Greyfox

Marketing plan timeline

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Remove skip aspect on tutorial. Make tutorial better by including something teaching the player to not run out and get dumped on by a rat or a spider. Profit.

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Combat UI currently is to confusing, i bet at least 50-60% of wurm players don't even understand what is being shown

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6 hours ago, Wilczan said:

Just make chinese and russian language options -> flood of players, despite it's niche game

 

On 1/23/2017 at 6:24 AM, Retrograde said:

Hi,

 

Unfortunately, Wurm was not designed with translation as an option, meaning just setting up the systems to allow it would require a complete rework of every bit of code (as the text is  in the code)

 

This means that translation is not possible, and not something we are looking at.

 

Just a bit of official info on the subject Wilczan.  As an amateur hobby programmer wannabe, I thought it was interesting ^_^

 

On 2/21/2017 at 8:45 PM, Retrograde said:
Spoiler

 

Alright, jokes and light hearted ribbing aside, let's break down a few things.

 

Blanket mass market advertsing is an archaic form of advertising and is prohibitively expensive, the only real companies that manage this are AAA games that rely on blanket coverage to get the name out there and have huge advertising budgets to back up the millions spent in development cost and input.

 

Wurm has struggled with being known in the past and online presence can be an important thing, it's the difference between "wurm? whats that?" and "wurm? i've heard of that, what's it like?" Blanket advertising across many sites and formats gets presence out there but does little to convert to actual sales, it's spending money to be a recognisable game.

 

Beyond that, you have more targeted advertising. Instead of standing in the middle of a shopping center yelling your new game name out you're approaching people in a gaming store, people who will be more interested in your product and thus spending less time and effort (money) focusing on them to attract players rather than just getting your name out there. This is where sites such as Facebook, Twitter and Reddit push their advertising, being able to identify and address your target audience all through their tools, and why we use these focuses.

 

Saying you enjoy playing MMO games as a genre is similar to saying "I like eating at restaurants" There's so many aspects of it and so many different variations around the simple mmo mechanic of multiple people online. Sandbox as a genre has also been watered down in MMO gaming, with many "sandboxes" simply being a theme park with a few options to customise, rather than the open ended self goal orientation of Wurm. This is why we use more targeted advertising through social media.

 

Modern MMOS have a huge budget behind them and is actually why so many of them fail or become pay to win quickly, they need to recoup massive development costs and after spending so much on that, advertising is just another fraction of that cost so they go with more mass market appeal.

 

So the question is "what are we doing?" With 1.3 we focused on contacting MMO sites and begin getting the game out there, updating our press information as well as beginning coordinating with other sites and ensuring that our third party information is up to date. People nowadays use three forms of reference when looking into a game, social circles, third party sites, and the site itself. Social circles is always powerful advertising, knowing someone who enjoys the game is a huge draw, as it instantly means they're not alone in this new game, it's why we use Facebook and Twitter to do all those "share and like" giveaways, not to get random people to see it but so friends of those who do play can see it.

 

Secondly there's third party sites, congregated MMO sites and things like that. With 1.3 and since I have been in contact with many of those and have had my CRA team also working on keeping those updated, ensuring that all accurate information is available to them, we're also working on other projects to help there such as giveaways and sponsoring.

Lastly, there's our site, Wurmonline.com and the forums. This is where we share the bulk of our information directly, and it's where a lot of new and prospective players will come to check out the game and ultimately decide if its worth their time and money to play. What they read on the forums shapes their view of the game and the playerbase, it's important that we focus on sharing just what is going on within the game and community and thus the weekly news/valrei int'l.

 

We track player stats across many aspects, namely new players coming into wurm via golden valley, and premium numbers. While new player counts have gone up, conversion to premium is low. This means that spending more money on blanket advertising does not solve the issue, and that there are key areas we can improve the game to maximize the effectiveness of what we spend on in advertising.

 

What are our plans for the future? Wurm Unlimited reviews have given us extra insight into the issues new players face in Wurm, namely the UI, the usual graphics complaints, and learning curve. This is why we are working on an updated UI that provides a better experience without relying on the event bar to play (A fun trick is trying to play with the event bar minimised and seeing what you can and can't do.. I need to get out more).

A new tutorial that truly showcases just what Wurm is while also helping ease players into the game and also provide better systems for learning on the go is in the works as well, and as that comes to fruition we will share more then too. Those of you who have used the unstable client know just how awesome Wurm looks with better shading and lighting, and that will be in long before the other two (soon we hope!)

