bloodmaster

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I think we've gone a bit off topic with Rhianna's message. Please can we keep it on topic on wooden rings. +1 because why not

What does this actually mean? Is it line of sight from the top or bottom? Is it using archery mechanics e.g. Are they not able to shoot over tall walls/buildings and/or shoot through windows?

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With the new year coming up, why not come join the newest kingdom on Chaos. With a bunch of experience players with the accounts to supply you with all you need to craft, build and fight. Come learn from us sharing tips and tricks for all to do with Wurm. Sign up today and come be apart of something being built from the ground up today! http://www.wurmuniversity.com/f2-applications

+1 It does take forever to disband a deed. This stops the tediousness of draining a deed as it will be quicker to disband a deed that is not defended well enough to stop drains and prevents the whole keep dumping in money as if you want to do that, it will get very expensive to do so.

+1 to the longer logout timer. The shortness of Chaos' timer right now is silly when trying to break into a deed and the player can just log out really safely with all their loot.

Tfw 4 is more than 4... Plus as I said before, if you can wall someone in for some time, you can plan to get in and have the advantage where the defenders usually do. If the pvp ban hadn't come in for you to get out, there would have been some form of pvp by either a rescue team or you having to log in.

It's called wall them in so the attackers have a chance to make tactics of their own. When we did it last, we planned to get into their mine through a mine of our own (which worked). That way the attackers can get pvp by keeping the defenders in one spot. Right now as a defender you can bash out in like a minute due to the bash bonus and numbers. Should be much harder to escape but not impossible. That way both sides have some form of counterplay to the opposite side.

Last night JK trapped a group of 6 enemy players in a mine after they tried to cap our tower. They are still stuck there. Do you really want to join a kingdom where you have the two options of not logging on for days to play or logging in to die swiftly? Didn't think so. Join the kingdom that will put our enemies in that impossible choice situation. Join JK today! http://www.kyara.us/

Join a Kingdom who existed before MR was ever formed!

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Join now to be apart of the fun times ahead. The enemy kingdoms won't know what hits them when these plans execute, you won't want to be on the opposition when it all goes down. The only way to be apart of it is to join up though. http://www.kyara.us/index.php

So does forcing people to come defend a deed that's being raided, the only difference is karma porting puts them in one of the safest places in local, the middle of a deed with defenses. It doesn't really form any pvp as the defenders stay inside a deed repairing away until the attackers get bored of a lack of pvp/ground gained. There is no way you can argue that having to be forced to run in open ground into a deed is less likely to make pvp happen than magically teleporting someone into the safety of a deed. There is no risk and every abuses it, not just one single kingdom. I would 100% prefer the 2nd option out of the two. As then at least when a formidable raid force turns up it can't outrepair them and it makes people come into local from the outside of the deed.

And what's the point of controlling it if you can't actually keep it as well. JK taking down the first of many MR deeds. Just adding to the positive list of recent achievements. [22:42:11] You find 39 copper and 69 iron in the coffers of Thirty Five Percent. [22:48:56] It is 04:13:21 on Wrath day in week 1 of the starfall of the Leaf in the year of 1060. [22:48:56] The settlement of Thirty Five Percent has just been disbanded. Do you want to be part of kingdom who gives up their deeds so easily? Or do you want to be part of JK who go on the offensive and partake in the fun aspects of pvp? http://www.kyara.us/

The devs were already looking into karma porting as it was a heavily talked about topic that pvpers discussed with Retro. I feel it's not the direction Rolf wanted Wurm to go when he removed suiciding to allied deeds years back. And I feel now it's probably not the direction it should stay as with karma being so readily available it is so cheap to do it and better than the old system as you can take your gear and not lose skills. I don't think the majority of games would class shooting a wall and repairing a wall as pvp and in my definition I would say it wasn't. Or at least if you claim it is, no one agrees that sitting there shooting a catapult or looking at a wall is the exciting part of pvp would they? So look at the karma cooldown as encouraging the more fun parts of pvp with hand to hand combat rather than sieging a deed for hours. And we all know 2 hours is very little in the grand scheme of raids, with an 8 hour trial it would make more sense as that is nearly one person's whole day playing. I would even argue 8 hours is a little short but that's not the suggestion on hand.

I think the arguments for the cooldown are literally the only logical arguments in this thread. It makes sense that if you can deal with it and have the infrastructure and it MR members have time and time again said they have that for all their deeds. So why should they need karma porting that they keep arguing for? I know in JK we do have all that infrastructure for our deeds and I could easily live without karma porting. I will tell you the two reasons we use it still 1. It's impossible to prevent the enemy from stopping you from getting into the deed which means it's incredibly safe and 2. It's quick. You could be literally anywhere on the server and be ready to teleport in and defend. There is no counter play to stop this and any mechanic with a lack of counter play is terrible game design and should be fixed. I will tell you one karma porting doesn't do and that is promote pvp. It just allows deeds to be scattered over the map, hundreds of tiles from anything, maybe even surrounded 360 degrees by enemy and still allow you to get inside them to defend. And how you could claim pvp comes from it when you are safely inside a deed which has gatehops, a dirt wall, minehops, reinforced mines and so on beats me. Pvp comes from people not being inside a safe structure and on the outside. The only way you will force this is by making someone ride into a deed and take a risk which brings opportunities for traps and counter traps hence pvp. This idea doesn't stop you from coming back to defend your village which you live at. It is fair and prevents you from defending a deed which you don't live at and is far from your home deed. If you argue you want to get to a deed to defend it and still want to live at your deed that is on the opposite side of the map then tough. You either live in your deed and run to the action or move to where it is happening.

Bump for a kingdom who hasn't only got shooting at a deed to brag about on their list of recent triumphs. Join a kingdom who has stuff like killing players (including a champion), getting atifacts, winning hota in an area surrounded by enemy deeds, killing unqiues and getting good loot like a scale set. Join JK and have something worthwhile to add to your achievements in Wurm! http://www.kyara.us/index.php

Lib gets it because you need to be HoTS to be Lib. But what I am saying is, you don't need to be a Lib follower to heal from mycellium, you can be any other god.

No, HoTS gets that. You could be a player god priest and still get that as HoTS template.

Ok well in that case, you should be fine with the change from what I gather then? You either don't need it so should be able to be fine with it as you even say here you have the infrastructure so you should be able to deal with this cooldown for karma'ing? Or you don't want it because you truely do rely on it even if only on certain deeds you have planted. You don't give any reason why you REALLY don't back it.

We're really not. You even claimed yourself JK used it more? We are taking it away from JK. We're willing to sacrifice that. Red has been saying that he wasn't happy with people in MR because they were pushing their agenda to keep MR ontop. He posted a suggestion thread to remove it I believe a few months back so I would believe that. Even your longstanding members agree that it's abused.

If you feel it's not a powerful tactic, why do people always use it on deeds they actually care about and have numbers to defend, why does your kingdom put such a huge emphasis on it being the only reason JK is still around on chaos and why are you so scared to allow a change like this to go through?

As a JK member I would love that. If it's MR using it the most then it proves our point of big kingdoms able to overextend deeds and use teleport to get in. That is why they would be so against it. However if JK use it the most it benefits MR to remove it as it allows them to not face as many defenders at a deed teleporting in and shows we are willing to give it up if we use it the most for the greater good of the game. Your point is?

I'd love people to turn up for chance of pvp. When they teleport into the middle of a safe deed instead of being forced to be out of the deed to get in, there is very little chance and it ends just being a repairer preventing pvp happening.