Dominate Made Harder

[Kagrenac 812]

I miss my zombie uttachas.

[Che 250]

Why don't you use the bloody test server? I thought you released 1.0, that means we are not a live beta.

 

 

...again witht he random ###### nerfs, Rolf. You're listening to a vocal minority, not a "lot" of the players.

Yeah BL is a minority, does that mean that rolf should make all wl spells op?

[SmeJack 5,798]

You point out domination weaknesses versus rebirth strengths. That's ain't really fair. compare similar things.

 

yes, domination doesn't last 24 hours, like rebirth does (+1 rebirth), but tamed/dominated pet doesn't lose half of it's stats. they just lose some CR. That's +1 to dom. You don't have to look for a corpse when you need one, all you have to do is visit your pen, as you can use the same pet as long as it lives. Rebirth requires corpse all the time and not any corpse, but a fresh corpse (less 10 dmg). key word is "fresh" here as when you need it, you basically got to find a mob to kill first so you can obtain its corpse. Now that's a nice idea when raiders knocking on your mine door. You cant stockpile corpses in advance too as the rate they decay is insane even in a coffin etc. roughly 24 hours and the corpse is useless. So lets give further +1 to dominating. Oh, BTW champ troll corpse doesn't even fit in a coffin as its "too large" so it decays even faster.

 

So, to sum up, yes we need to balance dominating and rebirth. Dominating has to be nerfed even more i guess, as all the changes with unique and valrey affected rebirth same way too. but i hate when some things keep getting nerfed and nerfed that were working perfectly fine and only cuz of whiners.. This game starting to look like a lego game, where 4 guys have the same lego cubic part, but the last one got green one while the rest got red ones, and he's starting to whine that the reds are OP...

 

A lot of focus on the whole finding a mob for a fresh corpse thing here and limited to no storage, is it so hard to pen them until such a time that you want to kill and use it? Or we could even take this one step further and you could breed them if you were keen enough to have a mag alt.

 

 

Yeah BL is a minority, does that mean that rolf should make all wl spells op?

 

I don't believe BL is a minority at all, they certainly were the furthest thing from last week and they have been in the past too, all kingdom populations fluctuate.

[Dboy 52]

A lot of focus on the whole finding a mob for a fresh corpse thing here and limited to no storage, is it so hard to pen them until such a time that you want to kill and use it? Or we could even take this one step further and you could breed them if you were keen enough to have a mag alt.

 

While its theoretically possible, do you think practically its easy to do? BL priests cant tame, the rest can but have taming penalties, no one can dominate them to lead into a pen, not even talking about breeding lol

 

Also how would you do that with a troll? ofc you can make a pen, unlock the gate and agro-lead it into it. then if some1 else locks the pen to keep troll inside, you have to die, as if you walk out, troll walks out too. And if you lucky to actually lock him inside, he has agro on you and bashes out of the pen. Pretty much same as fighting the windmills...

Edited June 3, 2013 by Dboy

[Che 250]

A lot of focus on the whole finding a mob for a fresh corpse thing here and limited to no storage, is it so hard to pen them until such a time that you want to kill and use it? Or we could even take this one step further and you could breed them if you were keen enough to have a mag alt.

 

 

 

I don't believe BL is a minority at all, they certainly were the furthest thing from last week and they have been in the past too, all kingdom populations fluctuate.

Affliction players

9/400

Serenity players

48/400

Desertion players

50/400

 

 

Bl is the minority.. both on ele and compared to the other home servers

[Bart 954]

Nvm, can't read ^^

Edited June 3, 2013 by Bart

[kodiakjack 6]

While its theoretically possible, do you think practically its easy to do? BL priests cant tame, the rest can but have taming penalties, no one can dominate them to lead into a pen, not even talking about breeding lol

 

Also how would you do that with a troll? ofc you can make a pen, unlock the gate and agro-lead it into it. then if some1 else locks the pen to keep troll inside, you have to die, as if you walk out, troll walks out too. And if you lucky to actually lock him inside, he has agro on you and bashes out of the pen. Pretty much same as fighting the windmills...

no wonder you need every advantage you can get your grubby whining hands on. you obviously don't understand how the game works, because you would not have to die in order to pen a troll. As long as you hold a key, you can pass freely. regardless of what kingdom made the pen.