 

Until then we'll continue to work on social circle incentives, competitions that can provide rewards such as premium and silver and focus on easing a few of those old gripes that players have had over the years, so when the updated UI comes we can begin our big push and ensure that the players that do join find Wurm to be a much easier game to get into.

 

We're here for the long term, and will continue to work on improving core aspects of the game and addressing existing and new player issues, we've come a long way in the past year and we look forward to seeing what comes.

 

I hope that answers the burning questions about why we aren't on billboards and site wide ads, larger advertising rounds will occur during major updates and will remain options down the line.

 

 

Truly awesome response Retro, not that you're losing sleep over my approval :P.  While it may have taken you valuable time to craft it, this is the kind of Public Relations communication truly worthy of a special, original, unique indie game like Wurm.  Ka'plah!

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Okay Retro, that was actually really good.  It was professional rather then snarky.  Thumbs up on a professional reply.   Lets have more like that in the future.


Now I go back to waiting to see one of these ads. 


 

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On 2/19/2017 at 1:20 PM, As_I_Decay said:

I haven't done the tutorial in years, but it should go back to being that "forced path" tutorial. The one where it forced you through a predetermined path, in which you had to press the climb button to get over a hill to complete the tutorial and reach the portals to the actual game.

The problem in today's era is that nobody has patience or the attention span to read/sit through anything. Most of the new blood that comes in clicks through whatever they can to get to "playing the game", then they have no idea in how to play or which direction to take (you'll see this happen time after time in youtube playthroughs of other games too).

Force them to learn. No entry into the game unless they actually pay attention and complete the "training". And if they quit, so what? They weren't going to hang around long anyway with that sort of attention span.

 

 I did go back to help a newb in the tutorial, because he couldn't figure out how to work the signs and book of wisdom. It's really not too bad right now, other than that. Much of Wurm is just learning by doing, though a guide to cooking and maybe a respawning small mob you can fight would help a lot. 

 

On the subject of "kids today" and lack of attention span, while we do seem to have a lot of younger players who do love the slow pace, I can't imagine that advertising to gamer types, as a group, will lead to a lot of long term players. We have a lot of middle to older aged players who stick around, especially couples and families. We should be targeting that group, not the what's new, what's cool crowd. Maybe Wurm-sponsored YouTube channels (I swear all my child having friends watch MC let's plays with their kids) and targeting players of philosophically related games that might not be MMOs? (Sims? Empire building games?) Eh, just my thoughts. Send in the wolves.  

 

ETA: Also, Wurm swag! I want an official Wurm shirt (ladies sizes, please!) and bumper sticker. Free advertising is free advertising. 

Edited by NeeNee
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1 hour ago, NeeNee said:

 Maybe Wurm-sponsored YouTube channels 

 

 

I'd like to see Gamerster4Life get some sort of semi official recognition and thanks. Do you know he has done over 174 tutorial videos on Wurm Unlimited alone? I think it would have been money well spent to have offered him lifetime free subscription to Wurm ONLINE in hopes of getting something similar focusing on WO. Then LINK those videos where new players can find them fast. A permanent link easy to see immediately on front page of Wurmpedia would be good. I would also make an offer to Factional Fight & Milosanx. They do great work and have by now a very good body of work, Milosanx's Twenty First Things to Do In Wurm is a great starting point for new players.   Some sort of deal offering these videomakers ingame time or even silver for every video posted or something. The problem is, "not all wurm videos are created equal," and there might end up being conflict about who gets offered these deals. But those three are tops in my book because they have already demonstrated commitment and quality and a deep love of the game that is ... infectious. Perhaps if devs coded a way to watch these videos ingame though the Book of Knowledge -- which was a 2014 game addition that had some faint promise but never quite lived up to its potential. I bet most current players have no idea what it is or how to open it again. 

 

 

New players do not want a "showcase village" showing off what high level players can do. Thats maybe fine for starter towns that they will revisit again often  but less impressive as part of a one-time "tutorial". When they portal into a "showcase village" it really does not make much impact compared to some other MMO developer made starter towns, even if you are telling them it is all "player made." It makes no real impact, all they have to compare to is other games, and Wurm does not always come out on top in such comparisons.  So they look at your "model showcases" and yawn and hurry to get into the actual game. Where they can DO something. Only to find out the only thing they can actually do, is .. forage and botanize. So they do that for about 10 minutes then log off. 

