Regarding The Epic Cr Nerf Controversy

[Radni 1,089]

Pre-note, this is posted here because I am not currently allowed to post in the epic forums ( because I haven't been on for 6 hours at a time ingame for a GM to see my forum account link request)

There has been Alot of talk recently on the epic CR nerf, which, ( for those who don't know) essentially make enemy kingdoms weakers on enemy home servers. As I understand, it ESSENTIALLY makes a 70FS fighter a 50FS fighter hen on enemy home servers.

This game mechanic is ESSENTIAL and is mainly a noob-protectant.

Yes, epic has been up for 2 yearsish, but that does not mean NEW people stop joining, nor do they start with 60/70FS, the baseline FS level for PVP.

With this essential game mechanic, noobs are able to band up and have a chance of killing serious raiders. I demonstrated such during the TK kerfuffle, as there were noob griefer who'd purposefully attack noobs out of Serenitys spawn, so they'd be discouraged from the game and quit, rendering JKH with no new blood for fighting.

BUT, thanks to the CR nerf, I and five others ( all had under 10 FS at the time ) were able to repel two 70FS attackers. Without this mechanic, there would be a much different story, they would've been MUCH stronger and we would have had no chance.

I also would like to point out, most of the supporters to remove the CR nerf are HEAVY elevation Pvpers, Posteh, mrgary, etc.

I am A citizen of JKH, serenity. I speak for myself, but I know quite a few others who are against the removal of the CR nerf who live on JKH too.

I are not LEET PVPER WHO MUST WIN, I ENJOY PvP, it is not my life. I will indeed PvP to defend my home, and my server.

The home servers are often victims of attacks, and not always little ones. 80% of all JKH raids I've heard of ( since August 2012 to now) are aimed against new players. To purely grief and destroy them.

The CR nerf gives them a chance, without it, they'd be done for completely.

YES, JKH has warriors, not a extreme leet force, but many caring neighbors who help protect under skilled players and such.

Many times, the attacks are during the middle of the night EST ( which many JKHers work off of), or VERY quiet.

Many MANY raiders JUST attack noobs, and by the time any small warrior shows up, it's too late and the enemy is gone.

Thus the CR nerf gives the noob a tiny chance.

The supporters of removing the CR nerf would argue, why doesn't the noob level up his FS and defend his shizz?

Well, MANY noobs indeed do that, and within a month can fight off a lone raider or two. BUT new players FOREVE CONTINUALY JOIN epic, there is ALWAYS a bunch of noobs who can't defend an are new! The CR nerf allows them a chance.

Why would you take away that one chance from a noob? When that ONE chance is removed, there is a higher chance the noob will be fed up and leave.

The CR nerf does not stop established people from raiding, it purely keeps the noob/lower skilled new people to epic safer until they can skill up and fight!

The CR nerf does NOTHING to stop elevation PvP, which is where the blunt PVP action should stay, an it indeed does. The second you remove the CR nerf, the hardcor leet Pvpers will go after home server noobs, no matter how many time they say they won't.

Rolf, if you want an official poll on the matter, make it ingame so ALL people may vote, not everyone has forum accounts.

Don't JUST let the elitists have the say on the matter, they may have the loudest say, but they are not the only people who play epic

PS, excuse typoes, I swear.. I CAN SPELL!!

Edited March 29, 2013 by Radni

[Che 250]

I live on a home server and I would prefer if the cr nerf would be gone, almost every deed on elevation is a huge lag-fested stronghold that will take hours to raid counted that 0 people actually defends, and pvp outside the hota happens so rarely now when BL's numbers have decreased that most of the pvp happens at hotas, and there barely happens any there too

Most pvp that happens now is BL going to home servers or MR dying outnumbered at hotas, and I think more people from the home servers would actually come pvp more if there is no cr nerf on home servers, since most less experienced people probably haven't farmed horses on ele it would be easier for them to sail to a home server and find some pvp rather then sit outside a lag-fest deed on ele for a few hours with no progression

And on other home servers you are more likely to find people outside from the deed and if attacked meet a force about the same size as yours

Edited March 29, 2013 by Che

[Radni 1,089]

I live on a home server and I would prefer if the cr nerf would be gone, almost every deed on elevation is a huge lag-fested stronghold that will take hours to raid counted that 0 people actually defends, and pvp outside the hota happens so rarely now when BL's numbers have decreased that most of the pvp happens at hotas, and there barely happens any there too

Most pvp that happens now is BL going to home servers or MR dying outnumbered at hotas, and I think more people would actually come pvp more

To each their own.