[Loyals 30]

no wonder you need every advantage you can get your grubby whining hands on. you obviously don't understand how the game works, because you would not have to die in order to pen a troll. As long as you hold a key, you can pass freely. regardless of what kingdom made the pen.

he just bought the game at wal mart give him some slack

[Dboy 52]

no wonder you need every advantage you can get your grubby whining hands on. you obviously don't understand how the game works, because you would not have to die in order to pen a troll. As long as you hold a key, you can pass freely. regardless of what kingdom made the pen.

 No wonder you just cant realize that troll CANT pass LOCKED fence even you enter inside having the key, so you have to unlock it manually for the troll to come inside. Even tho after you lock the fence and walk outside having the key, troll just bashes his way out because hes still agro on you and the fence/wall is in his way.

 

So plz seriously, learn yourself how the game works be4 you try to post trolling posts next time.

[MrGARY 12,421]

 No wonder you just cant realize that troll CANT pass LOCKED fence even you enter inside having the key, so you have to unlock it manually for the troll to come inside. Even tho after you lock the fence and walk outside having the key, troll just bashes his way out because hes still agro on you and the fence/wall is in his way.

 

So plz seriously, learn yourself how the game works be4 you try to post trolling posts next time.

 

Uh, they don't bash at all unless they're actually 'hungry', regardless of aggroing anyone.

[Suntzu 644]

A lot of focus on the whole finding a mob for a fresh corpse thing here and limited to no storage, is it so hard to pen them until such a time that you want to kill and use it? Or we could even take this one step further and you could breed them if you were keen enough to have a mag alt.

 

 

 

I don't believe BL is a minority at all, they certainly were the furthest thing from last week and they have been in the past too, all kingdom populations fluctuate.

 

So your big suggestion to play BL effectively is have a mag alt? Must have been a long night....

[SmeJack 5,798]

So your big suggestion to play BL effectively is have a mag alt? Must have been a long night....

 

Uhh no mate, that was an additional idea. Forgive me for not thinking it a rash one when half the player base has priest alts.

[Sevoflurane 141]

Why are people trying to get rebirth nerf'd?

 

Pets are already pretty useless unless you're hopping, since 9/10 times they'll go down first in an open fight due to archery.

 

Edit: Also, can dominated pets get one hit by a spell? Didnt think so...

Edited June 6, 2013 by Sevoflurane

[Loyals 30]

no but champion animals (Scorps/trolls inperticuler) have a low loyalty level that drops like a brick in combat

i had the mongol champion nogump (George!) come undommed on me at one hota where my horse had been shoot out, lucky bl where in their deed(capehorn) when it happened

Edited June 6, 2013 by Loyals

[Anothernoob 102]

Why are people trying to get rebirth nerf'd?

 

Pets are already pretty useless unless you're hopping, since 9/10 times they'll go down first in an open fight due to archery.

Edit: Also, can dominated pets get one hit by a spell? Didnt think so...

Are there so many 70 faith and combat ready Fo priests around that genesis (and its 30min cooldown) becomes a problem? While at the same time it is possible to for every non-zombie pet to lose its loyalty without the help of a high faith BL priest? Seriously...

 

Rebirth pros

1. Pet loyal to its destruction (a dominated/tamed pet can turn against you if it survives many hits but its loyalty goes down and you don't do something to maintain it).

2. The corpse can be hauled everywhere before rebirth. You can even cross servers with it and make it a zombie (good luck finding similarly good pets that can only be dominated and leading them to where you want to use them).