 

What DOES make an impact on learning, is actually getting a hands on chance to try things in a lesson type format. Making a clay bowl, chopping a tree after comparing tree ages, making a campfire were all parts of the old tutorial and were all things that made new players feel comfortable with the game.  Reading some sign is, frankly, bull puckey,  just link them to Wurmpedia if you only are going to plant  83 sparkly signs to click on. They have nothing to "hook" that information on, no personal experience to relate it to, and as a result it is gone from short term memory before they even finish the next sign, if they even figure how to click on the sparkles. We might as well get rid of public education and just hand out encyclopedias to all kids if that sort of system worked. It doesn't. 

 

Players who get a chance to make their own little 2x2 shack house, will then feel more excited by their results to try to increase their skills and improve it further by mimicing some of the more ambitious projects they see others doing;. They have something in their own experience to hook new learning on top of.  Showing them a "showcase model village" and telling that one day month and months from now if they work really hard, and read lots of signs, maybe they can do similar after a half year of deadly dull grinding, is far less of an impact.

 

Serious now, who wants to stay around for that?

 

You can also make an optional ingame tutorial similar to 7 Days To Die which players can also choose to ignore if they want, or can work on in little nibble size bursts. It gives them a series of little hands one projects that help make the game feel comfortable and familiar quite fast. It is a thousand times better than what Wurm has now, which is mostly nothing but a fancy model village, a hundred sparkle signs, and an unfinished Book Of Knowledge that someone lost interest in finishing after starting three years ago.  

 

 

 

 

Edited by Brash_Endeavors
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Just a thought I've been tossing around in my head about the tutorial, and since that's what this topic has sort of turned into I suppose it's apporopriate to voice it here. And if someone else has suggested this, I apologize, I haven't read the entire thread word for word.

 

I think starter gear should be given as reward for completing certain tasks within the tutorial. For example, you start out with nothing but a hatchet when you spawn into GV. Your first task: chop a tree (an easy tree--one log). When that is done, your reward is a carving knife in your inventory! Then your next task is to use that to make a kindling. When that is done, your reward is a steel and flint! Then, your next task: make a campfire. When that is done, you get a pottery bowl! So on and so forth until all of the "newbie" gear is achieved. 

 

It not only allows new players to learn what their tools do right off the bat without overwhelming them with an inventory of things they have no idea how to use, but it gives them a sense of accomplishment: "Look at all the things I HAVE EARNED, and I've only been in the game half an hour!!" 

Edited by Joelle
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This is actually similar to the tutorial  they had years ago, where players would actually make a mallet, make a campofire, make a clay bowl, etc. they couldn't actually keep any of those when they left GV but at least they knew how to do it again. 

 

If I understand correctly,  they felt it was too hard to have automated coding that auto cleaned up after all the newbs made their little messes -- so they simply removed everything that left a trace,  and put up nice sanitary signs and removed the ability to cut down trees or dig stuff up. Trees are messy.   My sometimes 'difficult' daughter was quite proud of the fact she once made a large Unfinished Corbita in the former GV tutorial, which impressed her immensely and got her fascinated about what else she could make in this new game  -- but frankly also rather cluttered the area for other new players. She was the one who first alerted me to the new so-called "sign tutorial" with a series of 'sadface" emotes " D: Mom what did they DO ?? "   (yes, troublemakers run in our family) 

 

I like the idea of offering newbie gear as rewards for competing learning tasks, while veterans can run their alts through all that and pass on the newbie gear if they want.

 

 

Edited by Brash_Endeavors

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Wurm Unlimited has killed online and its not coming back people. Why would new players pay a sub for a game they can buy one time and play for free? I have personally only stuck to Online because of the years I have put into my characters and because a few good friends have stayed due to the same reasoning. The mass majority of the friends I had who played WO have moved to WU. New players have no ties to WO and WU is by far the better option for them.

 

Wurm Online, although I love it, is all its ever gonna be. A slowly developed niche game on a old and now pretty horrible platform for this type of game. 

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Reworking tutorial is like neverending cycle in Wurm. I remember very well, when there was old tutorial, then people were complaining about how complex it was and how it was "driving people away". So current tutorial was made with just few signs, to keep it simple, so it wouldn't "drive people away". But now it is again driving people away.

