I need you..... to tell me some info!

[punishlife 449]

So to cut a long story short, i'm about to start a lil community project to help new/unsure players, essentially i'll be creating a forum guide about trading in game, more of an accurate price checker but with some other helpful tips, and whilst i can do the bulk side of things myself, i would need help in other areas off other experienced players. Such as armour and tool and weapon prices, plus prices of spells, such as enchanted grass plus enchantments, collapsing etc. We have so many fields to cover and i figured the more info we get, the more accurate and helpful the guide will be. So if you're willing to help and share your experience, either pm me or leave a comment and i'll arrange a group message or discord so we can collaborate together and make something good for the community.

 

This is all in relation to post in spoiler, you can see my comment on page 4

Spoiler

 

 

For those that do want to help, if you have experience with trading in game, either buying or selling, if you let me know which type you did i.e i sold enchanted tools.

 

Thanks for your time and i look forward to hearing back off you

 

[Odynn 2,248]

hard to give a price check on anything these days seeing that absolutely everyone do their own prices and they are all slowly but certainly going toward 0. I've been doing imps on blacksmithing / weaponsmtihing / platesmithing / chain / leather / shields and nowadays I'm not even sure of the value on those trades. value is volatile as heck, specially when someone is skilling up a skill and underselling everyone else.

 

good luck for your project however.

[Capi 895]

I mean. It makes sense. More and more people get really high skills and offer their products. Simple supply and demand. 

But there are things that are pretty static. That mostly applies to bulk work though. The rule of thumb 10i/action is still pretty much valid. People usually give a little discount though.

Edited June 2, 2017 by Capi

[punishlife 449]

Yeah i do grasp that its a fluctuating market, so it's not to be taken as the gospel truth, its something that can be updated constantly if there are drastic changes with the economy. My idea was to give examples using common templates (the 10i per action means bricks are usually 2s as its 1s to mine shards and 1s to cut into bricks) so that way new players can get a better idea of everything.

 

In the end it will just be a guide, not a rule book, so each player can ask whatever price they like, its their right and with supply and demand, anything is possible.

 

 

[punishlife 449]

Yeah it's all about tailoring it to new players, to give them a better understanding and a base guideline to go off.

my input on another topic about trade which fuelled all this

Quote

Just throwing my 2 copper in as i've spent the last 4 years as a bulk provider, but one thing we could do to help trade chat, is create a generalised template of prices of items, obviously it will fluctuate with supply and demand, so its not to be taken word for word, but certain things have a standard price (which players can reduce or increase if they want) like how most things are 10i per action. Bricks are 2s per 1k (1s to mine the shards, 1s to cut into bricks), mortar 2.5s per k (1s to dig clay, 50c to dig sand, 1s to combine) once again, these are examples based on the 10i action template. Obviously people will sell cheaper to guarantee a sale, but whilst its their price, it doesn't necessarily affect the entire market. If we can create some kind of list or something that is in tutorial or pops up in the trade chat on log in for players then maybe it can help steer away from false pc's.

 

[Outlaw 697]

10i/action even seems to be fading.

Noticing more and more people 'undercut' it, especially with dirt. (Probably due to nahjo)

 

Crops too are tough to price. The old 1s/1k is long gone with them. Somewhere around 0.7-0.9s/1k depending on quantity and quality from what I see most of the time.

 

A huge factor when determining the price is how long you wish to wait.

You could argue crops are still 1s/1k, if you're willing to wait 2 months to make a sale.

You will need some sort of 'at this price, guaranteed to sell within X days/weeks', otherwise it is likely your price is too high. (Especially for what should be fairly liquid assets)

 

As for enchants....boy...they're all over the place right now.

I've bought 85coc tools for as low as 20 copper to upwards of 60 copper each. That's huge variation.

I would say for botd/woa/coc, only 95+ casts seem to have any sort of close pricing structure between sellers...

Edited June 2, 2017 by Outlaw

[punishlife 449]

5 minutes ago, Outlaw said:

10i/action even seems to be fading.

Noticing more and more people 'undercut' it, especially with dirt. (Probably due to nahjo)

 

Crops too are tough to price. The old 1s/1k is long gone with them. Somewhere around 0.7-0.9s/1k depending on quantity and quality from what I see most of the time.