I feel the risk far outweighs the gain

[Che 250]

To each their own.

I feel the risk far outweighs the gain

Well if you don't like pvp then why play epic? if you want pvp now you have to pretty much offer yourself on a plate with an apple in your mouth

On elevation atleast

and if the pvp will ever be any bigger, either elevation deeds would have to become raidable very easy, some kind of new hota would appear, or cr nerf on home servers get removed

Edited March 29, 2013 by Che

[Radni 1,089]

Well if you don't like pvp then why play epic? if you want pvp now you have to pretty much offer yourself on a plate with an apple in your mouth

On elevation atleast

I am by no means against PvP, and with the CR nerf we have tons of PvP.

I am against the exploitation of noobs, and giving them no chance in a fight unless they grind their eyeballs out within a few minutes of joining the game

Edited March 29, 2013 by Radni

[Che 250]

I am by no means against PvP, and with the CR nerf we have tons of PvP.

I am against the exploitation of noobs, and giving them no chance in a fight unless they grind their eyeballs out within a few minutes of joining the game

I don't think that if the cr nerf was removed suddenly mr or bl would stand outside strongbox and kill noobs every time they walked out, the only things that happens on home-servers right now are just sailing around the coasts hitting relatively easy targets with no players online or some players sitting at the beach.

[Radni 1,089]

I don't think that if the cr nerf was removed suddenly mr or bl would stand outside strongbox and kill noobs every time they walked out, the only things that happens on home-servers right now are just sailing around the coasts hitting relatively easy targets with no players online or some players sitting at the beach.

Yet, with it, gbelcik and Tallanu indeed did stand outside Strongbox and kills noobs for a while until alarm was raised.

Cr nerf could be removed if there was another way to give noobs a chance

Edited March 29, 2013 by Radni

[Che 250]

Yet, with it, Gbelcil and Tallanu indeed did stand outside Strongbox and kills noobs

Due to them being smart and having tactics and a very good way to move around the map, if serenity actually had more then 5 pvpers back then then they would have met a brick wall, as they did in the beginning of january when the first time 10+ people came to defend, rather then the usual 5 people defending the whole map.

[Radni 1,089]

Due to them being smart and having tactics and a very good way to move around the map, if serenity actually had more then 5 pvpers back then then they would have met a brick wall, as they did in the beginning of january when the first time 10+ people came to defend, rather then the usual 5 people defending the whole map.

They were repelled by I and 5ish other noobs with under ten FS. That was due to the CR nerf

[Aflacduck 2,174]

With this essential game mechanic, noobs are able to band up and have a chance of killing serious raiders. I demonstrated such during the TK kerfuffle, as there were noob griefer who'd purposefully attack noobs out of Serenitys spawn, so they'd be discouraged from the game and quit, rendering JKH with no new blood for fighting.

The burden should be on the server, not the raiders. I said this in another thread. There are plenty of 70fs people who live on home servers. When 10 people are entering a 70 player server, it is not hard to find 10 of those 70 that have 70 fight skill. The 10 shouldn't be nerfed just because every noob with a short sword wants to jump in.

BUT, thanks to the CR nerf, I and five others ( all had under 10 FS at the time ) were able to repel two 70FS attackers. Without this mechanic, there would be a much different story, they would've been MUCH stronger and we would have had no chance.

You should never be able to repel two 70fs fighters with six people under 10 fight skill, and it seems very suspect that you even did. Also, the gank bonus helps you here a LOT more than the CR nerf does.

I also would like to point out, most of the supporters to remove the CR nerf are HEAVY elevation Pvpers, Posteh, mrgary, etc.

This is the funniest part. Gary lives on Mol-Rehan Home.

I am A citizen of JKH, serenity. I speak for myself, but I know quite a few others who are against the removal of the CR nerf who live on JKH too.

Are these the same people who join Epic for the skill increase but don't want to PVP?

I are not LEET PVPER WHO MUST WIN, I ENJOY PvP, it is not my life. I will indeed PvP to defend my home, and my server.

Good for you. You realize, however, that this cluster is for pvping and is, and should be, oriented around those who want to go beyond pvping just to protect their stuff and nothing more.