 

While I understand the need for feedback. Trying to act only on feedback will make you(devs) run in circles.

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I am not so sure it was "WU that killed WO". I know that seems "well duh obvious" to a lot of people, but hear me out first.

 

First, what many people forget (or choose to ignore) is that WO sub numbers were already starting a serious downward spiral well before Rolf announced anything about WU. In fact a lot of it actually started with the 2013 subscription increase  that made WO one of the most expensive MMOs of all time (considering premium, alts and deeds). New servers like Xanadu and updates like bridges+multistory housing slowed that decline for a short time and even triggered short sporadic upward bursts, but new servers also brought their own problems by spreading out population. Every 'fix" the dev team tried, had only short term improvements before the decline started yet again. 

 

Wurm Online's biggest premium player increase of all time, the one that reduces all other ups-and-downs to sporadic little nothing-burger blips on the radar, was NOT a huge megadollar advertising spree, but simply opening the server to F2P players in 2010/2011. Until then, WO was a true niche game with a fairly consistent 1500-2000 subscription level.  A large number of premium players had fought tooth and nail about letting those "freeloader F2P parasites' play the game (outside of a small 'trial island" where they would not bother the regulars) , predicting the people who actually paid would soon leave WO forever in disgust because of griefing and other issues.  Free To Play, they warned, was gonna kill Wurm Online. But an odd thing happened in opening the gates to the "riffraff" -- Wurm actually took off like a rocket. People made new deeds and bought more subscriptions and alts and while many of their villagers were F2P people who couldn't drive carts or ride horses,  the game suddenly went from sleepy to dynamic.  Back then, a five speed horse would go for about 5-6 silver, a knarr i think went for about 45 silver. People owned not just one deed, but MANY deeds. I even got up to eight deeds once myself -- it was rather addicting and became hard to resist. A lot of the F2p players went on to become premium themselves, villages often had 10-20  members online at one time, and when new players said they couldn't find any place to deed, they were not kidding. Independence sometimes had 1200+ players on at a time, causing tensions between people who were trying to throw money at the game by buying more and more and more deeds in a limited amount of space. So Rolf opened Deli and Celebration and Exodus and Epic, and numbers went up up and up.  

 

Shortly before the 2013 price increase, WO had a paid subscriber base of almost 6500 people each month,  That is an all time high that it never reached again. Then came the price increase and after that, up and down seesaws to try to stabilize an ongoing decline. Small servers helped a lot and even big-ass Xanadu  helped get nubers back up, but the game never again came close to 6500 monthly subs. And that was four years ago. There were upturns and downturns and upturns again. By the time WU was announced, WO was down to about 4500 players. Today 18 months later, it's down to 3200-3300. but that's not just because of WU, that is part of a pattern that started years and years ago. 

 

So what lesson did we learn, if we learned anything any? We learned that WO flourished when it welcomed new players even ones without much money, because an energetic population is infectious ... and a stagnant one is too. It faltered when it became (again) rather exclusive and again tried to 'punish" the "leeches". People kept saying F2P would bring griefers, but I swear in my years I never saw any griefers on the scale of some "veteran" players with multiple premium accounts and a grudge against free players. In fact many of the people who were actually 'playing for free" were the longtime veterans who had made moneymaking  into an art form, buying and selling deeds and traders and accounts and selling silver every month for real cash. The  people bringing in new cash were mostly new players, but they soon learned it was not truly a matter of just putting in their time till they too became a success,  as Wurm simply would NEVER need 400 shipbuilders and 300 horsebreeders and 450 carpenters. The "jobs" open for most of the new players -- making bricks and working for veteran players. Some of course broke out of that and became true 'rags to riches" examples, but they worked damn hard for that success -- and to be frank, most people do not want to turn a game into a fulltime job   WO economy has always had a bit of an unsustainable  "pyramid scheme" model to it, with a growing number of extremely highly skilled veterans making money on the slowing and shrinking pool of new players.  Eventually, the 'bubble" popped.

 

Before WU was even announced, Rolf had even started backing off on saying that the WO servers would run forever no matter what, and starting to say he 'couldn't guarantee it". 

 

Only THEN was Wurm Unlimited unveiled, a move that took most players by surprise. WU gave code club a huge injection of cash that made possible things like developing  updates like rifts and runes and cooking and other things that again slowed and (yes again only temporarily) reversed the declines. Without that cash  input for new development,  Wurm Online would likely be in an even worse place today.

