise all seem about right


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Ok so I tested it a fair bit and here is what I think so far; firstly it's great that the fighting styles are getting some attention so there will be more options other than fighting in normal but so far I'm kinda disappointed.


 


I personally believe that the direction aggressive fighting is taken is not the right one; there seems to be alot of emphasis on the amount of damage you do per hit and not much on the speed - when I tested it earlier the aggressive guy would get absolutely owned by a normal fighter and once every 5 hits or so he might actually get a decent hit in that granted did a fair bit of damage - I can only see aggressive being useful in ganks as you just get torn up with it. Personally I really liked the way aggressive worked before the fight fix; you would literally throw an attack every second and could kill someone in under 10 seconds if you outskilled them by alot with a small weapon like shortsword/small maul but you would be completely open to attack and you'd go down almost instantly with a decent amount of people on you even if they were relatively unskilled.


 


To me aggressive should be about trying to do the most amount of damage in the least amount of time and not caring about the consequences, something you try and do if you know your going to go down and want to go out with a bang or to get someone before they run away to safety - not just doing some extra damage and getting torn up in the process. Maybe it would be a good idea if dual wielding in aggressive didn't have any offhand swing penalty? Either way I feel aggressive needs to be a much faster fighting style.


 


 


I also think that defensive is also not heading in the right direction with the damage buffs and whatnot; I don't think defensive should be a viable fighting style if you actually plan on killing people you don't massively outskill; again I'd like to point pre-ff to people like Jbobj, Thunderstuck or Taya who skilled defensive fighting and shields - in fights they were extremely hard to hit and almost impossible to kill unless you severely outnumbered or outskilled them but on the other hand they were practically useless at hitting you. This is in my opinion was a defensive fighter should be; someone who can charge in first and take the heat off other people especially the aggressive fighters.


 


 


Granted this specialization system was a heck load more effective when you had sticky targeting and couldn't just switch target instantly but still I hope I make my point a bit.


 


 


 


TL;DR


Aggressive: relatively weak hits but extremely fast swings; absolutely useless at defending


Normal: middle ground; decent at attacking and defending


Defensive: absolutely useless at attacking but extremely difficult to kill


 


 


So just as an example a small maul has a 3sec timer in normal in aggressive it might be a 1.5sec timer and in defensive it might have a 6sec timer but incredible parry rate. To an extent I wouldn't mind it if you did exactly the same damage in all of the fighting styles and all that differed was the amount of effort you put into attacking or defending.


Edited by Gavin
  • Like 3

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This will only make twice less actual pvp.

I myself was going to fix some safemines to derp around hostile lands in near future. Wont happen with that change..

 Finally there will be reason to go off deed and chaise someone on land and you will know that someone will not just log off in the mine.

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oke this is something on live server(chaos) which is really weird, did some how armor/weapon code go wrong and land on live servers aswell?

 

log incoming:

this is a high skilled fighter vs a priest alt with no fs in 50ql chain, being hit with a small maul:

[17:23:01] You try to maul Vonjager.

[17:23:04] Your attack glances off Vonjager's armour.

[17:23:05] Vonjager tries to hit you but you raise your shield and parry.

[17:23:07] Your attack glances off Vonjager's armour.

[17:23:09] Vonjager tries to hit you but you raise your shield and parry.

[17:23:10] Your attack glances off Vonjager's armour.

[17:23:13] You maul Vonjager extremely hard in the stomach and harm it.

[17:23:13] Dark stripes spread along your small maul from Vonjager's armour. You feel drained.

[17:23:13] You easily parry with your small maul.

[17:23:17] Vonjager tries to hit you but you raise your shield and parry.

[17:23:19] Your attack glances off Vonjager's armour.

[17:23:21] Vonjager tries to hit you but you raise your shield and parry.

[17:23:21] You easily parry with your small maul.

[17:23:24] Vonjager tries to hit you but you raise your shield and parry.

[17:23:25] You maul Vonjager extremely hard in the stomach and harm it.

[17:23:25] Dark stripes spread along your small maul from Vonjager's armour. You feel drained.

[17:23:25] Vonjager tries to hit you but you raise your shield and parry.

[17:23:28] Your attack glances off Vonjager's armour.

[17:23:31] Your attack glances off Vonjager's armour.