3. Mass rebirth spells (there isn't a similar WL spell).

 

as for the pros of dominate (pet reusability + unique pets without killing them )  they have already been mentioned.

 

Unfortunately the fact that the spells are so different simply leads to constant "forum nerf-wars" where each side asks for the other sides spells to be nerfed.

 

While its theoretically possible, do you think practically its easy to do? BL priests cant tame, the rest can but have taming penalties, no one can dominate them to lead into a pen, not even talking about breeding lol

 

Also how would you do that with a troll? ofc you can make a pen, unlock the gate and agro-lead it into it. then if some1 else locks the pen to keep troll inside, you have to die, as if you walk out, troll walks out too. And if you lucky to actually lock him inside, he has agro on you and bashes out of the pen. Pretty much same as fighting the windmills...

If it is possible even for freedomers to pen trolls without getting killed/sacrificing alts and without a magranon priest (even after rolf made them bash everything) then you are doing something wrong. If you want to breed them yes you need an mag alt.

 

PS. and no I'm not asking to nerf rebirth unless the other WL pet alternatives get nerfed to the ground (something that has happened in the past with other nerfed spells). Although I have to admit that I thought that you needed artifacts to raise/dominate uniques (and it would reduce the unique-related drama if it was like this).

Edited June 6, 2013 by Anothernoob

[Che 250]

Dominates don't undominate from 1 arrow, it would take as much arrows or hit to kill it for it to actually undominate.

 

And re-using dominates is far better then any rebirth ability, more then 50% of the zombies I rebirth do not get used due to no pvp happening and after that you will have to run around for 5hrs in order to find a new zombie for tommorow.

 

If zombies laster forever then you could just breed them and get even better pets, which is impossible but dominating has that ability which makes it a better choice.

Edited June 6, 2013 by Che

[Anothernoob 102]

Dominates don't undominate from 1 arrow, it would take as much arrows or hit to kill it for it to actually undominate.

 

And re-using dominates is far better then any rebirth ability, more then 50% of the zombies I rebirth do not get used due to no pvp happening and after that you will have to run around for 5hrs in order to find a new zombie for tommorow.

 

If zombies laster forever then you could just breed them and get even better pets, which is impossible but dominating has that ability which makes it a better choice.

I know about creature loyalty and didn't say that it is an "1-arrow issue", it doesn't change anything that I said in the previous post(I even mentioned it).

 

Would you like rebirth to become the zombie-copy of dominate and sacrifice these:

Rebirth pros

1. Pet loyal to its destruction (a dominated/tamed pet can turn against you if it survives many hits but its loyalty goes down and you don't do something to maintain it).

2. The corpse can be hauled everywhere before rebirth. You can even cross servers with it and make it a zombie (good luck finding similarly good pets that can only be dominated and leading them to where you want to use them).

3. Mass rebirth spells (there isn't a similar WL spell).

And have aggro zombies that lose loyalty , corpses that can't be rebirthed if moved too far away from the place that they were killed and (effectively) nerfing to the ground all mass rebirth spells?

 

If the answer is yes then it's ok, but it would also mean the removal of some of the game's diversity and of some features that are unique to BL at the same time.

Edited June 6, 2013 by Anothernoob

[Makarus 458]

Yeah BL is a minority, does that mean that rolf should make all wl spells op?

 

 

How is this relevent to my comment?

 

Furthermore, continual nerfing as is Rolf's habit is a bad idea. Eventually everything is ######. Might as well just mix mortar all day.

 

 

I thought I'd add, BL all the way.

Edited June 7, 2013 by Makarus

[kodiakjack 6]

How is this relevent to my comment?

 

Furthermore, continual nerfing as is Rolf's habit is a bad idea. Eventually everything is ######. Might as well just mix mortar all day.

 

 

I thought I'd add, BL all the way.

as a person with all faith under his belt, i don't see why we're fighting, Now that we have all had something taken, do we want it all back? or do we dive into the struggle for "equality". look around your life and answer if the fight for equality on a video game will be worth it.