 

Because before Wurm Unlimited, it was NOT growing -- it was shrinking.   The solution was to go back to the success of 2010-2011, and expand the player base by opening the doors to more people.  Which is hard to do in a niche game that prides itself on never giving in to "easymode".  Yes there are people who left WO for WU to save on costs, but I also know a large number of people who now invest in both games, keeping up their deed upkeep on WO and periodically re-premming their characters to enjoy "first looks" at the new updates or take part in anniversary 'gifts', while also buying WU to try out a more relaxed and casual gameplay where taking a short break now and then doesn't ruin everything they've worked for, and younger people without a lot of money can jump into the playerbase and run around excited and energized and fight and ride horses  without having to grind out bricks for 29354 hours.  Wurm went from 4000 or so players and shrinking each year, to 3300+49,000 players, and overall growing.  

 

WO was is and ever will be, a niche game.  

 

WU simply made it a wider niche. 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Brash_Endeavors
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1 hour ago, rixk said:

Reworking tutorial is like neverending cycle in Wurm. I remember very well, when there was old tutorial, then people were complaining about how complex it was and how it was "driving people away". So current tutorial was made with just few signs, to keep it simple, so it wouldn't "drive people away". But now it is again driving people away.

 

While I understand the need for feedback. Trying to act only on feedback will make you(devs) run in circles.

 The issue has been both the User interface being to clunky and too confusing

 

Old tutorials never could resolve the issues for most players

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The tutorial has been redone twice during my time playing wurm; its not increased player numbers noticeably.  WU was the nail in a coffin long since made (from high ql pine).

 

Brash_Endevors elucidates the real issue above; the player explosion dropped off once prices went up.  People vote with their wallets, and WO is asking a lot; most folks admit you need 2+ premium toons + a deed (very few folks run microdeeds, its "giant horse farm" or nothing).  To be quite frank you could buy the full versions of ESO and GW2 with what it costs to play wurm for a year AND you'd still have some change left over to buy WU so you can play on one of the many established private servers.

 

Drop the price of premium, or move to a "premium = convenience" model and you might be onto something.  But, of course, that will never happen.

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Which I've always found kind of funny, because it's completely illogical. If you're spending a hundred hours doing something, what's ten dollars? I certainly hope your time is worth more than that! 

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8 hours ago, Etherdrifter said:

The tutorial has been redone twice during my time playing wurm; its not increased player numbers noticeably.  WU was the nail in a coffin long since made (from high ql pine).

 

Brash_Endevors elucidates the real issue above; the player explosion dropped off once prices went up.  People vote with their wallets, and WO is asking a lot; most folks admit you need 2+ premium toons + a deed (very few folks run microdeeds, its "giant horse farm" or nothing).  To be quite frank you could buy the full versions of ESO and GW2 with what it costs to play wurm for a year AND you'd still have some change left over to buy WU so you can play on one of the many established private servers.

 

Drop the price of premium, or move to a "premium = convenience" model and you might be onto something.  But, of course, that will never happen.

Those two games you mentioned have entire microtransaction systems in place. GW2 constantly releases expansions you are required to pay extra for, and ESO has their own "premium" payment method (unless changed). WO only requires you to pay 8e a month, which to date, is the cheapest subscription of any game I have ever played, nearly half of what other games charge per month. Deeds are only a convenience and not a necessity ( The Southwind guys have been living outside the perimeter of Southwind Port since long before I met them), and you can easily pay for your premium time with referrals or in game money. Take an afternoon of chopping bricks and you can make those 10 silver easy.

 

I can't think of any other model I rather see WO having. Cheaper premium costs would mean no money left for development and will be the death of the game. Unless they start some micro transaction system. Would you be okay with the devs selling pickaxes that take no damage, like GW2 does? Perhaps stacks of oak logs? Or do you think they will get rich with little dresses and pretty barding for the mounts, given how sophisticated the WO art is?

 

Careful what you wish for. 

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20 hours ago, Brash_Endeavors said:

I am not so sure it was "WU that killed WO". I know that seems "well duh obvious" to a lot of people, but hear me out first.

An interesting analysis that followed of the general evo-devolution of Wurm Online. Yet in the end at our current state *nothing* has killed WO, as it continues onward at its slow pace offering something attractive for certain types of players, cycling in and out along the circuitous cobble pathways.

