Item Count Per Floor Level

[Protunia 735]

This all gets back to items and the making of lots of items.........large carts seem to be working fine for me.

For some reason we are at this problem again of too many items which is why BsB's were made it the first place.

Now we are at too many other types of items even though more have been added to bsb's

Faster decay...Item number restrictions....more bulk items....

At some point something has to give so he made reductions in the number of items allowed per tile per floor with the new houses.

Personally i would rather he make the game run better then address making more items useable per tile.

If its fixable let him have some time to get it fixed right.

[Vroomfondel 1,128]

Long ago Rolf admitted that database optimization is his weak point in programming. Perhaps the next person he hires could be an optimization specialist to help with this problem, so we don't keep having it come up again and again as more people and more items come into the game.

[whykillme 1,621]

So still not fixed? Its taking a long time...

[Wulfgar 1,127]

So still not fixed? Its taking a long time...

You think a 4 page feedback thread with weak complaints will do it? We haven't had 12 different threads in Town Hall and Suggestions&Ideas yet, so I doubt this will get "fixed".

[whykillme 1,621]

You think a 4 page feedback thread with weak complaints will do it? We haven't had 12 different threads in Town Hall and Suggestions&Ideas yet, so I doubt this will get "fixed".

I think the issue is pretty clear without 50 topics needed to be made lol... you're saying that the people here are the only ones with normal sized houses and more then 5 items on a tile? Because if thats true, this wouldnt be a needed change because its only a handfull of people spamming items on tiles anyway, so might aswell revert it.

Edited March 20, 2013 by whykillme

[Kegan 3,926]

I think the issue is pretty clear without 50 topics needed to be made lol... you're saying that the people here are the only ones with normal sized houses and more then 5 items on a tile? Because if thats true, this wouldnt be a needed change because its only a handfull of people spamming items on tiles anyway, so might aswell revert it.

The only ones that care enough to post it looks like anyway.

[whykillme 1,621]

The only ones that care enough to post it looks like anyway.

Yea apperntly, or others just hope this gets changed and that its temporarily

Edited March 20, 2013 by whykillme

[Keldun 335]

Well for me it's not so much a problem with the rendering of items, but the sheer amount of data that is present in local that seems hard to handle. Plus I hate to see knots of couple dozen barrels all mashed together. It's just visually ridiculous.

So I kinda like that people are forced to keep things tidy and sane.

However a limit of 5 is ridiculous in any way or form, it might be ok to not have more than 4 bsb on a tile but try to add a sign announce contents and a lamp for light an you are already over, but you could easily line up say 25 small barrels on one tile.

If anything there needs to be an item limit for non pile items based on size of item and possible with some collision detection.

but an arbitrary limit against server/client load is just wrong.

Edited March 20, 2013 by Keldun

[Kegan 3,926]

I think he is trying to avoid the very things shown in whykillme's pics but to be far it looks like he had just moved all his stuff into a new house and had not had time to unpack yet. That said the 5 is a little to hard of a limit i think it needs to be a little more per tile. As for me personally i could live with 10 pretty easy and do now.

Edited March 20, 2013 by Kegan

[Wiro 370]

The issue is not that I want 20 items on every tile in my house. The issue is that there's certain to be one tile out of a hundred that requires 20+ items on one tile...

[Keldun 335]

maybe not 5 per tile then, but rather 5 x tile count per house level total. Would still be the same amount of items in one house, but you can better distribute.

[whykillme 1,621]

Whats the diffrence if i place 5 barrels on 20 floors to match a 100 or just put 100 on 1 floor? Nothing is (Or any other item, forge, bsb, med rugs etc).

Edited March 20, 2013 by whykillme

[Keldun 335]

Well the difference would be between putting 100 barrels on your 20 tiles, or 2000 barrels, which can, when taken to the extreme, be a significant difference on server and client load. It's the same reason why we have piles in the first place, instead of for example dealing with all 2000 planks, the game only has to deal with 20 piles most of the time.