 

A huge factor when determining the price is how long you wish to wait.

You could argue crops are still 1s/1k, if you're willing to wait 2 months to make a sale.

You will need some sort of 'at this price, guaranteed to sell within X days/weeks', otherwise it is likely your price is too high. (Especially for what should be fairly liquid assets)

Yeah thats an aspect i was thinking of, listing the materials and their previous market prices (like with the dirt) and have an updated coloumn with more recent prices, to reflect that (you can sell 1k dirt for 1s but players sell for 70-80c to guarantee a sale) that way the new players can get an understanding and adjust their prices in a more... reasonable way. So they dont accidentally ask for 2s for 1k clay (not to control the flow of trade but to help them get more successful transactions)

 

[Wonka 438]

there's also a lot of variability in terms of delivery - bulk dirt or crops may well sell at 1s/k if that comes with delivery, particularly for a small order.  Enchants are pretty much impossible, aside from to-order, as there's always a bunch of yard sales going on in WTS, where people will undercut the 'standard' prices by a mile just to clean out their junk.  You could take an average of a bunch of merchant threads, weighting towards the more established sellers, I guess.

 

But trying to put a 'standard' price on anything aside from bulks oversimplifies what is a very dynamic market - you'd be better off explaining how to get an idea of what the current prices are at any given time (i.e. how to check what people are charging right now, and how to draw conclusions from that).  It's like saying that skilling mining over 40 should switch from rock to iron - that's an oversimplification, as there's a lot more to it than just skill X = vein Y, and leading newbies to believe it's that simple does them a disservice.

[punishlife 449]

That's a good point, it's why i want to create one with others, so we can cover parts that would get missed if it was individually done, like i see delivery as an individuals choice, i have my own set prices for it, that i wouldnt expect another person to do.

 

In relation to the standard pricing, i was thinking more in line with bulk on that, as thats where my experience is, which is why i want to get input from players in other areas.

[Wonka 438]

You're missing my point, I think - I'm saying that (for example) saying that a rare hammer has a 'standard' price of 7s isn't actually helpful; it's better to explain how to go about working out what the current price is (ask on trade, use search to find people selling them in WTS/WTA/merchants, weighting for high ql, enchants, etc).  There are a very few things that have standard prices (referrals spring to mind); some things don't move very fast (bulks, mainly); for everything else, you need to suck it and see. 

 

Also, are you planning to continuously keep updating your guide over time?  If not, it's likely to be misleading at best inside of 2-4 months.

[punishlife 449]

I do get your point, i just didn't want to touch on that too much till a few other aspects had been hashed out, like im all for ideas, like

5 minutes ago, Wonka said:

working out what the current price is (ask on trade, use search to find people selling them in WTS/WTA/merchants, weighting for high ql, enchants, etc)

is absolutely stellar.

 

Hopefully i can get some help, but i will be keeping it updated for as long as i play

[punishlife 449]

The current plan for this is, take on community suggestions, recruit/get info off other traders, build guide, submit to forum staff for review (tweak if needed) then post, take further community suggestions and update as needed.

 

I didn't want to go into the messy details on this post, was hoping to discuss the actual content of it with the fellow creators, hence not going into too great of a detail just yet, as it is still in its baby steps

[Aeryck 862]

Can we just please all agree that gems are not 1c per quality any more.

[punishlife 449]

Only gem i sold in the past, like 2 years, was under 10ql and was at the usual price, but i'll save that hot mess for once this project is underway

[McGarnicle 1,463]

10i per action is not ever calculated correctly. For example, to make 1k mortar it is 500 clay digs, 50 sand digs and 1k combines for a total of 1550 actions. So by that logic mortar should cost 1.55s per 1k.

[Niki 2,278]

If you completely avoid the rare/supreme market in this guide, I can see this guide working. Perhaps a google spreadsheet with the general outline of prices in bulk/imps/enchants.

 

As for the rare/supreme market it's hard to properly gauge, a rare needle isn't the same as a rare hammer. I sell rare blanks from around 4-6s usually depending on what it is. I think a supreme blank tool should be priced 15-30 depending on the item. Not everything shares that, the market is flooded with items and no one is buying. Undercutting is happening all over because no one is buying. Not enough people want to spend money.