 

What Wurm Unlimited does offer that seems more attractive beyond the mere price difference are many options of playstyle of the same basic game. This is what I think pulls more of the attention to it from current and new players of Wurm. Yes, some play both versions now but I think what holds us to WO is just the nostalgic days of reflection that it now contains. I find myself playing WU much more nowadays because of the faster pace there that enables one to accomplish much more along the building lines.

 

Certainly Wu has drawn existing players from WO and reduced the population and income. How long WO will last none can say, so perhaps it is just best to enjoy what it has to offer and let those in control of its future path do so. If it ever does truly die and shut down now the legacy can live in on within Wurm Unlimited, So I find that this provides a hope for more enjoyable times that never existed before it came to be; thus, WU has truly been a wonderful thing for those who enjoy the game of Wurm.

 

Happy Trails

=Ayes=

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Subscription rates are a minor issue. Don't think so one-dimensional.

 

Wurm can be as complex as you make it. It's a wholly niche game for sure, but doesn't have to be driven into a dark corner where subscriptions and cash flows stagnate.  I've mentioned it before, but wurm is in it's decline phase (lifecycle) and without clear understanding and determination of why, it will only exasperate the issue at hand. A UI overhaul will completely fail to draw unless fundamental changes are made. Otherwise, obsolescence continues despite the good ideas thrown forward.

 

WU was a giant failure long-term, and ill thought out. If it was just a simple cash out, then it was greatly successful depending who you ask.

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20 hours ago, Angelklaine said:

Those two games you mentioned have entire microtransaction systems in place. GW2 constantly releases expansions you are required to pay extra for, and ESO has their own "premium" payment method (unless changed). WO only requires you to pay 8e a month, which to date, is the cheapest subscription of any game I have ever played, nearly half of what other games charge per month. Deeds are only a convenience and not a necessity ( The Southwind guys have been living outside the perimeter of Southwind Port since long before I met them), and you can easily pay for your premium time with referrals or in game money. Take an afternoon of chopping bricks and you can make those 10 silver easy.

 

I can't think of any other model I rather see WO having. Cheaper premium costs would mean no money left for development and will be the death of the game. Unless they start some micro transaction system. Would you be okay with the devs selling pickaxes that take no damage, like GW2 does? Perhaps stacks of oak logs? Or do you think they will get rich with little dresses and pretty barding for the mounts, given how sophisticated the WO art is?

 

Careful what you wish for. 

I have to fact check you here unfortunately. GW2 releases free living story updates all you need to do is simply login during the promotional time to get it unlocked for free (I do this and haven't paid once for them). The only expansion released to date was Heart of Thorns which is simply optional content. ESO premium system is extremely optional and they also give you 1500 Crowns to spend on cosmetic or upgrades to your account which again totally optional, personally if you play it a lot it's the cheaper option because of the Crown stipend. The only real perk from ESO is the crafting bag which is amazing if you are a excessive looter. 

 

WO isn't cheap by any means, each alt cost 8 euro, do you have any priests? I do it's quite expensive. Other games such as WoW or FFXIV charge 15$ a month for there services cheaper if you buy months ahead however those games give you multiple characters per account. This is something a lot of people want in WO, the ability to have alt which is free with your premium. The fact is we get totally taken advantage of when our updates are pushed to WU a lot of people do not see any point to pay for this game currently. There really isn't anything special about WO either, unless you count the RMT which is unique I suppose. 

 

I do think it's time to adopt other systems. Such as adding a cosmetic item shop that has HATS, clothing, allowing name changes, gender changes, maybe even premium game systems like riding a dragon and flying, and maybe even stronger sleep powders? Not only would more people be willing to play but it will deter account sales. This is one of the major issues in the WO that is honestly the cancer that keeps spreading. I can tell you for certain it wouldn't be as bad. It could help the economy in other ways and jump start Code Club into a more profitable future which could equal better staff coverage, better updates, more QoL. 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Niki said:

I have to fact check you here unfortunately. GW2 releases free living story updates all you need to do is simply login during the promotional time to get it unlocked for free (I do this and haven't paid once for them). The only expansion released to date was Heart of Thorns which is simply optional content. ESO premium system is extremely optional and they also give you 1500 Crowns to spend on cosmetic or upgrades to your account which again totally optional, personally if you play it a lot it's the cheaper option because of the Crown stipend. The only real perk from ESO is the crafting bag which is amazing if you are a excessive looter. 