The home servers are often victims of attacks, and not always little ones. 80% of all JKH raids I've heard of ( since August 2012 to now) are aimed against new players. To purely grief and destroy them.

The new players should learn how to build walls, then. This isn't freedom. Usually raiders don't even bother with walls if it's a home server raid. Not only that, if you build an actual decent deed in regards to defense as opposed to one of those awful wooden walled flat deeds, then no raider will touch it for the most part.

The CR nerf gives them a chance, without it, they'd be done for completely.

Or you could bring in the fighters from Elevation or the fighters that live on JKH. I know that there are some. OR, you could, you know, raise your own fight skill because this IS a PVP cluster and the people who decide to PVP shouldn't be the ones who are penalized.

YES, JKH has warriors, not a extreme leet force, but many caring neighbors who help protect under skilled players and such.

Then bring them in. Most raids have <10 players anyway. You also have the benefit of knowing the terrain, having horses, and guards.

Many times, the attacks are during the middle of the night EST ( which many JKHers work off of), or VERY quiet.

Such is the case for just about all attacks.

Many MANY raiders JUST attack noobs, and by the time any small warrior shows up, it's too late and the enemy is gone.

The supporters of removing the CR nerf would argue, why doesn't the noob level up his FS and defend his shizz?

Well, MANY noobs indeed do that, and within a month can fight off a lone raider or two. BUT new players FOREVE CONTINUALY JOIN epic, there is ALWAYS a bunch of noobs who can't defend an are new! The CR nerf allows them a chance.

Then use those people who DID raise their fight stats to help them. You just admitted that "MANY" people have it raised. PVP is about teamwork.

Why would you take away that one chance from a noob? When that ONE chance is removed, there is a higher chance the noob will be fed up and leave.

Or they could ask for help. Or they could realize that this is a PVP cluster and is not carebearland. Or they could build in a safer place with a good deed and not on the water because it's just so pretty.

The CR nerf does not stop established people from raiding, it purely keeps the noob/lower skilled new people to epic safer until they can skill up and fight!

You're correct, raiding happens either way. However, as I have said, there is no reason to place the burden on the small group that's attacking when there's an entire server of fighters as well as an elevation group that can attack.

The CR nerf does NOTHING to stop elevation PvP, which is where the blunt PVP action should stay, an it indeed does. The second you remove the CR nerf, the hardcor leet Pvpers will go after home server noobs, no matter how many time they say they won't.

Elevation PVP is actually rare. Most of us live on superfortress deeds that have huge numbers of players or a small group of very active, very strong players. HotA is only done if one side is sure they can win. If they can't then they usually leave before any fighting happens. Most fights are minor skirmishes when BL raids a home server or JK swarms one of the rare, inactive deeds. I do agree that Elevation should be the primary battleground, as is the intent of the cluster. However, that does not mean that the CR nerf isn't a good idea.

Rolf, if you want an official poll on the matter, make it ingame so ALL people may vote, not everyone has forum accounts.

Polls don't matter, nor do I believe they should. I don't know which way the poll would swing, but you can't just do what the majority wants because it's a majority.

Don't JUST let the elitists have the say on the matter, they may have the loudest say, but they are not the only people who play epic

Elitists? Just because some people decide to PVP on a PVP server and want to PVP without being nerfed for no reason, doesn't make them elitist.

PS, excuse typoes, I swear.. I CAN SPELL!!

Edited March 29, 2013 by Aflacduck

[Che 250]

They were repelled by I and 5ish other noobs with under ten FS. That was due to the CR nerf

from the start where they founded TK and to the start of january when those 10 people actually came instead of sitting in jk chat complaining of why people won't defend them, the only people who actually defended most of the time was JKE and Kings landing, other then that they were free to roam around the map with caves going through most lakes which made it very unpredictable to know where they were going.

removing the cr nerf will create more pvp and will lift those babby paddings that makes the citizens of the home servers float and forces them to make more people pvp.

[Radni 1,089]

I would be for the CR nerf removal if there is an ASSURED way noobs can't just be griefed until they rage quit.

PvP is player vrs player, not Griefer Vrs Noob

This is the problem with SO many PvP games

Edited March 29, 2013 by Radni

[Che 250]

I would be for the CR removal if there is an ASSURED way noobs can't just be griefed until they rage quit.

PvP is player vrs player, not Griefer Vrs Noob

That is for the players to defend, that is the task, maybe on jkh instead of selling gear to your neighbours you'll pass armor and weapons around to make it safer

BLH's spawn is partially hit by a crater, thats by far worse then a team of raiders entering strongbox local for a few minutes.