IF FACT! Vote here.

http://www.easypolls.net/poll.html?p=51b17f96e4b06789d870cf54

[Che 250]

You do realize that zombie infestation and land of the dead has nothing to do with zombify vs dominating right?

 

It is the same as saying 'well, if you want additional benefits to dominating then we have to remove 25% damage bonus and 25% resstone!'

[Anothernoob 102]

• Fist of all what I keep trying to say from the first post is that there can be no completely fair comparison between BL and WL spells (the same thing happens with meditation-paths). They are different in such a way that you actually can't directly compare them. You will have a disadvantage somewhere and an advantage somewhere else.

Secondly that trying to compare such things will always lead to forum nerf-wars, where unfortunately people only refer to the advantages of the enemy-light spells and not of their own spells (that's why I wrote about rebirth and the technical difficulty with the use of genesis).

Lastly that these forum nerf-wars are meaningless in my opinion (and personally I have grown tired of them but as far as I said what I wanted to say about them it will stop bugging me ).

 

And my slightly "nerf-warish" answer to Che's "nerf-warish" post (who probably misread my previous posts and responded this way):

You do realize that zombie infestation and land of the dead has nothing to do with zombify vs dominating right?

The reason why I mentioned them is because they can quickly add multiple mobs that are hostile to the enemy (theoretically) wherever you want (which I think is one of the reasons why some people nag about pets) and because there is not a WL spell with similar effects. But yes if we want the list of zombie-related advantages to be completely pet-focused we shouldn't mention the mass rebirth spells. 

 

But please tell me if you want rebirth to become the zombie-copy of dominate (I even removed mass-raise spells from the list in order to keep it completely pet-focused):

And have aggro zombies that lose loyalty , corpses that can't be rebirth-ed if moved too far away from the place that they were killed and (effectively) nerfing to the ground all mass rebirth spells?

 

If the answer is yes then it's ok, but it would also mean the removal of some of the game's diversity and of some features that are unique to BL at the same time.

 

As for this:

It is the same as saying 'well, if you want additional benefits to dominating then we have to remove 25% damage bonus and 25% resstone!'

/me points at:

PS. and no I'm not asking to nerf rebirth unless the other WL pet alternatives get nerfed to the ground (something that has happened in the past with other nerfed spells). Although I have to admit that I thought that you needed artifacts to raise/dominate uniques (and it would reduce the unique-related drama if it was like this).

(should I say that in such topics people tend to read stuff that no one actually wrote?) AND

Unfortunately the fact that the spells are so different simply leads to constant "forum nerf-wars" where each side asks for the other sides spells to be nerfed.

and I can simply add:

Most spells are not copies of enemy-light spells they are always different and if you have an advantage somewhere you are meant to have a disadvantage somewhere else. And this is true at the moment with almost every single spell. That's why people from (usually) both sides will always point the weaknesses of their own spells/bonuses (while using a direct comparison which may also not be completely possible/fair), ignore the fact that  some other spells of them are better than the enemy's (as irrelevant) and the fact that they don't always know how easy/difficult it may be for the enemy to use these advantages and still  and blame the game mechanics as flawed. So this is why I believe that most of these talks simply lead to nowhere and that's why I refer to them simply as "forum nerf-wars".

Edited June 8, 2013 by Anothernoob

[Che 250]

I would gladly change the ability to not be able to un-zombify from damage for zombies lasting until they die from actual combat or age, it takes alot of arrows or hits in order for a dom to go undom..

[kodiakjack 6]

I would gladly change the ability to not be able to un-zombify from damage for zombies lasting until they die from actual combat or age, it takes alot of arrows or hits in order for a dom to go undom..

No, its doesn't. and no matter how many time you try and say so, one good hit to the head on a domed creature and it agros its master. completely undomed.

[zincsulfate 1]

I agree with redd