 

WO isn't cheap by any means, each alt cost 8 euro, do you have any priests? I do it's quite expensive. Other games such as WoW or FFXIV charge 15$ a month for there services cheaper if you buy months ahead however those games give you multiple characters per account. This is something a lot of people want in WO, the ability to have alt which is free with your premium. The fact is we get totally taken advantage of when our updates are pushed to WU a lot of people do not see any point to pay for this game currently. There really isn't anything special about WO either, unless you count the RMT which is unique I suppose. 

 

I do think it's time to adopt other systems. Such as adding a cosmetic item shop that has HATS, clothing, allowing name changes, gender changes, maybe even premium game systems like riding a dragon and flying, and maybe even stronger sleep powders? Not only would more people be willing to play but it will deter account sales. This is one of the major issues in the WO that is honestly the cancer that keeps spreading. I can tell you for certain it wouldn't be as bad. It could help the economy in other ways and jump start Code Club into a more profitable future which could equal better staff coverage, better updates, more QoL. 

 

 

You are right. They let you create alts, but you cannot log them in at the same time as your main, which you can do in WO. Depending on the reasons to have them, it can be a boon or a bane. You wouldn't be allowed to work your channeling on your priest at the same time you are working on your deed with your main, so if this is something you want to do, then it's a moot point.

 

So to me that is a mixed bag. I never make alts in the same account in other games unless I want them for storage, etc, which in WO you can simply get with free accounts. The option of playing completely for free here is a reality though, it just requires a bit of work on the players part. I am all up for cosmetic microtransactions, but the moment they start to sell game changing items (indestructible pickaxes, crafting materials bundles, unique mounts) it's the moment the game will finally die. Our community is a community that thrives on commerce, and anything that interferes with that is going to cause major strife.

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2 hours ago, Niki said:

I have to fact check you here unfortunately. GW2 releases free living story updates all you need to do is simply login during the promotional time to get it unlocked for free (I do this and haven't paid once for them). The only expansion released to date was Heart of Thorns which is simply optional content. ESO premium system is extremely optional and they also give you 1500 Crowns to spend on cosmetic or upgrades to your account which again totally optional, personally if you play it a lot it's the cheaper option because of the Crown stipend. The only real perk from ESO is the crafting bag which is amazing if you are a excessive looter. 

 

WO isn't cheap by any means, each alt cost 8 euro, do you have any priests? I do it's quite expensive. Other games such as WoW or FFXIV charge 15$ a month for there services cheaper if you buy months ahead however those games give you multiple characters per account. This is something a lot of people want in WO, the ability to have alt which is free with your premium. The fact is we get totally taken advantage of when our updates are pushed to WU a lot of people do not see any point to pay for this game currently. There really isn't anything special about WO either, unless you count the RMT which is unique I suppose. 

 

I do think it's time to adopt other systems. Such as adding a cosmetic item shop that has HATS, clothing, allowing name changes, gender changes, maybe even premium game systems like riding a dragon and flying, and maybe even stronger sleep powders? Not only would more people be willing to play but it will deter account sales. This is one of the major issues in the WO that is honestly the cancer that keeps spreading. I can tell you for certain it wouldn't be as bad. It could help the economy in other ways and jump start Code Club into a more profitable future which could equal better staff coverage, better updates, more QoL. 

 

 

I am 100% name and sex changes but special clothing? ability to fly? dragon mounts? mmmm no. This game is all about crafting, commerce, reputation, and interacting with a community not buying things from a traditional cash shop. Now in regards to games like FFXIV they can put things on cash shop the way they do because it is a tier system. Nothing in the game means anything. Every content patch your ilv goes up and you have to get the new gear from dungeons. Crafting in the game is a joke as well and acts like raiding gear. New content patch? Okay crafters you need a whole new set of gear to make crafted raiding gear. Crafted raiding gear is only bought by medium/hardcore raiders and is unless in 4-6weeks. Mounts and gear they sell from the Mog Station is 100% cosmetic, no speed bonus, no extra flying (since you get access to mounts/flying mounts via the main story). 50% of the cosmetic stuff in the cash shop is from past events and then they sell it on Mog Station for 10$ after a year or so has gone by. Again they can do cosmetic stuff because again nothing matters in the game crafting, dungeons, nothing... in game currency matters even less... I think I have 200M that I can't do anything with. Houses used to be worth something but their poor strategy of only releasing only about  500  a time when people can get 7 extra characters by paying an extra 2$? a month means all the houses are gone in about 3mins after servers come up. And now SE has put a stop to selling of houses by warning/banning those that do sell... Everything is outdated in a few months and they need something to keep people interested so they do not quit and have another FFXIV 1.0 failure like they did 7 years ago. (end of FFXIV rant)