And well, I am no heavy pvper, and I do live on a home server currently.

Edited March 29, 2013 by Che

[Joemog 732]

Rolf already responded to the CR nerf suggestion, didn't he?

[Postes 5,282]

It's really hard to read this post when you do line by line by line and not just a paragraph.

[Protunia 735]

If you remove CR then you add F2P to elevation and remove all restrictions home servers have had since EPIC opened.

Further I think the Home Servers should have their own Bonuses Now like artifacts for months long before any CR is removed.

They should also have their own Kings since they are to be on equal footing.

Basically You would have to make Both Elevation and the Home servers the exact same F2P and all.

Do I think it will work??

No I don't, I think the PvP servers on Epic will lose many players.

Edited March 29, 2013 by Protunia

[Radni 1,089]

It's really hard to read this post when you do line by line by line and not just a paragraph.

My apologies then t'was typed off an iPhone and found it easier to understand myself

[Che 250]

If you remove CR then you add F2P to elevation and remove all restrictions home servers have had since EPIC opened.

Further I think the Home Servers should have their own Bonuses Now like artifacts for months long before any CR is removed.

They should also have their own Kings since they are to be on equal footing.

Basically You would have to make Both Elevation and the Home servers the exact same F2P and all.

Do I think it will work??

No I don't, I think the PvP servers on Epic will lose many players.

They might lose a few freedomers that has no interest in pvp at all, and none of your other ideas make any sense at all

[Protunia 735]

They might lose a few freedomers that has no interest in pvp at all, and none of your other ideas make any sense at all

They make complete sense.

If you are going to make Home servers basically PvP just like Elevation then the Home Servers deserve all the benefits Elevation has had for awhile before removing the CR so they can catch up to speed and organize.

Anything less is just an attempt to over run the Home Servers will full blown PvP because it has grown STALE on Elevation.

If you can't find the PvP you want on Elevation then there's a problem with the PvP to begin with on Elevation.

Turning the Home servers into Elevation will only lead to the same results in time in the long run btw.

Edited March 29, 2013 by Protunia

[Radni 1,089]

They might lose a few freedomers that has no interest in pvp at all, and none of your other ideas make any sense at all

I think they make sense in a way..

The freedomers you refer to are just people who will PvP, but choose to stay out of the brunt action

[Che 250]

They make complete sense.

If you are going to make Home servers basically PvP just like Elevation then the Home Servers deserve all the benefits Elevation has had for awhile before removing the CR so they can catch up to speed and organize.

Anything less is just an attempt to over run the Home Servers will full blown PvP because it has grown STALE on Elevation.

If you can't find the PvP you want on Elevation then there's a problem with the PvP to begin with on Elevation.

Turning the Home servers into Elevation will only lead to the same results in time.

Home servers have a huge benefit, enemies cannot plant deeds there, there are no enemy guard towers, they probably have no horses and so on...

[Protunia 735]

Home servers have a huge benefit, enemies cannot plant deeds there, there are no enemy guard towers, they probably have no horses and so on...

QQ

Answer me this much did Elevation Kings get Money from deeds on the home Servers over the last 18 months?

Just trying to figure out the King money bit here and how that adds up.

I know no one on Home Server was laden with extra funds from the game.

There are many things Elevation has had for a long time that has given them far more benefits then those you try to use to make it look like things are tough on players coming from there to the Home servers.

It's not as simple as turning off the CR and saying ok now we can raid em even better now.

All this after he just made some changes to PvP less than what?? a week ago?

In the end you will want merchants on Home Servers Lootable as well.

Fix Elevation first.

Edited March 29, 2013 by Protunia

[Che 250]

QQ

Answer me this much did Elevation Kings get Money from deeds on the home Servers over the last 18 months?

/>http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/77707-skirmishesrandom-kills-pvp-only-part-deux/
/>http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/53297-skirmishesrandom-kills-pvp-only/

No results found for 'protunia'.

I rest my case.

[Protunia 735]

http://forum.wurmonl...only-part-deux/

http://forum.wurmonl...kills-pvp-only/

No results found for 'protunia'.

I rest my case.

You have no case other than your own agenda.

[Che 250]

You have no case other than your own agenda.

Which is more pvp on a pvp cluster, and your agenda is less pvp on a pvp cluster