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belthize

Network lag in Germany

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Just now, Yldrania said:

 

Then I'm not sure what is going wrong, but if it works for others that only means it should be fixable in some way.

 

They are the biggest server hoster in Europe so they will be able to fix this for sure, but if no one keeps in touch with them, they can't solve the problem. Communication!

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Just now, Sklo:D said:

 

They are the biggest server hoster in Europe so they will be able to fix this for sure, but if no one keeps in touch with them, they can't solve the problem. Communication!

 

That's what I mean. If there is a fix that is possible to get from this server, I believe that the devs should do whatever necessary to actually fix this issue, since it not only makes Wurm unenjoyable but also causes a decrease in player numbers, which the game really can't afford.

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I have been using pingplotter to keep an eye on the router I posted above, it spends about 12-15 hrs between 2k-3k ms.

 

From my workstation.

Y7eghHe.jpg

 

From the vpn connection to paris

sTleZpc.jpg

 

(images will not insert correctly.)

 

This is the only way I can play wurm online.

 

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Ping plotter is just a pretty picture maker.  It still uses standard protocols under the hood and a standard tcp traceroute (like my original post) clearly shows that one of their hops has a serious config issue.  4 seconds is an eternity for a router, it's not a buffering/bandwidth issue it's a config issue. 

 

So sure if they want pingplotter output that's fine,  but any decent network engineer should be able to see a single traceroute report with those numbers and know that they had an issue and would then set up their own test points and begin probing in a systematic way till it's resolved.

 

So sorry, but if Hetzner needs 100s of people to submit ad hoc pingplotter results from god knows where to resolve this then they may be the biggest but they're incompetent.

 

I think the more likely scenario is they don't care.  If one person reports they can ignore it, if 10's of people report they can ignore it, if 100s of people report they can still ignore it.  If people take their money elsewhere, well that's different.

Edited by belthize

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On 1/25/2017 at 5:32 AM, Sklo:D said:

 

Promise you there is no better host than hetzner. Others will just make more problems, also hetzner provides a very good DDOS protection, which is priceless. My server has the same amount of players often more than deli, exo or the whole epic cluster, etc, and we are having almost no issues. Very stable and powerful connection, no noticeable lag most of the time.

 

You are in Austria and hetzner peer at the Vienna Internet Exchange so sure, hetzner is probably fine for you, they deliver the traffic locally to your country them selves, but for people on the other side of the world they are terrible.

 

It's not necessarily hetzner's fault directly it's that their choice of upstream providers (TATA / GTT) mean there is poor service for people far away. If Hetzner peered in north america there would likely be no issue because it would prevent and issues from crossing the atlantic or crossing USA.

 

Other hosts for example OVH, Softlayer, Leaseweb peer at internet exchanges all over the world in North America, Europe, Asia, Australia etc so they control the path very close to the user, many of them also choose higher quality transit providers for example Level3 and NTT. Furthermore in the case of OVH their entire network traffic status is visible 24/7 and you rarely see any congestion http://weathermap.ovh.net/

 

On 1/25/2017 at 5:35 AM, Sklo:D said:

They are the biggest server hoster in Europe

 

Not by a long shot. Hetzner only have 2 DC's in Europe, Leaseweb have 9, OVH have 18 with like 10 more under construction, Softlayer have 20

 

OVH have over 200,000 servers in Europe alone, Leaseweb something like 140,000 - Hetzner does not even have 100,000. 

 

Hetzner's network capacity is around 1.5 tbps. OVH's is over 10 tbps. Softlayer is probably 10+ tbps since IBM bought them. 

Edited by Gavin
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Just to reiterate my routing on my primary ISP has changed, it used to go via HE.net (my ISP's upstream provider of choice, they are fairly good) but obviously hetzner has changed something and they request it travel over as6453 who my ISP peer with in California (as6453 is TATA) and TATA are useless. 