 

Point is WOW/FFXIV where they are on a tier system =/= the way Wurm should do things. If Wurm did that the game more than likely have a smaller population than it does now.

 

However, with that all being said IF they added things like name/sex change it should be bought directly from Code Club AB it should not be from in game means. I wouldn't be against but I also would not be in support of some type of "glamour" system. Such as making a piece of equipment look invisible...a helm so it looks like you aren't wearing it or (cringes) makes armor look like something else... like my great helm looking like a brown bear helm. To "glamour" an item should be through Code Club AB and no extra random outfits.

 

^Would keep the community from losing their income. Wouldn't give anyone advantages or access to special gear over anyone else. And would give Code Club AB another form of income and possibility create new/bring back people to the game for silly cosmetic reasons (I know so many people that came back and continue to play FFXIV because glamour system was launched... glamour is the true end-game.).  

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56 minutes ago, nicedreams said:
Spoiler

 

What gives anyone the right to disrespect a leader of the Wurm community and demand anything.  It's always people that have no business experience and have never ran a profitable business that demand the most and know the most about business it seems.

 

Thing that got on my nerves is you called Netflix for a marketing forecast, a huge corporation with a HUGE marketing department with hundreds of employees and corporate shares and forecasting they have to do to make millions.  Then you complain about Wurm not doing the same thing with giving you a marketing forecast.  LMAO!  That's such a great way to compare the businesses.

 

Go ask the family pizza shop down the street to give you a marketing forecast and tell them to go advertise because you like their shop.  Wurm is pretty much a local town pizza shop or family deli and this is what we get.

 

FYI.....Marketing is not cheap and this is not a game that can retain a lot of people.  Most people want flashy, pretty characters and not standing in front of an f'ing forge most of the day.

 

 

 

Wurm community has a leader?  I must have missed that memo... who is this illustrious leader you speak of?

 

Two pizza shops I've been to come to mind.

In one, owner was always in a bad mood.  No doubt I'd just get begrudged attitude if I had ever asked him anything about his business.  He was a doofus who happened to make pretty good pizza in a town with few options.  The moment there's an alternative, doofus is out of business.

 

In another, I have no idea what mood the owner was in, to be honest.  I just know he was always nice to his customers.  Always thanked everyone for coming in, whether he knew them or not.  I wouldn't hesitate to approach him with a question about his business, or his plans.  No doubt at all I'd get a straight up answer and even if it isn't what I was hoping to hear, I'd walk away satisfied.  I don't live in that town anymore, but I'll always be a loyal customer.

 

The straight shooter who isn't hiding anything behind pretense is the one you want to do business with, not the shifty guy that can't give you a sensible answer and claims to be above question.

 

Oh, and yeah, I'm a member of this community, and ain't nobody leading me.

 

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On 2/24/2017 at 11:04 AM, Brash_Endeavors said:

.  

 

Shortly before the 2013 price increase, WO had a paid subscriber base of almost 6500 people each month

 

 

 

On 2/24/2017 at 0:50 PM, Etherdrifter said:

 

 

Brash_Endevors elucidates the real issue above; the player explosion dropped off once prices went up.  People vote with their wallets, and WO is asking a lot; most folks admit you need 2+ premium toons + a deed (very few folks run microdeeds, its "giant horse farm" or nothing). 

 

Drop the price of premium, or move to a "premium = convenience" model and you might be onto something.  But, of course, that will never happen.

 

i agree that a lower price model will help increase the population in wurm....on both models.            please lower prices and bring the player base back to historic numbers .. we can do this =)

 

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Buy one premium fee, get two premium chars would be a great option. 

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1 hour ago, Sirene said:

Buy one premium fee, get two premium chars would be a great option. 

 

Maybe as a special promotional event, but not as a rule in my opinion. I have no problem buying premium for all my toons because I support the game I love.

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