[17:23:34] You maul Vonjager extremely hard in the left thigh and harm it.

[17:23:34] Dark stripes spread along your small maul from Vonjager's armour. You feel drained.

[17:23:37] Vonjager tries to hit you but you raise your shield and parry.

[17:23:37] You easily parry with your small maul.

[17:23:39] Your attack glances off Vonjager's armour.

[17:23:41] Vonjager tries to hit you but you raise your shield and parry.

[17:23:44] Your attack glances off Vonjager's armour.

[17:23:44] Vonjager tries to hit you but you raise your shield and parry.

[17:23:45] Vonjager tries to hit you but you raise your shield and parry.

[17:23:47] Your attack glances off Vonjager's armour.

 

 

wth is this?

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This will only make twice less actual pvp.

I myself was going to fix some safemines to derp around hostile lands in near future. Wont happen with that change..

 

[Disapproved on Chaos]

 

 

 

I agree off-deed mine doors getting unlocked will kill raiding. One does not stand a chance raiding a deed for hours if he has no way to retreat.

Edited by Issle

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 Finally there will be reason to go off deed and chaise someone on land and you will know that someone will not just log off in the mine.

Especially when you defend a deed with 5 people against 30. How do you want to do that? Maybe using a banzai charge?

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I feel something should be done about shield bashing though, its ridiculously overpowered in group fights, when your getting ganked by 4 people who have halfway decent bashing you'll be permastunned


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  • Off-deed mine doors will now work like other doors and should stay open to enemies 2 minutes after being passed while fighting.

 

Will kill hiding and logging off in mines. If someone has force to charge on Siege force with mine also has force to bash mine doors.

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Especially when you defend a deed with 5 people against 30. How do you want to do that? Maybe using a banzai charge?

  • Off-deed mine doors will now work like other doors and should stay open to enemies 2 minutes after being passed while fighting

DEED 

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Before people say omg care bear please note I can't even recall last time I mine hopped. More often I'm the attacker and trying to get into mines. I hate mine hopping like anyone else but I don't agree this is the best fix I think it's merely the fastest which is sloppy. What is the real issue? People hopping in and out. This isn't punishing that it's punishing using mines all together. It won't be fun when you accidentally let an enemy into your reinforced mine maybe by mistake and they grief or strong wall it, and that's gone. People will always desire safety and I will bet you anything it will spawn more outpost deeds and gatehouses as buffers.

There's many more solutions that are less damaging.

Make it so if you exit a mine door you can enter again for one minute.

Make it so if enemies are within ten or fifteen tiles the door won't open at all.

Make it if you log off in a mine it's fifteen minute logout timer not five.

I have no qualms about people wanting to use tunnels and mines to get around, I hate hopping as much as anyone but opening up a door isn't the greatest fix. People will be timid to go out of them knowing people will freely be able to pile in. Stop hopping but don't assume every mine is used as that. If you want to run like a ###### and hide in a mine that's fine but don't come popping in and out, that's my issue, not the mine.

Edited by Postes
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Just as a balancing issue, fighting sub-skills are quite difficult to grind. They can only be ground by hunting, since there are limits to how much you can grind when in a pen (eventually your skillgain in the subskill just stops.) As such, especially if people are going to be expected to use defensive and aggressive fighting more now that they're going to be useful, maybe the skillgain system for fighting subskills could be tweaked around a bit? Either re-enable pen grinding or reduce how much the amount of skill you have in a fighting subskill makes a difference (of which I think it doesn't make much anyway, though it'd be nice to see this confirmed.)


 


I'm all for keeping skills and stats hard to achieve, but if changing stance mid-combat is to be made a feature then it should be made more accessible. (FYI I'm coming from a Chaos/slow grinding perspective here.)


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Always felt minedoors, especially offdeed, should have locks to be picked or otherwise bypassed besides outright destruction. The concept of an unpickable door never did set right with me. :ph34r:  Id even be perfectly fine with something mystical like the hidden stone doors in Lord of the Rings, whether it be hidden keyholes or passphrases uttered in Local.


 


Armor glance rates look okay at a glance, will be interesting to see how they actually work out.


 


What about arrows though? Archery isnt covered unless its lumped into one of the base three dmg types, pierce?


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