[whykillme 1,621]

Well the difference would be between putting 100 barrels on your 20 tiles, or 2000 barrels, which can, when taken to the extreme, be a significant difference on server and client load. It's the same reason why we have piles in the first place, instead of for example dealing with all 2000 planks, the game only has to deal with 20 piles most of the time.

Make it count whatever you have on the tile and above it and make that a maximum total of 100 instead of limiting every tile to 5 as was said before

[Alyeska 2,621]

Well the difference would be between putting 100 barrels on your 20 tiles, or 2000 barrels, which can, when taken to the extreme, be a significant difference on server and client load. It's the same reason why we have piles in the first place, instead of for example dealing with all 2000 planks, the game only has to deal with 20 piles most of the time.

For the server it doesnt matter at all if an item is on the floor or in someone's cart. It's whenever someone comes near it has to start rendering that there is an effect for the client of whoever needs to load it. However, there is another system already in place for this. There is a limit on how far away items render - inside a house, for all items, this is 6 tiles. That is to protect the client from simply crashing due to too many items it has to render.

This has nothing to do with balance or looks, this is about "rendering issues" - due to the item count on multistory levels - an issue that should be resolved through fixing bugs, not through placing in hard caps or nerfs. This most likely means items are going invisible or are dissapearing in piles. I hope that this is merely a temporary solution until Rolf fixes the underlying issue.

[Hula_Girl 266]

Ok, I've been rough in my previous post, so here's the balanced comment:

Limiting decoration items to 5 per tile has significant negative impact on our gameplay, so I believe there are reasons for that. But what are those reasons?

This is the annoying part: not the limit itself - limits change - but the lack of comment from the developer. Mr. Rolf, if you just suddenly (total surprise!) change the mechanics so much, and put "This and this has changed, period." in changelog, then from players' perspective it's just a grief! We don't perceive it as a solution to any problem. We don't see any development here. We are caught pants down with our houses littered with unmovable items.

Share your reasons with us, this way we can come up with better "ideas and suggestions", and actually work together on improving the game. I'm sure there are better solutions for the problem than "5 items/tile", but we can't suggest anything if we don't know what is going on.

[Elen 1,013]

I guess I'm going to be the one to agree with the devs on this one, having 20 barrels on a tile all overlapping each other looks stupid and isn't realistic. Since its much harder to program a smart item drop system (tell me one game that can handle that well) I can certainly understand the limit.

[Phyko 17]

Well elen u can fit 7*7 small barrels on a tile without having them overlapping but as mentioned before i am with u when saying having items overlap does (often) look stupid and shouldnt be possible ... but the limit is not set for looks but for stability of the client (less rendering) ... I guess that the rendering does render anything wich is in a 5 tile radius , doesnt matter on wich lvl it is or if it even can be seen or not - to overcome that problem ,i guess they work on a raytrace, wich is kinda hard to accomplish since the game mechanics are in 2d and not in 3d wich would be needed to make a proper raytrace. I guess the second obtion for them would be to not show anything wich is on a other lvl.... this would kinda look worse then the 5 item limit in my opinion...

as always just guessing - i have never looked on the code and so cant judge where the problem is - just guess where it could be

greetings , Phyko

[Elen 1,013]

I shudder to thin kof how much pickup/drop effort it would take to get 49 barrels without overlap heh.

[Phyko 17]

hehe ^^ i like to sort my barrels sadly some were in use so there are just 20 aligned in the moment , and cant drop them back so will not pick up any and u can push pull small barrels as well

Edited March 21, 2013 by Phyko

[Miretta 1,415]

15 are allowed per tile now

[Motasolo 2]

All my items in my 2x2 are stuck and cannot be moved, worst patch ever!

[Zuuma 42]

15 are allowed per tile now

Guess not, still have the 5 limit. Maybe you did outside the house...

[ago 470]

It will be 15 according to http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/77971-upcoming-changes/

[exelsiar 3]

ahh 15 is a much more reasonable number, may not really be high enough for some advanced decoration usage, but that's outside my expertise so can't really say anything other than, thanks for listening rolf and crew :3