 

Tracing route to hetzner.de [213.133.107.227]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

  1    <1 ms    <1 ms    <1 ms  192.168.1.1
  2     2 ms     2 ms     2 ms  10.20.22.109
  3     2 ms     1 ms     2 ms  per-pow-stg-csw2-tg-2-4.tpgi.com.au [202.7.180.121]
  4     2 ms     2 ms     3 ms  per-pow-stg-crt2-port-channel-2.tpgi.com.au [202.7.190.113]
  5    54 ms    53 ms    53 ms  202-7-162-125.tpgi.com.au [202.7.162.125]
  6    57 ms    59 ms    59 ms  203.29.134-4.tpgi.com.au [203.29.134.4]
  7   240 ms   242 ms   233 ms  ix-ae-17-0.tcore2.SQN-San-Jose.as6453.net [64.86.21.53]
  8   388 ms   387 ms   387 ms  if-ae-1-2.tcore1.SQN-San-Jose.as6453.net [63.243.205.1]
  9     *        *        *     Request timed out.
 10   390 ms   391 ms   394 ms  if-ae-11-2.tcore2.L78-London.as6453.net [63.243.128.38]
 11   387 ms   386 ms   386 ms  if-ae-8-2.tcore2.AV2-Amsterdam.as6453.net [80.231.131.6]
 12   384 ms   384 ms   384 ms  if-ae-2-2.tcore1.AV2-Amsterdam.as6453.net [195.219.194.5]
 13   393 ms   387 ms   393 ms  if-ae-6-2.tcore1.FNM-Frankfurt.as6453.net [195.219.156.61] < 390ms to get to central Europe from Australia is pretty good, no problems so far
 14   902 ms     *        *     if-ae-7-2.tcore1.FR0-Frankfurt.as6453.net [195.219.50.1] < last hop before it enters Hetzner's network - this could either be a issue on TATA's network in Frankfurt, or it's congestion on hetzner's TATA transit link
 15   891 ms   972 ms   812 ms  195.219.219.10
 16   607 ms   1536 ms   992 ms  core11.hetzner.de [213.239.245.34]
 17   1494 ms     *      868 ms  ex9k2.rz1.hetzner.de [213.239.203.214]
 18   1025 ms   977 ms   1772 ms  www.hetzner.de [213.133.107.227]

Trace complete.

 

This is the problem. People who don't live in western Europe can't just enter hetzner's network via some cheap peering link where both your ISP and Hetzner have mountains of idle capacity even in peak time, we travel over international transit networks which are often running at capacity, in many cases intentionally to try and extort paid peering settlements from major carriers. Even thou the above trace shows 18 hops I guarantee you it's gone through 40+ routers that may not show up in traces. Again, as mentioned in my post on page 1 this is why companies like Netflix or Google setup local mirrors in every country they service because you cannot get reliable service to everyone just plugging your network in a few global transit providers, as people say the internet is a series of tubes and many of those tubes are completely broken and blocked up, the only way to get around this is to setup a PROPER network that has points of presence across the globe so you control the tubes yourselves, AKA almost every professional large scale data-center. 

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  1     2 ms     2 ms     2 ms  
  2     7 ms    11 ms     7 ms  
  3     8 ms     7 ms     7 ms  
  4    44 ms    44 ms    46 ms
  5    35 ms    37 ms    37 ms  
  7    45 ms    45 ms    42 ms  dcp-brdr-04.inet.qwest.net [67.14.28.18]
  8    34 ms    36 ms    37 ms  ix-ae-16-0.tcore2.AEQ-Ashburn.as6453.net [216.6.87.117]
  9   134 ms   136 ms   134 ms  if-ae-11-2.thar2.NJY-Newark.as6453.net [216.6.87.242]
 10   132 ms   134 ms   134 ms  if-ae-1-3.thar1.NJY-Newark.as6453.net [216.6.57.1]
 11   139 ms   129 ms   128 ms  if-ae-8-2.tcore1.LDN-London.as6453.net [66.198.70.174]
 12   123 ms   135 ms   136 ms  if-ae-17-2.tcore1.L78-London.as6453.net [80.231.130.129]
 13   137 ms   136 ms   139 ms  if-ae-3-6.tcore1.PYE-Paris.as6453.net [80.231.130.86]
 14   134 ms   135 ms   138 ms  if-ae-11-2.tcore1.PVU-Paris.as6453.net [80.231.153.49]
 15   127 ms   127 ms   127 ms  if-ae-9-2.tcore2.FNM-Frankfurt.as6453.net [195.219.87.9]
 16   135 ms   124 ms   130 ms  if-ae-4-2.tcore1.FR0-Frankfurt.as6453.net [195.219.87.18]
 17  2956 ms  2983 ms  3103 ms  195.219.219.10
 18  3370 ms  3585 ms  3647 ms  core23.hetzner.de [213.239.229.74]
 19  1887 ms  1855 ms  1832 ms  ex9k2.rz20.hetzner.de [213.239.229.10]
 20  3521 ms  3399 ms  3089 ms  xanadu.game.wurmonline.com [148.251.21.209]

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