 

Edited June 2, 2017 by Niki

[Kegan 3,926]

I do think all the new things like runes and imbued has hindered the rare market some because the tools are not as disposable as they once were. In the past you could just sell a used tool and replace it with a better one but with all the new things we have now that is not as viable as it once was with just enchants.

 

I don't even use rare tools anymore because the high enchanted regular tools are so cheap you can just get a good replacement for 30-50c if you keep your eyes out and I dont grind for skill anyway. 

[Finnn 3,301]

niru's .. scored once again with the latest auction emptying coin pockets and satchels..

That was one other reason to affect the prices of most items, just no bulk casts and goods.

[punishlife 449]

1 hour ago, Niki said:

If you completely avoid the rare/supreme market in this guide, I can see this guide working. Perhaps a google spreadsheet with the general outline of prices in bulk/imps/enchants.

 

As for the rare/supreme market it's hard to properly gauge, a rare needle isn't the same as a rare hammer. I sell rare blanks from around 4-6s usually depending on what it is. I think a supreme blank tool should be priced 15-30 depending on the item. Not everything shares that, the market is flooded with items and no one is buying. Undercutting is happening all over because no one is buying. Not enough people want to spend money.

 

Yeah i was thinking about excluding those as it changes too frequently to keep a steady bead on. As it stands, till i recruit more people, no format or anything has been decided, but i'll look into the pro's and con's of it

[Skyfalls 13]

You still have to include the fail rate for such items as mortar-while it is easy to make for a high skilled person its not for a new person starting out.

[Fraeya 341]

7 minutes ago, Skyfalls said:

You still have to include the fail rate for such items as mortar-while it is easy to make for a high skilled person its not for a new person starting out.

To that note then ql imps should also include the fail rate though they seem to be dipping too nowadays. E.g. 90ql used to be 1 silver flat rate, though it was massively easier for someone with 95 skill than someone with 90. However 80ql is sometimes down to as low as 25c where 80ql is still a good hour long grind from someone in their mid 70's it's 10 mins for a 90+ skill smith. (sorry for that mess of words, just woke up)

[punishlife 449]

See these are all valid things we can discuss when planning the guide out, join the team and help

[Jaz 2,665]

Very hard to say the prices. I stand with Odynn - there are a lot of insane prices. Like ships. Like some dirt cheap dirt lately. I don't even mention imps.

The base is that everyone has to set the price where it does worth for themselves to do the work instead of going out and enjoy something

This is where I stay quite steady on my pricing - that is the level I feel comfortable to drop my doings and serve the needs...

[Skyfalls 13]

I stay firm with the old prices-stick with them and encourage others to do the same.When asked for a price check for something say this is the price for this and be firm-part of problem is that doesnt happen-people are always"we used to get this amount but ive seen them as low as this"

 That is a bad answer as it looks like  u dont really know and also encourages undercutting. There will always be some who will sell low for sake of fast buck,but as long as that is minority and the main base stays firm-there will always be a market for the old prices

 

I dont really give discounts-but i always include some extra as a gift, It makes customer feel nice-also free shipping.

But I try to always stay firm on price-if it doesnt sell right away I can wait-its not going anywhere:)

[Angelklaine 4,266]

Prices will always be whatever people are willing to pay for it. This is especially true for accounts. Oftentimes you see people giving price checks, myself included, on an account, and arguments ensue about how the account is being low balled, how x or y skill is worth more than the PC stated, or how people should pay more for extra premium time. But when its time to sell, no one wants to pay the price and the account goes for a lowballed offer or just doesn't sell.

 

In reality sellers dont set the price: the buyer does. I could sell a knarr for 12 silver and it will go unsold forever until I drop the price to what someone finds worth paying. Unlike in the real world, nothing in Wurm is a necessity, and even a newbie account can craft the basics to skill up. The market can stay stagnant to exclude those that cant afford it, or it will weave its prices to match supply and demand. Thats why a crate of sand wont sell as quickly as a crate of bricks. 

 

We can sit around and debate on what something is worth, and how wrong lowering a price is, but ultimately if your buyer things its too high, lowering your price is your only solution. They don't have to buy, after all.